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It's Time For Change


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Obviously and unfortunately this is surmising but I think we need to review the overall care from set off to liberation with potential emphasis on Fridays’ condition within the respective transporters.

 

How was water provided? what was the temperature within the transporters during the days I,e do we have temperature readings for this , was anything done to cool the transports down (if necessary). Despite the heat through England last weekend there has been good racing from more modern transportation.

 

If all the that was possible was done to the best of the ability of the people in charge of the pigeons (and fanciers expectations) before the release then we have elsewhere to consider, For myself the SNFC has lost the ideology and aspirations of our own state of the art transporters, that in itself is fine so long as what we choose to transport with has water available on 3 sides of a crate, has the ability to cool down (I,e not just reverberated heat around the transporter)

 

The fact the birds seem reported in a number of places would possibly indicate dehydration was at play early on.

 

If it was up to me I would say what can we afford in terms of state of the art transporter and work backwards from there, In that it may be only possible to purchase a 1000 bird lorry as a result in such cases some races would need to be limited in birdage for a numbers for fanciers.

 

The hot weather was always going to cause a demanding race, the story of them appearing elsewhere and also a perceived lack of returns onwards (in terms of numbers) make me think It’s Friday we should really be concentrating upon as this is when we could do our side of the care bargain for the pigeons. Until we look after our pigeons and respect them as the little miracles they are we are not going to be held in high regard when trying to discuss other issues such as hawks etc. albeit I do take on Rebus comment re hawks, even if so all of the above stands.

 

As always there are pigeons in good time and they deserve full credit and praise also there is a simple fact that after 8 plus hours of flying pigeons do start to drop out (in terms of racing) but it's not as simple in this instance as saying well some made it others should too.

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When I was secretary of South Lanarkshire Fed. I issued the convoyer with a thermometer which took readings inside and outside and he put them on his report weekly at that time we used the wicker baskets and the readings were always lower inside than outside even on the warmest of days,I don't think any readings are taken now.

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Not enough for the SNFC Tommy. 19 pigeons to a crate, 50 crates, just under 1000 pigeons. We never reach that many though, only around 700 at maximum. :)

andy that is big enough for one race anyway always a option many people are fooled thinking lanarkshire fed transporters are state off the art far from it as a club we are looking tae improve the air flow into the baskets

when you get a transporter designed dont use a taxi driver :emoticon-0127-lipssealed: :emoticon-0127-lipssealed: :emoticon-0127-lipssealed:

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Obviously and unfortunately this is surmising but I think we need to review the overall care from set off to liberation with potential emphasis on Fridays’ condition within the respective transporters.

 

How was water provided? what was the temperature within the transporters during the days I,e do we have temperature readings for this , was anything done to cool the transports down (if necessary). Despite the heat through England last weekend there has been good racing from more modern transportation.

 

If all the that was possible was done to the best of the ability of the people in charge of the pigeons (and fanciers expectations) before the release then we have elsewhere to consider, For myself the SNFC has lost the ideology and aspirations of our own state of the art transporters, that in itself is fine so long as what we choose to transport with has water available on 3 sides of a crate, has the ability to cool down (I,e not just reverberated heat around the transporter)

 

The fact the birds seem reported in a number of places would possibly indicate dehydration was at play early on.

 

If it was up to me I would say what can we afford in terms of state of the art transporter and work backwards from there, In that it may be only possible to purchase a 1000 bird lorry as a result in such cases some races would need to be limited in birdage for a numbers for fanciers.

 

The hot weather was always going to cause a demanding race, the story of them appearing elsewhere and also a perceived lack of returns onwards (in terms of numbers) make me think It’s Friday we should really be concentrating upon as this is when we could do our side of the care bargain for the pigeons. Until we look after our pigeons and respect them as the little miracles they are we are not going to be held in high regard when trying to discuss other issues such as hawks etc. albeit I do take on Rebus comment re hawks, even if so all of the above stands.

 

As always there are pigeons in good time and they deserve full credit and praise also there is a simple fact that after 8 plus hours of flying pigeons do start to drop out (in terms of racing) but it's not as simple in this instance as saying well some made it others should too.

 

 

Well done Glen on thinking about the birds but others are not on the same planet as you

 

High / low thermometers are cheap

Video cameras are cheap

Tracking facility is cheap

 

But will we use it no chance it might prove something !!

 

I have said for years the Unions could help if they made above compulsory for all transporters

But why should we have to wait on the Unions acting we should be shouting for it ourselves but we won't until something happens which we do not like then we start grumping

 

How many Fed transporters have?:

 

High / Low temperature units in use

How many have three sided drinkers

How many have any sort of air conditioning

How many have trackers fitted

How many have video cameras fitted

 

So we don't want them on our Fed transporters but when something goes wrong we want the National to supply them (which they should)

 

But lets get our house in order and start at home then they might listen at National level and Union level

 

Oh and how many transporters in Scotland comply with DEFRA rules

 

Time DEFRA flexed it's muscles and made us look at what we should be doing as per the law on the transport of livestock

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Was it not the Lanarkshire so called state of the art transporters that gave us the Carentan debacle a couple of years ago

Jock you and I both know that you can have a bad race out of any transporter, Including Lanarkshires, but the SNFC have also given us a few Debacles recently out of the transporters they use, for instance Reims only last season and then this race on Saturday from Bedhampton

 

Like you at one time I was all for wicker baskets and shavings but having watched the birds drinking in the Geraldy crates I've changed my mind, we must give the birds every opportunity to be liberated as fit and well as possible so they are able to face the race in front of them, I hate to say it but the SNFC could learn a thing or two from the so called wee national, you only have to look at their races in comparison to ours IMO

 

I agree it's time for change

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After Saturday's disaster,we need to try and eliminate the possible causes of what happened,heat ,dehydration ,bops ,k index, all posibilities but for the so called best club in the land to be using ,second class transporters I'm sorry but that's not good enough,especially when there's new upto date transporters available.lets put the birds welfare first and see where we go. I've no axe to grind as we hadn't any birds away but give the birds a chance by giving them the best transport.

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Jock you and I both know that you can have a bad race out of any transporter, Including Lanarkshires, but the SNFC have also given us a few Debacles recently out of the transporters they use, for instance Reims only last season and then this race on Saturday from Bedhampton

 

Like you at one time I was all for wicker baskets and shavings but having watched the birds drinking in the Geraldy crates I've changed my mind, we must give the birds every opportunity to be liberated as fit and well as possible so they are able to face the race in front of them, I hate to say it but the SNFC could learn a thing or two from the so called wee national, you only have to look at their races in comparison to ours IMO

 

I agree it's time for change

Good honest post

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After Saturday's disaster,we need to try and eliminate the possible causes of what happened,heat ,dehydration ,bops ,k index, all posibilities but for the so called best club in the land to be using ,second class transporters I'm sorry but that's not good enough,especially when there's new upto date transporters available.lets put the birds welfare first and see where we go. I've no axe to grind as we hadn't any birds away but give the birds a chance by giving them the best transport.

 

 

The welfare of the pigeons must

Be paramount end off .

I AGREE WITH YOU 100 PERCENT

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Well done Glen on thinking about the birds but others are not on the same planet as you

 

High / low thermometers are cheap

Video cameras are cheap

Tracking facility is cheap

 

But will we use it no chance it might prove something !!

 

I have said for years the Unions could help if they made above compulsory for all transporters

But why should we have to wait on the Unions acting we should be shouting for it ourselves but we won't until something happens which we do not like then we start grumping

 

How many Fed transporters have?:

 

High / Low temperature units in use

How many have three sided drinkers

How many have any sort of air conditioning

How many have trackers fitted

How many have video cameras fitted

 

So we don't want them on our Fed transporters but when something goes wrong we want the National to supply them (which they should)

 

But lets get our house in order and start at home then they might listen at National level and Union level

 

Oh and how many transporters in Scotland comply with DEFRA rules

 

Time DEFRA flexed it's muscles and made us look at what we should be doing as per the law on the transport of livestock

Well said Ian, even a video of the lib would be a start, or video of the pigeons drinking from crates on arrival at race site, would at least answer some of these questions.

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Just my opinion ,I feel the birds are being cared for to a very high standard

They are returning home in the same condition as they are sent

the cocks that were home in good time Saturday flew for an hour plus this morning and longer tonight as fresh as paint

My Bugbear is and has been for years Numbers in baskets

What the difference 20 sitting in high temperatures in France

And 22 having to sit in the same high temperatures in England

Crazy Crazy Rules passed by Pigeon Men

The absolute fortunes we spend on pigeons and we fail miserably with the basics

Whether it be inland or channel the rule should be 16 max

If it costs a £1 more so be it ,anyone with a gripe with that give them up

By Law water should have to be provided on three sides ,the same would apply to feeding

I'll gladly put a proposal in for 16 max if someone is willing to second it

The convoyers are doing a wonderful job its not their fault if birds cant access water because of numbers

As I stated just my democratic opinion

Atb Mick

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Jock you and I both know that you can have a bad race out of any transporter, Including Lanarkshires, but the SNFC have also given us a few Debacles recently out of the transporters they use, for instance Reims only last season and then this race on Saturday from Bedhampton

 

Like you at one time I was all for wicker baskets and shavings but having watched the birds drinking in the Geraldy crates I've changed my mind, we must give the birds every opportunity to be liberated as fit and well as possible so they are able to face the race in front of them, I hate to say it but the SNFC could learn a thing or two from the so called wee national, you only have to look at their races in comparison to ours IMO

 

I agree it's time for change

Aye Davie you are entitled to your opinion but I don't think you can blame the transporter for the Reims race I think that was down to low cloud at the racepoint,and I don't see a problem with the birds drinking from the wicker baskets as I have also witnessed them drinking freely in the transporters and marking stations. With regard to bad races most are down error of judgment to put it politely IMO.

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Just my opinion ,I feel the birds are being cared for to a very high standard

They are returning home in the same condition as they are sent

the cocks that were home in good time Saturday flew for an hour plus this morning and longer tonight as fresh as paint

My Bugbear is and has been for years Numbers in baskets

What the difference 20 sitting in high temperatures in France

And 22 having to sit in the same high temperatures in England

Crazy Crazy Rules passed by Pigeon Men

The absolute fortunes we spend on pigeons and we fail miserably with the basics

Whether it be inland or channel the rule should be 16 max

If it costs a £1 more so be it ,anyone with a gripe with that give them up

By Law water should have to be provided on three sides ,the same would apply to feeding

I'll gladly put a proposal in for 16 max if someone is willing to second it

The convoyers are doing a wonderful job its not their fault if birds cant access water because of numbers

As I stated just my democratic opinion

Atb Mick

thats a start mick i would second that :drinking-coffee-200:

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When I was secretary of South Lanarkshire Fed. I issued the convoyer with a thermometer which took readings inside and outside and he put them on his report weekly at that time we used the wicker baskets and the readings were always lower inside than outside even on the warmest of days,I don't think any readings are taken now.

When I was working I borrowed data loggers, which recorded every minute and used it a couple of times. I could tell you when the driver stopped for his supper and when he arrived at race point, as the temperature increased drastically. I believe even with the Geraldys against wicker baskets there would be no difference in heat within the baskets /crates when the the transporter stops. Yes with the newer crates in Geraldy there is 3sides for drinking, but look at the NFC And the Midland National over the last few weeks they have also suffered bad races and that's with Geraldy and similar designs. I personally believe it's a combination of radars from the major airports down that side of the country and the knowing fact of the huge Perigrine population around that area . It's a known fact at between 5am and 6 am planes are stacking up waiting to land at 6am at Gatwick and Heathrow as that's the earliest they are aloud to land .What ever happened on Saturday had very soon after liberation

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Just my opinion ,I feel the birds are being cared for to a very high standard

They are returning home in the same condition as they are sent

the cocks that were home in good time Saturday flew for an hour plus this morning and longer tonight as fresh as paint

My Bugbear is and has been for years Numbers in baskets

What the difference 20 sitting in high temperatures in France

And 22 having to sit in the same high temperatures in England

Crazy Crazy Rules passed by Pigeon Men

The absolute fortunes we spend on pigeons and we fail miserably with the basics

Whether it be inland or channel the rule should be 16 max

If it costs a £1 more so be it ,anyone with a gripe with that give them up

By Law water should have to be provided on three sides ,the same would apply to feeding

I'll gladly put a proposal in for 16 max if someone is willing to second it

The convoyers are doing a wonderful job its not their fault if birds cant access water because of numbers

As I stated just my democratic opinion

Atb Mick

Well said mick

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Aye Davie you are entitled to your opinion but I don't think you can blame the transporter for the Reims race I think that was down to low cloud at the racepoint,and I don't see a problem with the birds drinking from the wicker baskets as I have also witnessed them drinking freely in the transporters and marking stations. With regard to bad races most are down error of judgment to put it politely IMO.

Jock, likewise, I don't think it's fair to blame the transporter for the bad race Lanarkshire had from Carentan, there were a lot of contributing factors to that also putting it politely

 

Regards Reims last year I think it's plain to see which Nat had the better race that day where for me that could be down to the transporter

:emoticon-0138-thinking::unsure:

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Jock, likewise, I don't think it's fair to blame the transporter for the bad race Lanarkshire had from Carentan, there were a lot of contributing factors to that also putting it politely

 

Regards Reims last year I think it's plain to see which Nat had the better race that day where for me that could be down to the transporter

:emoticon-0138-thinking::unsure:

davy it will be time in basket as snrpc use the channel tunnel and spend less time in the basket :drinking-coffee-200:

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Jock, likewise, I don't think it's fair to blame the transporter for the bad race Lanarkshire had from Carentan, there were a lot of contributing factors to that also putting it politely

 

Regards Reims last year I think it's plain to see which Nat had the better race that day where for me that could be down to the transporter

:emoticon-0138-thinking::unsure:

Aye Davie blame the National transporter but don't dare blame the Lanarkshire one. I'm with the wicker baskets and I hate to see birds in these tin cans JMO.

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Obviously and unfortunately this is surmising but I think we need to review the overall care from set off to liberation with potential emphasis on Fridays’ condition within the respective transporters.

 

How was water provided? what was the temperature within the transporters during the days I,e do we have temperature readings for this , was anything done to cool the transports down (if necessary). Despite the heat through England last weekend there has been good racing from more modern transportation.

 

If all the that was possible was done to the best of the ability of the people in charge of the pigeons (and fanciers expectations) before the release then we have elsewhere to consider, For myself the SNFC has lost the ideology and aspirations of our own state of the art transporters, that in itself is fine so long as what we choose to transport with has water available on 3 sides of a crate, has the ability to cool down (I,e not just reverberated heat around the transporter)

 

The fact the birds seem reported in a number of places would possibly indicate dehydration was at play early on.

 

If it was up to me I would say what can we afford in terms of state of the art transporter and work backwards from there, In that it may be only possible to purchase a 1000 bird lorry as a result in such cases some races would need to be limited in birdage for a numbers for fanciers.

 

The hot weather was always going to cause a demanding race, the story of them appearing elsewhere and also a perceived lack of returns onwards (in terms of numbers) make me think It’s Friday we should really be concentrating upon as this is when we could do our side of the care bargain for the pigeons. Until we look after our pigeons and respect them as the little miracles they are we are not going to be held in high regard when trying to discuss other issues such as hawks etc. albeit I do take on Rebus comment re hawks, even if so all of the above stands.

 

As always there are pigeons in good time and they deserve full credit and praise also there is a simple fact that after 8 plus hours of flying pigeons do start to drop out (in terms of racing) but it's not as simple in this instance as saying well some made it others should too.

well said glen
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