Roland

Great ... wish I was able to do that still .... Not that I would, but would be lovely to be able to lol Good luck mate, hope it goes well. I had enough 3 years back shifting tons of sand, gravel, concrete etc. etc. Though to be perfectly honest A. I am glad I did NOW and B. Know I wouldn't again

Thanks Ian ... give .... No send it to my favourite charity! I'll email my address later :emoticon-0136-giggle:

Agreed regards Elton and the Beatles. Slade and Quiet Riot for commercial rock I'd say.

I see Jack is carrying his dosh around in a carrier bag lol ... Frightened of pick pockets I guess lol :emoticon-0136-giggle:

And yet Ovy1255 his loft excels eh! Who says / proves that worms are all bad? Not talking about guts swamped with them of course. But a balanced thing. Can't recall the in and outs of a book I read stating the benefits of worms in the guts. But as I recall not altogether a bad thing.

Agreed 100% ovy1255Â that only healthy birds win races. Yet the fact remains that contrary to any birds mentioned above, one doesn't need to treat their' birds, because it certainly doesn't mean that they aren't fit and ready to race. They in fact don't look or feel anything like the ones you state. - Having said that Sam's birds often did look like that ... Some members want to refuse to them being even sent (old birds) and yet they excelled. So as chairman I had to decide on a grizzle once that looked and felt like that. Had gone every race and caused a bit of palaver. The consensus was in the end it went Bergerac ... and won. There is obviously the odd case, but in the main you are right ovy1255Â about any bird looking or handling like that. Mine don't, and they aren't treated very often. Indeed I'd say that over 90% of the birds in my loft have never been treated for any thing .... But look and handle first class. indeed often they are sent first time in the basket over 150 - 200 miles with credit. I also think that many fancier constantly look for a ailment / reason to medicate etc.

Well ovy1255Â that is why one needn't treat. ALL pigeons carry some canker.... one that stops any other strain from taking an effect or getting a hold. How shall I put, other than of the top of my head, I'd liken it to sperm put in a woman. Millions etc. YET one only mostly grows to be a baby because one - or two destroy the other sperm. Likewise with canker.

Dal12 BUT all pigeons must, AND DO carry a canker. Even if a mild form only, it is needed. Once cleared they very quickly get canker again. So via treating every year, whether or not needed, it will and does strengthen the immunity against the treatment. My birds had to do 3 or more of the longest used races .. 2 either North or South and 1 at least the other way. Won Bergerac ... first 3 with only day birds, and a fort night later won Thurso with the same winner. Other two went Lerwick or Frazerburgh. Never, ever treated.

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I think that they would feel sorry for me and probably put a few quiddies in my pockets lol

Any I think Al the saying is 'If you haven't got it, why treat it. I know, hope, that all my pigeon have it! Of course just the one. Hence I won't have of get other strains. But once you weaken the first strain, then others that come along, soon you WILL have canker problem. So the pigeons tell me, you and ALL if they need to have treatment for any thing. So in that case all and anyone will / should seek help or take action. If not broken how can one fix it? I, we don't really see fit and healthy pigeons it would appear. We expect and know it for if an ailment shows up, then we sort out what and how. Can't honestly remember when I treated for canker, or much else for that matter..

Seldom if ever. But due to treatment canker often runs rife. The fact is that they need a canker. This keeps other cankers away. There are 32 or more cankers, so which one are you treating for? Oh I know a wide spectrum. But then Canker is one of the best at getting immune to treatment, hence one should never use the same one more than twice at most. So very many deep rooted cankers take one hell of job to shift and is very often thought to be Y/B's.

They won't, they are scots and canny. Famous for the Cannae give you this, nor cannae I lend or spend, and canny you bog off lol

Unrivalled. Born a charsomatic genius.

I think that that is wise John.

https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/salmonella-guidance-data-and-analysis I found the add on parts very interesting too Now if they have found a cure em-block GREAT!

https://www.cdc.gov/salmonella/general/diagnosis.html  Learn more about the importance of serotyping and CDC’s Salmonella Atlas, the first-of-its-kind report that charts over 40 years of laboratory-confirmed surveillance data on 32 Salmonella serotypes. So one drop of whatever has a broad spectrum to cure all. ETC. ETC. Good read all.

University of Texas just announced they have made a vaccine for Salmonella. Not yet commercially available. Also ... Apparently Henk DeWeerd developed a probiotic mix (Para Control Boost) that is as good, if not better, than vaccination against Salmonella. That is if I read it right and that would fit with the experiment done many years ago in Munich. There some scientists measured the antibody titre against salmonella in racing pigeons and the common street pigeons. Then it was the racing pigeons that had high titres of antibodies against salmonella much more often than the common street pigeons. This is taken as evidence that racing pigeons are much more often infected with salmonella than street pigeons who may be protected by a much more robust intestinal microbiome. After all their keeper is not likely to mix antibiotics into their drinking water thereby destroying parts of this biome. Taken from the Alberta Classic.

Well done Red chequer. Ok a little extra work, but abiding by the rules A. means no come backs, and B. shows that we can all abide by the rules with no great hardships.

Well mate, soon, indeed very soon indeed, you won't know how you fitted 'Work' in you'll be so busy.... No time to be bore, no money to waste lol. But tightening the belt around the money belt will most likely mean the pigeons will prosper. Good luck in getting back to work soon mate.

Advice from DEFRA on Shows and Sales “As you are aware, the gathering of birds for a sale or show is permitted under the specific terms and conditions of a Defra General Licence. In the light of the current risk of avian influenza (Bird flu), on 20th December 2016, the terms of the General Licence were amended to ban the gathering of poultry including chicken, geese, ducks, pheasants, turkeys and guinea fowl – they are not permitted under the amended general licence. However, pigeons and cage birds e.g. canaries, budgies and finches, are considered lower risk, therefore gatherings of these birds are currently still permitted, providing the terms of the General Licence are adhered to. PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS SITUATION MIGHT CHANGE The General Licence and information about it can be viewed at: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/bird-gatherings-licences Nowt about 'Letting them out' Just about Shows etc.

Don't thionk it will be around long enough to race out ... Maybe 1 or 2 races lol :emoticon-0127-lipssealed:

I believe it will, hope, that the show will go on. Having said that, I do hope that we ALL adhere to Dafra and keep our birds in. Dafra DO class our pigeons still as poultry, and have refused to change this after many years of our governing bodies to alter this. .... Mind having said that, it would appear now 'Loosely' as such. It's Joe Public' in their ignorance that can't, accept that our Pigeons don't get the Avian Flu ... to them they are just birds - or via some stupid ones vermin ( In the town centres. So WE and Dafra need to play ball and not upset Joe. Now CATS, for example, DO and are affected via the Avian flu, but I have never seen any attempt, let alone order, for them to be kept in lol A little way to go for racing yet I feel and don't see any reason to cause any unnecessary upsets. So let's suck the dummy and keep the rattle in the pram eh!

I think John Quinn is a fake name lol :emoticon-0127-lipssealed:

What a good and realistic and truthful post! I agree 100%. Indeed just what is the problem? They can't harm or do anything untoward! Many have actually become members .... But looking at such topics as this one can hardly wonder why they stay anonymous! Indeed such post are a major problem. And it can only be 100% to the good.