Y/b's Sickness Started

[Roland]

Aye George that's another cause of immune deficiency that leaves the Doos open tae Every bug gawn aboot. They'll still be pumping them full of anti's despite all advice to the contrary !!

 

How true, good, realistic and common sense post that. ...

I often spout such on here.

Birds must be helped sometimes, no doubt and obviously ... BUT most importantly allowed as and when possible to build up it's own immunity.

[aye ready]

Can also state categorically that I haven't had yb sickness in my lofts Ever.

 

I vaccinate at 20-22 days old in the nest, though wither that helps or not I couldn't guess.

 

Personally I think it's because I keep them exposed to disease from birth and they're immune system can now handle it.

 

I used to get them going light every year and was disposing of Ybs that went this way but this year I disposed of 1 (ONE) Yb that went 'off' and that particular bird had been handled umpteen times at a B/B sale the day before it showed signs of illness. I reckoned that it was stress as it was only 26 days old at the time, but that's a guess because I cannot prove it.

Next year I expect to be in a position that not even 1 will have to go because there will only be 1 or 2 being introduced this winter and they will have to stand up to being in a rough environment before being paired up.

IMO it is down to mismanagement over a long period of years. Guys who get it every year still keep doing the same things year on year and wonder how they keep getting it, the first sign of Madness is doing the same thing over and over again and Expect different results. They're gonna keep getting it until they change their ways, but I fear like all other things to do with the sport, it'll be everyone else's fault that Some fanciers get it.

Canny see how it's down to mismanagement John even the best fanciers in the British Isles get it I.e mark Gilbert,mr Mrs cooper to name a couple and Bert braspenning out width the uk who openly admits getting it every year, who in turn has a great relationship with dr van der sluis so if these 3 fanciers canny avoid it with their resources then whit chance have we got and ps I invite anybody tae come round tae mine and see if ma doos are mismanaged that Comment I take exception tae

[dal2]

Canny see how it's down to mismanagement John even the best fanciers in the British Isles get it I.e mark Gilbert,mr Mrs cooper to name a couple and Bert braspenning out width the uk who openly admits getting it every year, who in turn has a great relationship with dr van der sluis so if these 3 fanciers canny avoid it with their resources then whit chance have we got and ps I invite anybody tae come round tae mine and see if ma doos are mismanaged that Comment I take exception tae

Maybe it's no the good fliers and what they do that's the answer and I agree with you 100% on the mismanagement

[Ian McKay]

Have moved the survey to another post

 

 

I apologise to Roland for high jacking his post

 

Ian

[THE FIFER]

Have moved the survey to another post

 

 

I apologise to Roland for high jacking his post

 

Ian

 

http://forum.pigeonbasics.com/topic/89667-young-bird-sickness-survey/

[JohnQuinn]

Canny see how it's down to mismanagement John even the best fanciers in the British Isles get it I.e mark Gilbert,mr Mrs cooper to name a couple and Bert braspenning out width the uk who openly admits getting it every year, who in turn has a great relationship with dr van der sluis so if these 3 fanciers canny avoid it with their resources then whit chance have we got and ps I invite anybody tae come round tae mine and see if ma doos are mismanaged that Comment I take exception tae

 

A didnae write it tae coz offence but it's interesting you mention Braspenning being friends with the vet. Have seen with my own eyes the amount of medication the average guy on the continent uses tae keep their Doos sound. Ye canny keep giving them medication tae get them racing coz the long term outcome is repeated sickness in yer birds, the fact he admits it doesn't surprise me either because they accept it as part and parcel of keeping doos.

 

I don't know if you use antibiotics regularly or not but I would be very interested tae know what measures you took or what you done differently the year following it being in your loft to prevent its return.

[frank-123]

A didnae write it tae coz offence but it's interesting you mention Braspenning being friends with the vet. Have seen with my own eyes the amount of medication the average guy on the continent uses tae keep their Doos sound. Ye canny keep giving them medication tae get them racing coz the long term outcome is repeated sickness in yer birds, the fact he admits it doesn't surprise me either because they accept it as part and parcel of keeping doos.

 

I don't know if you use antibiotics regularly or not but I would be very interested tae know what measures you took or what you done differently the year following it being in your loft to prevent its return.

 

I am sure John Bosworth treats his pigeons every week leading up to the big races. Heard him say it on a panel one time. His record is not too bad wonder if he get the YBS?

[Roland]

A didnae write it tae coz offence but it's interesting you mention Braspenning being friends with the vet. Have seen with my own eyes the amount of medication the average guy on the continent uses tae keep their Doos sound. Ye canny keep giving them medication tae get them racing coz the long term outcome is repeated sickness in yer birds, the fact he admits it doesn't surprise me either because they accept it as part and parcel of keeping doos.

 

I don't know if you use antibiotics regularly or not but I would be very interested tae know what measures you took or what you done differently the year following it being in your loft to prevent its return.

 

Another thought here ...

 

You know it beggars belief that all too often, our stalwarts, those elected as our overseers and guardians often do more harm, and knowingly, than good.

 

No profit in curing is a very well known fact.

 

Have held a thought .. on no knowledgeable basis, just my own views and thoughts - that it isn't in the interests of the drug/ aids concern to bring out as to what and why there is y/b's sickness, or remendies ... Why? Only one answer to why, which in this case I believe, that they have far more profit from fanciers buying and using umpteen different so - call remedies than they ever would cure it completely.

Now I needn't see any posts saying 'Nah you must be bonkers (etc.) they wouldn't do that to make money....etc.' History proves and every day such cases come out that greed does do as such and regularly!

[aye ready]

A didnae write it tae coz offence but it's interesting you mention Braspenning being friends with the vet. Have seen with my own eyes the amount of medication the average guy on the continent uses tae keep their Doos sound. Ye canny keep giving them medication tae get them racing coz the long term outcome is repeated sickness in yer birds, the fact he admits it doesn't surprise me either because they accept it as part and parcel of keeping doos.

 

I don't know if you use antibiotics regularly or not but I would be very interested tae know what measures you took or what you done differently the year following it being in your loft to prevent its return.

in answer to your question john no i don't use antibiotics regularly only when and if required in fact i would say 95% of the time my birds get fresh water and i never get "sick" old birds just on the very odd occassion a slight rise in cocci count and as for something different every year to try and avoid young bird sickness believe me i could write the book and just as a matter of interest john in all the years i've had young bird sickness and there has been a few,i've never once had young bird sickness before them being entered for the first race so is this where they contract it? and the previous poster is right john bosworth openly admits medicating his birds regularly(weekly basis) i think throughout the racing season,i've also been at quiz nights when john has been on the panel and heard him say this so food for thought.another thing john is I attend the deweerd veterinary stand at blackpool every year and buy test kits for the whole season and if i think the birds are a bit off the pace theni have no hesitation in sending a test kit in and in reply to rolands view that vets are in in to make money so to speak deweerd has never forced me to take any of his products if there is something showing in the test.

[JohnQuinn]

Will elaborate on my response later as I am out tonight. Will say this though, if your birds are being medicated they should be barred from competing until chemical free.

[Roland]

Will elaborate on my response later as I am out tonight. Will say this though, if your birds are being medicated they should be barred from competing until chemical free.

 

True, but seldom now, if ever done ... or even thought of.

[Novice]

True, but seldom now, if ever done ... or even thought of.

 

 

How can it be proven that a bird is chemical free? Like it or not minerals, salts and even a pinch of potassium permanganate in the drinker or bath are chemicals. All vitamins no matter their source are chemicals.

Firms like VL produce mixtures which are all chemically enhanced.

Immunity plus concept so popular in VL mixes is a chemical pellet.

[JohnQuinn]

How can it be proven that a bird is chemical free? Like it or not minerals, salts and even a pinch of potassium permanganate in the drinker or bath are chemicals. All vitamins no matter their source are chemicals.

Firms like VL produce mixtures which are all chemically enhanced.

Immunity plus concept so popular in VL mixes is a chemical pellet.

 

They should be testing the first 2-3 birds in each section as a matter of course. The minerals salts and potassium permanganate are all Naturally produced, am referring tae out and out chemicals made by man. I know fine ALLL medication is sourced from natural sources but the modification means the original ingredients are unrecognisable.

The antiques roadshow which is the SNFC transporters mean my birds can be picking food out of sh*t passed by a bird being treated before the race and no one can predict what affect this has on Chemical free birds, MY birds.

[JohnQuinn]

At the end of every document relating to Doping ends with the advice "this list is non exhaustive " to me that means ye canny take/give anything to a competing man, mamal or birds. I race Clean doos and am happy for them tae mix way Any other birds, even disease carrying birds but I do Not want them exposed in any way to chemicals from any source.

[peter pandy]

At the end of every document relating to Doping ends with the advice "this list is non exhaustive " to me that means ye canny take/give anything to a competing man, mamal or birds. I race Clean doos and am happy for them tae mix way Any other birds, even disease carrying birds but I do Not want them exposed in any way to chemicals from any source.

SNAP.

[geordie1234]

This is pure comedy

[peter pandy]

I believe after reading about certain Olympic competitors using banned drugs with the excuse they are for medical reasons that fanciers will be buying up Asthma Inhalers to give their pigeons a dose on a Friday night.

[JohnQuinn]

in answer to your question john no i don't use antibiotics regularly only when and if required in fact i would say 95% of the time my birds get fresh water and i never get "sick" old birds just on the very odd occassion a slight rise in cocci count and as for something different every year to try and avoid young bird sickness believe me i could write the book and just as a matter of interest john in all the years i've had young bird sickness and there has been a few,i've never once had young bird sickness before them being entered for the first race so is this where they contract it? and the previous poster is right john bosworth openly admits medicating his birds regularly(weekly basis) i think throughout the racing season,i've also been at quiz nights when john has been on the panel and heard him say this so food for thought.another thing john is I attend the deweerd veterinary stand at blackpool every year and buy test kits for the whole season and if i think the birds are a bit off the pace theni have no hesitation in sending a test kit in and in reply to rolands view that vets are in in to make money so to speak deweerd has never forced me to take any of his products if there is something showing in the test.

 

As I said earlier my original post was not meant to coz offence so rather than to and fro and making it personal I will just tell what I do and don't do.

 

Right now my lofts are a riot and have been pretty much for the last 8 years. Prior to that I had Ybs going light on me left right and centre, had OEC in them every year treated with a pinch of Aureomycin into the eye.

In 2008 I became stray officer put my scrapers away (done 3 times a day until then) and decided come what may I am treating for nothing. Since then I have gone out my way to expose them to as many disease possible. So my personal baskets became the stray basket as well so after aw the sick, run down strays were in them my Ybs were next in tae expose them to whatever the strays were carrying.

Initially a was losing Ybs ten a penny but the parents of those were also away no matter where they came from or how much I had paid for them. More often than not my drinkers are topped up rather than cleaned and fresh water 2 or 3 times a day, like the old times, they are on their own deep litter and the scraper gets picked up about once a month. The feeders are permanently on the loft floors regardless if I suspect vermin are present. Those and other measures are taken to ensure they are continually open to disease.

I vaccinate at 20-22 days against PMV and that's the last medicine they Ever get. I almost treated blind for canker before the national this year but left well alone as they were looking and handling very well.

Gradually over the years less and less of my Ybs were taking ill and since last season I have the kind of doos I want, Strong, robust, constitutionally sound doos that when I do my part perform at the highest level.

 

So for what it's worth and if ye can swallow the disappointments on the way, I advise everybody to follow my methods and YBS will be a thing of the past in less than a decade..

[Novice]

They should be testing the first 2-3 birds in each section as a matter of course. The minerals salts and potassium permanganate are all Naturally produced, am referring tae out and out chemicals made by man. I know fine ALLL medication is sourced from natural sources but the modification means the original ingredients are unrecognisable.

The antiques roadshow which is the SNFC transporters mean my birds can be picking food out of sh*t passed by a bird being treated before the race and no one can predict what affect this has on Chemical free birds, MY birds.

Sadly most of the compounds we refer to as natural were actually produced in a factory.

Vitamin C is a natural product if you want to spend all day squeezing lemons. However pharmaceutical companies buy it in 25 kilo boxes.

Of course I did understand exactly what you were speaking about but it's completely impractical to test everyone's pigeons every week.

Most of the chemicals you are referring to require individual tests to identify them. It would be very expensive to do this.

 

I agree wholeheartedly with comments regarding SNFC transportation and the purchase of new crates suggests they are committed to this for some years ahead.

[Novice]

Sadly most of the compounds we refer to as natural were actually produced in a factory.

Vitamin C is a natural product if you want to spend all day squeezing lemons. However pharmaceutical companies buy it in 25 kilo boxes.

Of course I did understand exactly what you were speaking about but it's completely impractical to test everyone's pigeons every week.

Most of the chemicals you are referring to require individual tests to identify them. It would be very expensive to do this.

 

I agree wholeheartedly with comments regarding SNFC transportation and the purchase of new crates suggests they are committed to this for some years ahead.

 

Potassium permanganate is produced synthetically.

[aye ready]

Will elaborate on my response later as I am out tonight. Will say this though, if your birds are being medicated they should be barred from competing until chemical free.

John I'm assuming their medicated on return from a race for 3/4 days so by basically the Tuesday and rest of week nothing more is added

[JohnQuinn]

John I'm assuming their medicated on return from a race for 3/4 days so by basically the Tuesday and rest of week nothing more is added

 

Again the issue here is none of us know What they are giving their birds ! and we certainly don't know if these drugs/chemicals stay in the birds system from one week to the next.

One of the biggest issues I have way this is there are too many "vets" & "pharmacists" among us who will swear on their wean's life they know exactly what they're treating and giving their doos so ppl believe them. For me if ye haven't got the letters after yer name ye know Nae mare than me about it, and that's dangerous for everybody's birds IMO.

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

I believe after reading about certain Olympic competitors using banned drugs with the excuse they are for medical reasons that fanciers will be buying up Asthma Inhalers to give their pigeons a dose on a Friday night.

 

WILL BE BUYING???

 

These Olympians are 40 years behind the fancy

 

[moscow master]

This is pure comedy

Am realising where am going wrong Geordie it's simple just make sure your lofts knee deep in sh ite the drinkers are green with algae and mice Pi sh on the chuck fire them straight in the race basket there you go winners galore am trying this next year 😂😂you up for it

[Guest johnhunter]

Am realising where am going wrong Geordie it's simple just make sure your lofts knee deep in sh ite the drinkers are green with algae and mice Pi sh on the chuck fire them straight in the race basket there you go winners galore am trying this next year 😂😂you up for it

it works for some lol