Clean Water, Clean Food, Grit And Ventilation

[Wiley]

How many people that are extremely successful just using Clean Water, Clean Food, Grit and Plenty Of Ventilation. Ive recently just watched 13 pigeon DVDs in a row, and not one of the fanciers featured gave 100% clean water, or 100% clean food, they all used an additive of some sort at certain times of the week. They also all basically threw peoples believes about ventilation out of window, all lofts completely closed, and only air exchange was during times of entering and leaving the loft. The only similarities i saw was the use of clean grit, plenty of sunshine and phenomenal results.

 

How many people are extremely successful with just clean food, clean water, grit and plenty of ventilation, or are those days completely gone forever?

[Novice]

If you find any let me know because they have really good pigeons.

[greenbar]

How many people that are extremely successful just using Clean Water, Clean Food, Grit and Plenty Of Ventilation. Ive recently just watched 13 pigeon DVDs in a row, and not one of the fanciers featured gave 100% clean water, or 100% clean food, they all used an additive of some sort at certain times of the week. They also all basically threw peoples believes about ventilation out of window, all lofts completely closed, and only air exchange was during times of entering and leaving the loft. The only similarities i saw was the use of clean grit, plenty of sunshine and phenomenal results.

 

How many people are extremely successful with just clean food, clean water, grit and plenty of ventilation, or are those days completely gone forever?

not a lot,

[Roland]

Best fancier I ever met, only ever used clean feed and fresh water. Once it was different feeds.... One a winter feed and one for racing .... till it was just the so - called racing mix. A stable all round mixed diet.

Any grit was found picking up in the garden.

[Wiley]

Best fancier I ever met, only ever used clean feed and fresh water. Once it was different feeds.... One a winter feed and one for racing .... till it was just the so - called racing mix. A stable all round mixed diet.

Any grit was found picking up in the garden.

 

 

Is he still at the top now Rolly, or is the clean feed, clean water, clean grit and plenty of ventilation a thing of yesteryear?

[Delboy]

Water, feed and a handful of grit and my birds are looking perfect. Anyone that sees them comment on their condition. Ive won in every show I entered this year lol. Ill give them treatment ONLY if and when they need it, I take samples several times through the year and unless they desperately need treatment, I leave them and let them get on with it. Whats wrong with most fanciers is they are frightened to NOT give them anything, try it and see how much money your wasting. Believe me, ive spent ( wasted ) plenty of money on all the fads and fancy potions and was convinced that they were responsible for my success. However, after a long discussion with a top fancier I was persuaded to give them nothing but the basics and to my surprise the pigeons flew as well, if not better. You wouldn't take medication for a headache unless you had a headache and this applies to treating pigeons also . Im gradually going back to the way it used to be, the main treatment for a sick pigeon is the spade. Im also of the opinion that your really top pigeons seldom get anything up with them that they cant shrug off themselves.

[Wiley]

Water, feed and a handful of grit and my birds are looking perfect. Anyone that sees them comment on their condition. Ive won in every show I entered this year lol. Ill give them treatment ONLY if and when they need it, I take samples several times through the year and unless they desperately need treatment, I leave them and let them get on with it. Whats wrong with most fanciers is they are frightened to NOT give them anything, try it and see how much money your wasting. Believe me, ive spent ( wasted ) plenty of money on all the fads and fancy potions and was convinced that they were responsible for my success. However, after a long discussion with a top fancier I was persuaded to give them nothing but the basics and to my surprise the pigeons flew as well, if not better. You wouldn't take medication for a headache unless you had a headache and this applies to treating pigeons also . Im gradually going back to the way it used to be, the main treatment for a sick pigeon is the spade. Im also of the opinion that your really top pigeons seldom get anything up with them that they cant shrug off themselves.

 

Del, just asking as it didnt sound quiet clear to me from your response, that the birds receive no vitamins, additivies, or medication via the water or feed during the racing season?

[Delboy]

Del, just asking as it didnt sound quiet clear to me from your response, that the birds receive no vitamins, additivies, or medication via the water or feed during the racing season?

 

Its not as set in stone as that Ryan. I treat only if needed and only for the illness they have at that time. This may be followed up with vitamins or a probiotic which is determined only by the vets advice. The feed I give during the year has enough natural vits, minerals, trace elements etc in it to bring the birds into top health. I feel all the commercialism nowadays in the pigeon sport is ridiculous, we had great returns from 5-600 miles years ago when the birds got nothing but water/feed/grit and im trying to get back to that.

[KIDDON]

Many years ago there were very few pigeon products on the market and very little was known about medications/antibiotics but the pigeons thrived and seemed to have a very good natural immunity then all the so called wonder products and medications arrived from the continent under the banner that the top fanciers swear by these and there success was due to there use, now we seem to have birds that are hard to keep healthy without the need to treat, we now seem to have created a culture were many feel you need to treat to prevent your birds from sickness.

[Roland]

Well no he isn't actually Wiley. However his uncle, who did the same, dominated the fed till 3 - 4 years ago, especially at the distance and hard races. He unfortunately pass on last year and his racing was curtailed for a couple of years prior due to ill health.

 

You know, many off the top of their' heads spout things such as 'Yesteryears birds wouldn't live with today's birds'. or 'Those birds of the past would be pasted and left behind today. JUST look at the velocities etc.'... Whereas the fact is that that isn't so ... as velocities prove. And totally far less birds sent! Good days and bad days alike. Simple realisation is that in the 50's / early 60's there were 140.000 to 150.000 fanciers participating most weeks ... numbers of pigeon dropped of sent at the distance of course. However the 30 odd thousand fanciers today send each week far, far in excess of the birdage sent then.

Then there is the heavy losses and fanciers breeding many times more again each year (filling up the towns and church tops - more even than ever before each year to counteract the losses of these culls bred and lost.

Medicines has become a big business over the last 50 years or so, and gaining every week it appears. Many lies and FALSE claims told. Fear mongering abounds by firms, via Feather merchants and names - who get paid - to get their product sold.

Have a look in my medicine cabinet ... none existent. However from time to time I do buy as needs must. Though very seldom. Then most likely at the super market lol.

[dal2]

Roland is of course correct in that the birds seemed more robust years gone by and that modern times seem to encourage the use of antibiotics. I don't often have CLEAN water during the race season as I use glucose and other stuff most days (usually a Monday is clean). I don't see it as medication or treatment just a few conditioners that WE feel help the birds get to the form/condition we like.

 

 

Roland won't like this but.........we are in the realms of racer and keeper again

[Novice]

The topic is interesting but I note that several people have mentioned medication and, in particular antibiotics.

Medications should only be used when absolutely necessary, a treatment for canker, worms or whatever.

Supplements are something completely different of course and most fanciers will use these although they might not class them as supplements. For example glucose, oils, iodine , iron the list is endless.

Any fancier who wins out of turn without any medication or supplements of any kind has the birds we all need.

[Wiley]

The topic is interesting but I note that several people have mentioned medication and, in particular antibiotics.

Medications should only be used when absolutely necessary, a treatment for canker, worms or whatever.

Supplements are something completely different of course and most fanciers will use these although they might not class them as supplements. For example glucose, oils, iodine , iron the list is endless.

Any fancier who wins out of turn without any medication or supplements of any kind has the birds we all need.

 

 

This is really where i wanted the post to go regarding the use of supplementation Novice, to see if the days of Clean Water(Nothing added at ALL including things like garlic, cider cinegar ect) clean feed (nothing used on the feed for example oils, vitamins, powders ect ect) , plenty of ventilation(open loft of the dowelled fronts of years gone by) and just grit( plain simple jane no fancy matrix or any other one)

[dal2]

This is really where i wanted the post to go regarding the use of supplementation Novice, to see if the days of Clean Water(Nothing added at ALL including things like garlic, cider cinegar ect) clean feed (nothing used on the feed for example oils, vitamins, powders ect ect) , plenty of ventilation(open loft of the dowelled fronts of years gone by) and just grit( plain simple jane no fancy matrix or any other one)

My loft is wide open most days unless it's wet. We have mesh doors that are in place from first light until dark in the summer.

[Wiley]

My loft is wide open most days unless it's wet. We have mesh doors that are in place from first light until dark in the summer.

 

Thanks for the reply dal, but from your previous reply we can say that in your loft at least Clean Water, Clean Food and possibly the simple grit doesnt conform....so apart from the plenty of ventilation, in your loft and my own loft the days of yesteryear of Clean Water, Clean Food, Plenty of Ventilation and Grit are long gone, as i use supplementation in my water, and on my feed, aswell as a matrix type grit and my lofts are completely boxed in when racing comes, but during the winter and when rearing they receive plenty of ventilation.

[dal2]

Agreed. Don't know any fancier that doesn't TREAT the water or corn ever

[Novice]

This is really where i wanted the post to go regarding the use of supplementation Novice, to see if the days of Clean Water(Nothing added at ALL including things like garlic, cider cinegar ect) clean feed (nothing used on the feed for example oils, vitamins, powders ect ect) , plenty of ventilation(open loft of the dowelled fronts of years gone by) and just grit( plain simple jane no fancy matrix or any other one)

I hope I didn't spoil a discussion. Now at the risk of putting him on a spot the fancier who comes closest to the criteria you mention might be David Jamieson. It would be interesting to hear his comments on this subject.

[Wiley]

I hope I didn't spoil a discussion. Now at the risk of putting him on a spot the fancier who comes closest to the criteria you mention might be David Jamieson. It would be interesting to hear his comments on this subject.

 

No novice defiantly didnt spoil a discussion just reiterated clearer on what i was trying to get at in the first place, so hopefully from your post people can understand clearer by what i meant.

 

Id love to hear the views

[dkj]

I hope I didn't spoil a discussion. Now at the risk of putting him on a spot the fancier who comes closest to the criteria you mention might be David Jamieson. It would be interesting to hear his comments on this subject.

 

in my loft. its clean feed/water. good ventilation is important. but most important is natural heat.

my birds are worked round the loft only. and never trained, old birds or young birds.

my thoughts is most people think winners come out a bottle or training all the time. and i know thats the worst thing you can do.

[dal2]

in my loft. its clean feed/water. good ventilation is important. but most important is natural heat.

my birds are worked round the loft only. and never trained, old birds or young birds.

my thoughts is most people think winners come out a bottle or training all the time. and i know thats the worst thing you can do.

Natural heat? Expand on this Davey please

[geordie1234]

Natural heat? Expand on this Davey please

Fae the sun haha

[dal2]

Fae the sun haha

I thought davey was in the east no the middle east lol

[geordie1234]

I thought davey was in the east no the middle east lol

Lol...I'm assuming through perspex etc to heat the loft up ie no heaters etc

 

Ps I was always told not to assume lol

[dal2]

Lol...I'm assuming through perspex etc to heat the loft up ie no heaters etc

 

Ps I was always told not to assume lol

Always nice to lead the answersfrom the expert witness George........he may have a fookin solar panel ye never ken lol

[dkj]

Natural heat? Expand on this Davey please

50% of my roof is clear perspex