joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 naedoos any ring number not visable does not have to be checked your racing one ring 2008 if old bird season 2009 if young bird season your not racing two rings at same time its been going on for years so go away and have a rethink take your time no rush oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just ask me Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 weather it be right or wrong in pll eyes i think this can be done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 So now we move on the thread to the next phase 2:= The scenario is the youngster which is double rung it has a 2008 ring on one leg and a 2009 ring on the other, however the fancier now has an ETS fitted at the loft. When he goes to his club to register his birds through the scanner he submits the 2008 ring number as he wishes to send this bird into the race, which just happens to be an old bird race, he's doing nothing wrong he submits the 2008 ring which qualifies for entry into this old bird race, after all it is "deemed the ring". that is entered and not the bird.These youngsters with old rings on will after a couple of races murder the opposition, they will not hang around the lib sites there out and gone on their way home. Its like the pensioner robbed of his cash outside a post office, he will most likely be catching the young villian up towards the 100yard mark, but then most probably with fright of being caught the young villian steps up a gear and maintains that speed because of his youthfulness, well its the same with our pigeons they cannot keep the speed with these younger birds that is why the sport had defined races for Old Birds and races for Young Birds so everyone was on a even keel. Oh bye the way, the taped up ring, name & address rings are tolerated in shows but you have to either tape them over, so not to disclose the owners identity or you can now buy these clip over rings which do the same job, well the thought is this, if they are tolerated / allowed in the showing of pigeons then whats the difference with racing birds wearing them either clipped or taped whichever is the case the marking comittee are not allowed to interfere with them, they are only allowed to handle that bird and confirm the birds ring number which is visible. I told you this thread had many answers, interesting though! Oh! HAPPY DAYS (got me at it Joe 61). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 naedoos any ring number not visable does not have to be checked your racing one ring 2008 if old bird season 2009 if young bird season your not racing two rings at same time its been going on for years so go away and have a rethink take your time no rush oh happy days certainly no gonna go away and don't need to think joe, you are wrong and you know it and you're no happy about it I'm not disputing it's been going on for a long time, all I'm doing is pointing out if anyones clever enough to bend the rules that bend joe61's rules then anything can be made up to suit any situation ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 naedoos this has been going on for years dont you think if it was ilegal some one on a basketing commity some where in the UK would have said hold up you cant do that its cheating then along you come with the answear to the problem sorry back to the drawing board oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 So now we move on the thread to the next phase 2:= The scenario is the youngster which is double rung it has a 2008 ring on one leg and a 2009 ring on the other, however the fancier now has an ETS fitted at the loft. When he goes to his club to register his birds through the scanner he submits the 2008 ring number as he wishes to send this bird into the race, which just happens to be an old bird race, he's doing nothing wrong he submits the 2008 ring which qualifies for entry into this old bird race, after all it is "deemed the ring". that is entered and not the bird.These youngsters with old rings on will after a couple of races murder the opposition, they will not hang around the lib sites there out and gone on their way home. Its like the pensioner robbed of his cash outside a post office, he will most likely be catching the young villian up towards the 100yard mark, but then most probably with fright of being caught the young villian steps up a gear and maintains that speed because of his youthfulness, well its the same with our pigeons they cannot keep the speed with these younger birds that is why the sport had defined races for Old Birds and races for Young Birds so everyone was on a even keel. Oh bye the way, the taped up ring, name & address rings are tolerated in shows but you have to either tape them over, so not to disclose the owners identity or you can now buy these clip over rings which do the same job, well the thought is this, if they are tolerated / allowed in the showing of pigeons then whats the difference with racing birds wearing them either clipped or taped whichever is the case the marking comittee are noy allowed to interfere with them, they are only allowed to handle that bird and confirm the birds ring number which is visible. I told you this thread had many answers, interesting though! Good point Chairman, wouldn't work up here thankfully, no enough room on same leg for unikon ets ring and union ring Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 chairman you have put it in a nut shell i have no need to carry on banging my head oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 naedoos this has been going on for years dont you think if it was ilegal some one on a basketing commity some where in the UK would have said hold up you cant do that its cheating then along you come with the answear to the problem sorry back to the drawing board oh happy days prove to me I'm wrong then because up till now you haven't :-/ I've never said it was cheating, and I haven't given you the answer, all I've done is pointed out a loophole to go against the loophole you pointed out :-/ If you can quote me the rpra rule that tells me I'm wrong then I'll admit I'm wrong, after all it only took me a few minutes to find the rule that states "that if two rings they must be same loft number" In my mind if that is a rule then they would have to be uncovered and checked to see if they were same loft number Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 read the post naedoos the one about tampering cant quote you arule its a loophole bigger than the one you quote oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonscout Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 If a young bird has two rings on its leg it is still a young bird fact. If it is breaking the rules to race young birds with old birds then you are breaking those's rules fact. Just because you have the true year of its birth covered up does not get away from the fact it is still a young bird. If you know it is a young bird and you know your breaking the rules by racing it as an old bird that is not bending the rules that is breaking them. If you know it is a young bird and you cover up the fact it is a young bird by hiding its ring then you are cheating plain and simple. It does not need to be put into the rules that hiding the fact that you are breaking a rule makes it ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 read the post naedoos the one about tampering cant quote you arule its a loophole bigger than the one you quote oh happy days ;D ;D ;D so what you're trying to tell me is there is/isn't a rule that you can't quote about a basketing convener not being allowed to uncover a ring number that you want to put up against an official rpra ruling??? Think I would take my chances at the rpra hearing joe thank goodness I don't have to fly under your rules ;D ;D ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 to take the tape or atempt to take the tape off would be deemed as tampering with a ring which is on the birds leg oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotrod Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 to take the tape or atempt to take the tape off would be deemed as tampering with a ring which is on the birds leg oh happy days numnuts covering up a registraition ring is tampering with the rules,go and grow a brain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 to take the tape or atempt to take the tape off would be deemed as tampering with a ring which is on the birds leg oh happy days we're goin round in circles joe cos you can't show me where it states that :-/ at least I quoted rule 96 for you so that must allow me to check the ring to ensure that it belongs to the same loft as the other ring 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 naedoos my mate will carry on racing his double rung pigeons as hes done for years you do it your way good luck oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 hot rod thers no need for that thats not vary nice this is a good debate so dont spoil it mate oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 naedoos my mate will carry on racing his double rung pigeons as hes done for years you do it your way good luck oh happy days best o luck to him and you as well joe all I'm sayin is e widnae manage it if I was on the baskets, I'd quote rule 96 and make sure by the time the secretary had time to check all the double ringers the transporter be long gone all the best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 we are all done here hotrod so you can sit her and talk to your self good night will the last one leaving turn out the lights oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotrod Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 i dont like cheats or the ones that condone cheating ,and what your talking about IS PURE AND UTTER CHEATING end of story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe61 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 good night hotrod oh happy days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotrod Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 hope you can sleep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonscout Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Rule 70. (a) If any member of the Association shall be guilty of any dishonourable conduct. The word Dishonourable among other things means deceptive or fraudulent; disposed to cheat or defraud or deceive. Covering up the true year of a young bird so it can be raced as an old bird is Deceptive and is covered by this rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naedoos Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Rule 70. (a) If any member of the Association shall be guilty of any dishonourable conduct. Covering up the true year of a young bird so it can be raced as an old bird is Deceptive and is covered by this rule. Well done!!! It's amazing how different things can be interpreted from one set of rules, must agree with you on this one though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotrod Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Rule 70. (a) If any member of the Association shall be guilty of any dishonourable conduct. The word Dishonourable among other things means deceptive or fraudulent; disposed to cheat or defraud or deceive. Covering up the true year of a young bird so it can be raced as an old bird is Deceptive and is covered by this rule. thats it joe 61 your beet ,well done pigeonscout Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Don't be foolish enough to think no one has the right to touch the ring that is taped up, in your rules, rule 96 states "Should a bird carry more than one ring, both rings must be registered to one loft number and must be from the country of origin" If I were your basket convener I would be entitled to check the ring taped up and not let it in the basket if it was a young bird. Even if you insisted that it be allowed, it would be simple to get the remaining club members birds race marked while the bogus ring number was verified, and who knows it would maybe even be too late to get them verified before the transporter had to leave I cant see where you can visibly read the information of an ETS ring, by the human eye without the use of a electronic scanner? It could therefore be argued in a court of law, that this approved ring (ETS) does not reveal its information visibly so therefore what is the difference between an ETS ring and a ring that does not reveal its information because it is taped up or covered with a clip ring? There is neither a rule that denotes the duties or citations of the role of basket comittee members, basket convenors or whatever fancy title emits your club / organisation which legally entitles you to carryout unlawful practices.Now this is where the club officials are starting to make things up to deny this fancier his right to enter his bird into a race which entries must bear an old ring, he fits the criteria and now you have others denying him this right.The only way this can be stopped is by the RPRA issueing yet another rule, once this has been done then and only then can you put a stop to ths practice being carried out, you may act then with the provision of the rule behind you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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