Good read Walter, made me get my old books out when you mentioned Fechan Lass, I bought a lovely Dk. Pied cock from Louella son of Fechan Producer who was a full brother to Lass, this was 1974 or 75. The hen I bought at the same time was a g/daughter of Grizelda, the only grizzle I've ever bought in, I've lived here 30yrs and not club raced in that time, the 30 birds I brought with me, and decendents, have been on open loft the whole time, they now are 22 birds and 9 of them are grizzles so with the never ending hammering they take from BOP, when one moves on another quickly replaces it, the old Kirkpatricks seem tough birds