National Racing?

[bullcock]

Yes I know you lads do,I do think something will need to give somewhere though.

I have covered this with others, the losses in the first National have been killing the birdage for the rest of the races for the last 5 years or more, and we keep going down this route for the first national, Newbury poor returns, Bovingdon terrible returns, Malbourgh terrible poor returns, newbury (cheltham) terrible returns back to newbury guess what poor returns????? how many more of these races do we need before we change?

I am for a first inland national but I would like it to be from the east the line most fly from and we have had good returns from Maidstone, Eastbourne and ypres over the last 5 years so stay in the east! Hunting don approx. 300 miles into the central belt would give good sport, better returns and a wee stretch ready for the gold cup.

This is my tupence worth on this subject, STAY OUT the NEWBURY AREA! GO EAST.........

[blucock]

Maybe a daft question rab but who flys over 500 miles from inland races ? I've looked at the last few Eastbourne results and the only one that ones close is a guy from Macduff. 491 miles and he was well up in the result .i posted on another thread that due to the boys further north I think Huntingdon would do for an inland race. , I would call it the inland derby. Instead of national , as the INFC. Have a race in there program call a derby ? Would give the guys further north a better / fairer race about 360 /400 miles I would think

 

Why call it a Derby? If it is open to a whole country it is a National in it's purest sense. Those getting tied up in distance totally miss the point. A national is a national is a national. Next you'll be telling me it's easier to win an inland national than a channel national....

 

[JADE]

Why call it a Derby? If it is open to a whole country it is a National in it's purest sense. Those getting tied up in distance totally miss the point. A national is a national is a national. Next you'll be telling me it's easier to win an inland national than a channel national....

 

 

 

Totally agree. Just a thought. When we race from Ypres and Clermont there shouldn't be so much water to cross. Should they be semi nationals?

[dal2]

Why call it a Derby? If it is open to a whole country it is a National in it's purest sense. Those getting tied up in distance totally miss the point. A national is a national is a national. Next you'll be telling me it's easier to win an inland national than a channel national....

 

Tied up with distance??? Its what we want to fly?

Its hard to win any national.

 

Next you will be telling us there is more prestige in winning an inland nat?

[hotrod]

Totally agree. Just a thought. When we race from Ypres and Clermont there shouldn't be so much water to cross. Should they be semi nationals?

You obviously can't read a map mate a straight line from Ypres to the central belt of Scotland They have more water to cross than from say alencon and to the boys in the north it's mostly water . It's Fkn shocking on here u can't have a view but you get jumped on . Just because I prefer long distance racing to inland racing , I've topped the fed from 60 miles to 543 miles , fed averages etc. done that got the tee shirt , but since 2001 I've concentrated on the longer events ,so what I don't like inland nationals that's my prerogative , you guys just do what u want and get on way it I'm Fkn done with this thread , ps next time your in my company introduce yersel . Thanx

[JADE]

You obviously can't read a map mate a straight line from Ypres to the central belt of Scotland They have more water to cross than from say alencon and to the boys in the north it's mostly water . It's Fkn shocking on here u can't have a view but you get jumped on . Just because I prefer long distance racing to inland racing , I've topped the fed from 60 miles to 543 miles , fed averages etc. done that got the tee shirt , but since 2001 I've concentrated on the longer events ,so what I don't like inland nationals that's my prerogative , you guys just do what u want and get on way it I'm Fkn done with this thread , ps next time your in my company introduce yersel . Thanx

 

No I hadn't looked at a map it was just a bit of banter but as you mention it how many of the ypres birds do you think take a straight line home? I like long distance racing as much as anyone but what I don't like is guys who knock the inland nationals. If you don't like them don't go but don't stop others. The entries show that they are popular and if fanciers are worried about losing their gold cup doos at Newbury why send them in the first place

[hotrod]

No I hadn't looked at a map it was just a bit of banter but as you mention it how many of the ypres birds do you think take a straight line home? I like long distance racing as much as anyone but what I don't like is guys who knock the inland nationals. If you don't like them don't go but don't stop others. The entries show that they are popular and if fanciers are worried about losing their gold cup doos at Newbury why send them in the first place

He pal I don't like them but everybody to their own , but IMHO there not in the same league as winning a channel race , yes the birdage suggests that they are popular , but how many are actually prepared to do themselves justice ? A lot of club/ fed flyers have a go at these type of races . Some of them send so that they can say i have sent to a ( national) , and every club has them. After 200 miles their not at the marking ,then they turn up with a few or the first inland national , and most probably have no chance of even getting home this is where some of the problem lies ill prepared pigeons .

[Guest chad3646]

He pal I don't like them but everybody to their own , but IMHO there not in the same league as winning a channel race , yes the birdage suggests that they are popular , but how many are actually prepared to do themselves justice ? A lot of club/ fed flyers have a go at these type of races . Some of them send so that they can say i have sent to a ( national) , and every club has them. After 200 miles their not at the marking ,then they turn up with a few or the first inland national , and most probably have no chance of even getting home this is where some of the problem lies ill prepared pigeons .

 

 

correct

[hotrod]

No I hadn't looked at a map it was just a bit of banter but as you mention it how many of the ypres birds do you think take a straight line home? I like long distance racing as much as anyone but what I don't like is guys who knock the inland nationals. If you don't like them don't go but don't stop others. The entries show that they are popular and if fanciers are worried about losing their gold cup doos at Newbury why send them in the first place

And to answer your question I haven't a clue , but think it would depend on the wind . , think a few years ago there was a pigeon up the east coast from a Belgium race and most have said it must have flown mostly over the water in a straight line to get home ithe time it did , poss les mackay ?

[novo10]

He pal I don't like them but everybody to their own , but IMHO there not in the same league as winning a channel race , yes the birdage suggests that they are popular , but how many are actually prepared to do themselves justice ? A lot of club/ fed flyers have a go at these type of races . Some of them send so that they can say i have sent to a ( national) , and every club has them. After 200 miles their not at the marking ,then they turn up with a few or the first inland national , and most probably have no chance of even getting home this is where some of the problem lies ill prepared pigeons .

Hundred percent correct

[hotrod]

Hundred percent correct

I've paid the price before thinking you can send them for a toss , just to get time on the wing for the channel , only to lose some of them . So now I just bother 270/300 miles is enough for my pigeons before the channel .

[novo10]

I've paid the price before thinking you can send them for a toss , just to get time on the wing for the channel , only to lose some of them . So now I just bother 270/300 miles is enough for my pigeons before the channel .

Mind went to lectern was lanarkshire

[novo10]

Mind went to lectern was lanarkshire

Mind went to leicster with lanarkshire

[JADE]

He pal I don't like them but everybody to their own , but IMHO there not in the same league as winning a channel race , yes the birdage suggests that they are popular , but how many are actually prepared to do themselves justice ? A lot of club/ fed flyers have a go at these type of races . Some of them send so that they can say i have sent to a ( national) , and every club has them. After 200 miles their not at the marking ,then they turn up with a few or the first inland national , and most probably have no chance of even getting home this is where some of the problem lies ill prepared pigeons .

 

Never said they are in the same league as winning a channel race and yes probably a lot of doos go that are not capable of flying them but how do you stop that. Are they the doos that are cutting the gold cup entry as they are lost by then.

[JADE]

And to answer your question I haven't a clue , but think it would depend on the wind . , think a few years ago there was a pigeon up the east coast from a Belgium race and most have said it must have flown mostly over the water in a straight line to get home ithe time it did , poss les mackay ?

 

Yes you are correct when Les won Liege. I think several of the early birds crossed the water together that day. I think some doos will cross the water from Ypres given the right conditions but the majority will cross and come up through England. Just my opinion though

[Chris Little]

What an interesting thread

 

I love a good old debate.

 

Having been fortunate to win three nationals, one thing I can say it is winning nationals isn't easy.... however, inland nationals are easier to win.

 

The year we won SNFC Newbury we beat 4000 birds, only 3300 away this year

 

Someone mentionend further back why I dont join the NFC.... good point, I already have

[hotrod]

Mind went to leicster with lanarkshire

You on the swally ? Or is the same as me on this I pad. Predictive text . Pain in the *expletive removed*.

[hotrod]

Never said they are in the same league as winning a channel race and yes probably a lot of doos go that are not capable of flying them but how do you stop that. Are they the doos that are cutting the gold cup entry as they are lost by then.

I find bad birds can get good pigeons lost , if your good pigeon is in the wrong batch , and has to break and head home itself then it's easy prey or Percy , this IMHO is why we are losing so many GOOD pigeons .

[novo10]

You on the swally ? Or is the same as me on this I pad. Predictive text . Pain in the *expletive removed*.

Same as you

[hotrod]

Mind went to leicster with lanarkshire

I remember a few years ago I spoke to Kerr stainthorpe. , he done a study on pigeons that won or done well from the coast , most of them never done really well from the channel , he found that the birds that had better performances across the water was birds that done well from the Leicester/ Cheltenham distance .ps this study was in is club/ fed

[novo10]

I remember a few years ago I spoke to Kerr stainthorpe. , he done a study on pigeons that won or done well from the coast , most of them never done really well from the channel , he found that the birds that had better performances across the water was birds that done well from the Leicester/ Cheltenham distance .ps this study was in is club/ fed

Here's hoping mate

[JADE]

I find bad birds can get good pigeons lost , if your good pigeon is in the wrong batch , and has to break and head home itself then it's easy prey or Percy , this IMHO is why we are losing so many GOOD pigeons .

 

I think you may well be right but like I said how do you stop inferior birds going. I also think that the standard of pigeon going to channel races now is not as good as it used to be. By that I mean in the old days it was usually 2 year olds to Avranches (showing my age now) then if they did ok they may go to Rennes and then Nantes. Nowadays there are folk sending yearlings and 2 y.o. to Alencon and then whatever is left to Ypres or Clermont partly to get rid of the s---e. I realise that because of predators it is very difficult for birds to survive long enough to become experienced but there is no substitute for experience imo

[Guest stb-]

He pal I don't like them but everybody to their own , but IMHO there not in the same league as winning a channel race , yes the birdage suggests that they are popular , but how many are actually prepared to do themselves justice ? A lot of club/ fed flyers have a go at these type of races . Some of them send so that they can say i have sent to a ( national) , and every club has them. After 200 miles their not at the marking ,then they turn up with a few or the first inland national , and most probably have no chance of even getting home this is where some of the problem lies ill prepared pigeons .

got to agree there to many of the birds at the first inlands are not fit for the job which dont make it home as its early and lot of birds not had enough wing time and some just aint in order either .Personally if they were done away with i wouldnt loose any sleep over them either ,

 

I would have old format first channel race gold cup longest race back to same as first channel race

 

I remember a few years ago I spoke to Kerr stainthorpe. , he done a study on pigeons that won or done well from the coast , most of them never done really well from the channel , he found that the birds that had better performances across the water was birds that done well from the Leicester/ Cheltenham distance .ps this study was in is club/ fed

yes but remember stut there 30 miles short of hear and 40 short of you so maby adjust acordingly

[hotrod]

I think you may well be right but like I said how do you stop inferior birds going. I also think that the standard of pigeon going to channel races now is not as good as it used to be. By that I mean in the old days it was usually 2 year olds to Avranches (showing my age now) then if they did ok they may go to Rennes and then Nantes. Nowadays there are folk sending yearlings and 2 y.o. to Alencon and then whatever is left to Ypres or Clermont partly to get rid of the s---e. I realise that because of predators it is very difficult for birds to survive long enough to become experienced but there is no substitute for experience imo

U just can't stop them going , it happens in club racing even from the first races, u handle some birds that shouldn't be t he race, the problem l in the inland nationals as some Feds duplicate and u don't need to be a member of the national , some think they can just send ,it's only an inland race they say , aye these can turn into a slog . A lot of fanciers do set there birds up for these races and good on them , some cracking performances in last weeks Newbury race , all Down to hard work and dedication . Yes the quality isn't there I depth nowadays .

[hotrod]

got to agree there to many of the birds at the first inlands are not fit for the job which dont make it home as its early and lot of birds not had enough wing time and some just aint in order either .Personally if they were done away with i wouldnt loose any sleep over them either ,

 

I would have old format first channel race gold cup longest race back to same as first channel race

 

 

yes but remember stut there 30 miles short of hear and 40 short of you so maby adjust acordingly

The carlin bros of kilbarchan. Wee johnny and davie tell me all the time. They used to just send to Stafford 232 miles no further as a stepping stone or their national doos , and thay had! Outstanding performances