Young Bird National

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

The results are there to back up that section/region aren’t too big a deal when it comes to channel races, even the old bird inland nationals.

 

After last year’s performance put up by Billy Bilsland in the YB national, region and loft location have become even more of a focal point than normal.

 

Seen some of the west men say Billy’s performance backs up this loft location theory/excuse. To me I can’t say for 100% it does as the times when he’s flown birds into the West of Scotland from YB nationals he will have been sending birds that aren’t half as experienced or well prepared as his winners last year.

 

You’d have to be daft to say the Eye Valley do not have the upper hand when it comes to loft location in the YB national but for us in the Northwest fed and fanciers in Central, Midland, Lanarkshire etc to have young birds near to the Eye valley pigeons in terms of experience and preparation come the YB national we’d need to be racing a programme along the lines of

 

Consett

Ripon

Wakefield

Newark

Leicester

Peterborough

 

Until this day comes, it most likely never will,I don’t think we can say the Eastern dominance from the YB national is 100% down to loft location.

 

I'm not saying a young bird programme along these lines is wrong or right, just highlighting something I've believed for a long time-that there is more to the bottom corners success in the YB national than simply where they stay.

[andy Burgess]

all interesting stuff Rooster , i struggled in our first yb national (won a certificate) but not high on the result . i felt that it would be pointless to try the yb national again to be honest ,mainly because afterwards i understood more about loft location .with the new One loft race too has left me wondering of its worth joining/sending in a National this year, can only imagine how the boys North and West must feel ?? i may be wrong in my view ,i am a National Novice (no not going for a name change) and have a lot to learn , but felt a little dis-heartened .

[JADE]

The area around Dundee and Angus consistently perform well from the young bird national flying 50-60 miles further than the Eye valley and often beating the Edinburgh/Lothian area who fly 30-40 miles less. I have noticed that their yb programme goes out to 200 miles the week before the national. Is that the reason they are so successful

[geordie1234]

The better raced or schooled ybs are the better in the national your results will be, Billy's ybs were natural and were racing with the unc I'm pretty sure they went to maidstone the week later after the national too.

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

all interesting stuff Rooster , i struggled in our first yb national (won a certificate) but not high on the result . i felt that it would be pointless to try the yb national again to be honest ,mainly because afterwards i understood more about loft location .with the new One loft race too has left me wondering of its worth joining/sending in a National this year, can only imagine how the boys North and West must feel ?? i may be wrong in my view ,i am a National Novice (no not going for a name change) and have a lot to learn , but felt a little dis-heartened .

 

We haven't sent to a YB national since 2002 Andy, I'm not saying what I've posted is gospel-it may well be totally down to loft location.

 

I'd just like to see what would happen if the feds in the central belt played the folk who dominate this race at their own game and started their youngsters at 120 mile and had them further than the National racepoint before the race itself.

 

If the outcome was the exact same in the race I would say it is location.To me at the moment though its an unlevel playing field in terms of location and the preparation and experience of the birds-the last two of these are within our control

[JohnQuinn]

The results are there to back up that section/region aren’t too big a deal when it comes to channel races, even the old bird inland nationals.

 

After last year’s performance put up by Billy Bilsland in the YB national, region and loft location have become even more of a focal point than normal.

 

Seen some of the west men say Billy’s performance backs up this loft location theory/excuse. To me I can’t say for 100% it does as the times when he’s flown birds into the West of Scotland from YB nationals he will have been sending birds that aren’t half as experienced or well prepared as his winners last year.

 

You’d have to be daft to say the Eye Valley do not have the upper hand when it comes to loft location in the YB national but for us in the Northwest fed and fanciers in Central, Midland, Lanarkshire etc to have young birds near to the Eye valley pigeons in terms of experience and preparation come the YB national we’d need to be racing a programme along the lines of

 

Consett

Ripon

Wakefield

Newark

Leicester

Peterborough

 

Until this day comes, it most likely never will,I don’t think we can say the Eastern dominance from the YB national is 100% down to loft location.

 

I'm not saying a young bird programme along these lines is wrong or right, just highlighting something I've believed for a long time-that there is more to the bottom corners success in the YB national than simply where they stay.

 

That is some statement Lewis, Billy Bilsland would never put a doo in a basket that was unprepared to fly the distance it had to fly, makje no mistake about it the YB SNFC race is all about LOCATION. Check the Open positions gained by Section E fanciers over the last 5 years and come back on and tell me your opinion on location then. Remember some fo the best fanciers in the Country are in Section E and canny make the Open result, some don't even send now because they KNOW they can't win the race.

[andy Burgess]

We haven't sent to a YB national since 2002 Andy, I'm not saying what I've posted is gospel-it may well be totally down to loft location.

 

I'd just like to see what would happen if the feds in the central belt played the folk who dominate this race at their own game and started their youngsters at 120 mile and had them further than the National racepoint before the race itself.

 

If the outcome was the exact same in the race I would say it is location.To me at the moment though its an unlevel playing field in terms of location and the preparation and experience of the birds-the last two of these are within our control

from that post i now understand your first post "better" , and think the latter part is very valid ,will be interested to see others comments too.

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

That is some statement Lewis, Billy Bilsland would never put a doo in a basket that was unprepared to fly the distance it had to fly, makje no mistake about it the YB SNFC race is all about LOCATION. Check the Open positions gained by Section E fanciers over the last 5 years and come back on and tell me your opinion on location then. Remember some fo the best fanciers in the Country are in Section E and canny make the Open result, some don't even send now because they KNOW they can't win the race.

 

Yer missing what I'm saying John

 

I have no doubt at all there are as good fanciers in Section E as anywhere in else in the country and I am sure Billy Bilsland would never put a doo in a basket that was unprepared.

 

BUT

 

Will he have sent a young bird to the young bird national whilst in the West of Scotland that had its first race from 120miles and flown in the region of 3 to 4 races between 200 and 300 miles?

 

Was down visiting a fancier in East Ord,Berwick the weekend of our second young bird race last year.We were at 60 miles and they were at 170

[JohnQuinn]

No i get what yer saying, what i'm saying is that NO MATTER what prep races the doos get through here they canny get an Open certificate 9 times out of 10 because of Location and that's a fact. 200 300 mls before it disnae make an iota of difference to the Open result.

[frank-123]

We went to stafford 220 mile the week before the yb national so I would say they were well prepared.

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

No i get what yer saying, what i'm saying is that NO MATTER what prep races the doos get through here they canny get an Open certificate 9 times out of 10 because of Location and that's a fact. 200 300 mls before it disnae make an iota of difference to the Open result.

 

You may be right John,but I couldnae agree with you 100% until the feds around our area matched them programme wise.Their doos will have flown 2 or 3 times the miles most of the pigeons in the central belt have flown before the race.

 

If the outcome was the same I'd back you up completely.

 

I cannae see this ever happening with the same kinnae numbers they are working with so it is something we will never find out

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

We went to stafford 220 mile the week before the yb national so I would say they were well prepared.

 

Not as well as the boys racing in the UNC

 

Its a numbers game as well Frank

 

Have results here when the West section have 80 out the first 100 fi nationals.Difference being they sent three quarters ae the convoy

 

Get yer lads through there to start emptying their huts fer the nationals

[andy Burgess]

You may be right John,but I couldnae agree with you 100% until the feds around our area matched them programme wise.Their doos will have flown 2 or 3 times the miles most of the pigeons in the central belt have flown before the race.

 

If the outcome was the same I'd back you up completely.

 

I cannae see this ever happening with the same kinnae numbers they are working with so it is something we will never find out

i understand this one straight off , but would like to ask this , we have a long standing member of our club and fed who occasionaly only sends to 1 of the shorter yb races ,then hits our fed open race (over 200 miles) often getting a very good position and sometime winning it ,then a week later does the yb national , again doing very , very well . whats your opinion on this Rooster ??

[frank-123]

Not as well as the boys racing in the UNC

 

Its a numbers game as well Frank

 

Have results here when the West section have 80 out the first 100 fi nationals.Difference being they sent three quarters ae the convoy

 

Get yer lads through there to start emptying their huts fer the nationals

 

Youngbird national is a graveyard only the die hards. Send

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

i understand this one straight off , but would like to ask this , we have a long standing member of our club and fed who occasionaly only sends to 1 of the shorter yb races ,then hits our fed open race (over 200 miles) often getting a very good position and sometime winning it ,then a week later does the yb national , again doing very , very well . whats your opinion on this Rooster ??

 

Would imagine hes up to some clever private training

[andy Burgess]

Would imagine hes up to some clever private training

maybe , but i believe him to be totally honest ,and from replies "dont think so" i also know his working hours and would find it really hard to find when he would have the time to get much if any training in to be honest ??

[Rebus]

make it a true national race from a distance of over 300 mls and you will see more open diplomas won in the west, at the moment the race is over in roughly 30 mins in the east hardly call that a national race.

[walterboswell59]

your right john and not just the yb nat its the same in the ob nat as well apart from an odd one or two in a west wind east sect birds are normally one hour in front of the west sect winner wee must be keeping monkeys though here only fair race in snfc program is ypres

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

maybe , but i believe him to be totally honest ,and from replies "dont think so" i also know his working hours and would find it really hard to find when he would have the time to get much if any training in to be honest ??

 

If you don't ask,you don't get Andy.

 

Have a word with this guy.Once you know his secret tell me

[walterboswell59]

make it a true national race from a distance of over 300 mls and you will see more open diplomas won in the west, at the moment the race is over in roughly 30 mins in the east hardly call that a national race.

no way unless its an east wind

[andy Burgess]

If you don't ask,you don't get Andy.

 

Have a word with this guy.Once you know his secret tell me

true , i will , and maybe ??

[JohnQuinn]

You may be right John,but I couldnae agree with you 100% until the feds around our area matched them programme wise.Their doos will have flown 2 or 3 times the miles most of the pigeons in the central belt have flown before the race.

 

If the outcome was the same I'd back you up completely.

 

I cannae see this ever happening with the same kinnae numbers they are working with so it is something we will never find out :emoticon-0136-giggle:

 

Well Harky's good Ck was either 1st or 2nd one week in the SNRPC Yb national and a week later won 1st Section E in the SNFC Yb National, but it never got an OPEN ticket in the SNFC and it was probably one of the best doos in the race. imo. I rest ma case

[hotrod]

i have spoken to guys that have done well in the respective young bird nationals be it the snfc or snrpc ,there is guys down the eyemouth area that just train their youngsters and jump them into the national and have won with em and sone have only had one race then in and done very well yet youngsters from the west with plenty of experience are miles behind these so call inexperienced birds from an easy area ,which absolutely prove 100% its all to do with location especialy in the y/bs .

[VMS]

i have spoken to guys that have done well in the respective young bird nationals be it the snfc or snrpc ,there is guys down the eyemouth area that just train their youngsters and jump them into the national and have won with em and sone have only had one race then in and done very well yet youngsters from the west with plenty of experience are miles behind these so call inexperienced birds from an easy area ,which absolutely prove 100% its all to do with location especialy in the y/bs .

Spot on Stuart it's purely down to location when it comes to the ybn.As you say it was won few years back in the Eyemouth area and the bird had only been trained out to 30 miles.think Billy Bilsland proved that for all to see last year so IMO its proven location is king

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

This shows that Harky gave his bird an advantage come the SNFC YB national by having it at a race the same distance beforehand, however this is one pigeon competing in a race against a few hundred that have all had the same thing 3 or 4 times,of course an inexperienced fit one could hang on to the leaders on occasion as they will be dropping it off on its doorstep.

 

If one fancier who knew what he was about split his young birds into two teams-

 

Team 1 starting at 60miles and racing out to 170miles with three races over 100 miles.

 

Team 2 starting at 120 miles and racing out to 240mile with three races over 200 miles

I’m fairly sure what ones he would fancy come the YB national.

 

I’ve posted on here a few times about how I think the SNFC should do away with the inland nationals and the YB, this is not going to happen by the looks of things-they are here to stay.

 

How do we make them fairer or give ourselves a better chance?Or is it time to admit defeat and stop supporting these events?

 

With only a minority of members of feds interested in these races I can’t see programmes being tailored to suit, so it will have to go on as it is. We can say it is all down to loft location, but in the YB national we are racing against for the most part a totally different beast.Its almost impossible to beat the people racing to the best position from races at these distances,but if played at their own game I'm sure the central belt could get a lot closer.