Kirkpatricks

[hibby]

Any one fly kirkpatrics and have sucess? Thinking of getting the lad I fly with some for christmas try and raise his spirits for next season. I always remember as a young lad watching the White grizzle cock come back from the long race. I know it was his fav so time to re pay the favour for the time and knowledge he invested in me.

[andy Burgess]

Any one fly kirkpatrics and have sucess? Thinking of getting the lad I fly with some for christmas try and raise his spirits for next season. I always remember as a young lad watching the White grizzle cock come back from the long race. I know it was his fav so time to re pay the favour for the time and knowledge he invested in me.

try members "kirky" and "oldyellow" on here .

[hibby]

Ok thanks gents. Don't think Kirky does have any left I believe I pm'd him on another forum yesterday as I seen some of his birds in a thread from last year and they looked top class.

[OLDYELLOW]

I still have Kirkpatricks some are still pure but most have been crossed with either Janssens , Deweerdts and Van Braunes because those crosses are kicking out good birds for me and others Kirky's birds originated from mine which I bought in 92/93

[clockman]

Any one fly kirkpatrics and have sucess? Thinking of getting the lad I fly with some for christmas try and raise his spirits for next season. I always remember as a young lad watching the White grizzle cock come back from the long race. I know it was his fav so time to re pay the favour for the time and knowledge he invested in me.

 

,

Irvin Buchan from Peterhead has been racing successfully with them for years ,

[dal2]

I,ve got them but no grizzles! Just reds, mealies darks and blues with pieds of all!

[Guest Owen]

Asking for a pure Kirkpatrick would be asking for the impossible. How long ago did the big man die?

[andy Burgess]

Asking for a pure Kirkpatrick would be asking for the impossible. How long ago did the big man die?

1954 i believe Owen.

[dal2]

Asking for a pure Kirkpatrick would be asking for the impossible. How long ago did the big man die?

Maybe but could get pretty close I think

[hibby]

How are they comparing to the newer strains, are they better as pure as possible or with a cross? Going to have a look about and see about purchasing maybe a pair of late breds for stock purposes.

[Guest Owen]

Sorry to put the damper on things that people actually believe to be true but there can not be pure Kirkpatricks any more. I accept that there are grizzles and red pieds which look like the sort of thing that Kirkpatrick went for but I reckon it is near impossible for anyone to have kept them pure all this time. And at the standard set by Kirkpatrick.

I used to know a guy that kept pure (his word) Dordins. He had bought the birds from Masion Patients in the very early seventies and had never had a male from any other type in the loft and he was proud of the fact that were pure breds. I don't know if he realised the Dorin continually brought birds into his loft and most of his birds were in fact crosses.

Dordin was a very hard task master and trained his birds hard and asked a lot from them. The guy I knew did not, so obviously regardless of the fact that these birds were bred from within the group of birds from Dordin it was a safe bet that they were not members of the same family in the first place. And they were definitely not selected through rigorous testing as Dorin would have done. So my opinion is that these birds were no where near the sort of birds that Dordin would have kept.

Maybe for the want of a name to describe birds it is fine to call them after a long dead Fancier but the problems start when people actually believe that they are going to perform in a similar way to the originals.

Besides all this I truly believe that the best modern birds are far better than the birds of 50 or so years ago. Perhaps we should consider refering to birds by the name of the current top people so that they get credit for their work.

[billt]

Yes, Owen is right, very hard to describe pigeons as Kirkpatricks nowadays, I moved here 26yrs. ago with them plus Busschaerts and Janssens, I still have ten grizzles which must come from the Kirkys but unraced in all that time, they must be pretty good survivors as mine get hawked on a daily basis but as for racing, who knows

[dal2]

Sorry to put the damper on things that people actually believe to be true but there can not be pure Kirkpatricks any more. I accept that there are grizzles and red pieds which look like the sort of thing that Kirkpatrick went for but I reckon it is near impossible for anyone to have kept them pure all this time. And at the standard set by Kirkpatrick.

I used to know a guy that kept pure (his word) Dordins. He had bought the birds from Masion Patients in the very early seventies and had never had a male from any other type in the loft and he was proud of the fact that were pure breds. I don't know if he realised the Dorin continually brought birds into his loft and most of his birds were in fact crosses.

Dordin was a very hard task master and trained his birds hard and asked a lot from them. The guy I knew did not, so obviously regardless of the fact that these birds were bred from within the group of birds from Dordin it was a safe bet that they were not members of the same family in the first place. And they were definitely not selected through rigorous testing as Dorin would have done. So my opinion is that these birds were no where near the sort of birds that Dordin would have kept.

Maybe for the want of a name to describe birds it is fine to call them after a long dead Fancier but the problems start when people actually believe that they are going to perform in a similar way to the originals.

Besides all this I truly believe that the best modern birds are far better than the birds of 50 or so years ago. Perhaps we should consider refering to birds by the name of the current top people so that they get credit for their work.

Owen

How do you know this? Have you extensively studied the Kirkpatrick story to see what went where and aho was friends with who? Obviously pure bred is an outsider but there are places where you can find excellent examples of the strain. Having been lucky to meet with two or three owners of exceptional colonies over the years have seen their dedication to the family!

Your TRULY held believe that modern strains are better leads me to ask your formula for this sweeping statement?

 

Was just thinking Owen whilst scraping the sh**, obviously it would be mental to NOT introduce a cross! Surely most do it to improve??

If you had a strain of yer own called the OWENS and you crossed in a couple of birds from me they would not change the name of yer strain to OWEN/DAL???

 

If the man likes his Kirkpatricks let him try and find the best specimens he can and he will have great fun whilst doing it safe in the knowledge that the hopes of being related in some ways to the champion doos that fired into Galabank, Annan from France like it was a club race!!!

Best of luck Hibby on yer search, have some fun and meet some enthusiasts

[soupie]

why do all the Kirkpatricks for sale seem to be grizzle, reds etc and not too many blues and cheqs??

 

was mr kirkpatricks loft full of these colours or were these the colors of his main winning pigeons??

 

cheers

 

soupie

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

why do all the Kirkpatricks for sale seem to be grizzle, reds etc and not too many blues and cheqs??

 

was mr kirkpatricks loft full of these colours or were these the colors of his main winning pigeons??

 

cheers

 

soupie

 

Theres an article by Joe Murphy online you should have a look at.It includes photos of Galabank King,Galabank Queen,Galabank Prince,Galabank Supreme and Coronation Express.They are all reds/red chequers with the exception of Coronation Express.

[korhil]

Where can I find the article? Thanks

[korhil]

Found it on elimar,

[OLDYELLOW]

Dream come true , double top all reds

[hibby]

Yeah I've read article on johnny on elmar,a while back, bet there's not to many Belgian birds have to navigate round mountain ranges like Lake District then the borders on the last leg of a 550+ mile race, that's what makes these birds special to me thinking of what they endured. Just when there nearly all burned out they have huge hurdles at the last legs of the race, that's what appeals to me. Plus the fact when I was a boy looking in the widowhood end there was all the blues checqs etc but there he stood in the middle box with his huge wattle the white grizzle cock the only candidate at the time who was capable of flying bourges 580 mile, he had won the club 4 years of the trot topped the fed 2 of those times and was in the top 5 of the Amal and top 20 other 3 times. He was like the special one he just stood out as the father of the loft. As a young lad of 9,10 he was like a super hero pigeon. And I guess it's always stuck.

 

hIbb

[Novice]

Owen

How do you know this? Have you extensively studied the Kirkpatrick story to see what went where and aho was friends with who? Obviously pure bred is an outsider but there are places where you can find excellent examples of the strain. Having been lucky to meet with two or three owners of exceptional colonies over the years have seen their dedication to the family!

Your TRULY held believe that modern strains are better leads me to ask your formula for this sweeping statement?

 

Was just thinking Owen whilst scraping the sh**, obviously it would be mental to NOT introduce a cross! Surely most do it to improve??

If you had a strain of yer own called the OWENS and you crossed in a couple of birds from me they would not change the name of yer strain to OWEN/DAL???

 

If the man likes his Kirkpatricks let him try and find the best specimens he can and he will have great fun whilst doing it safe in the knowledge that the hopes of being related in some ways to the champion doos that fired into Galabank, Annan from France like it was a club race!!!

Best of luck Hibby on yer search, have some fun and meet some enthusiasts

 

Great post Stevie,

 

Correct me if I am wrong but the JKs which remain in the borders are still winning and scoring well in Nationals and are certainly up to the standard of the master.

 

I should also add that the home of Pierre Dordin was Villa Patience.

[dal2]

Great post Stevie,

 

Correct me if I am wrong but the JKs which remain in the borders are still winning and scoring well in Nationals and are certainly up to the standard of the master.

 

I should also add that the home of Pierre Dordin was Villa Patience.

Yip still winning well, What dilution mine are I am not sure but the winning genes are still there which is my point, whatever cross is introduced is the decision of the fancier in control of his family?? And lets face it if he has performed well enough for people to name a strain after him then the knowledge of which cross was right for his pigeons must be assumed correct and a good addition to the gene pool?

[walterbmasson]

Yip still winning well, What dilution mine are I am not sure but the winning genes are still there which is my point, whatever cross is introduced is the decision of the fancier in control of his family?? And lets face it if he has performed well enough for people to name a strain after him then the knowledge of which cross was right for his pigeons must be assumed correct and a good addition to the gene pool?

Stephen the kirkpatricks were well tried up in the far north did well at 500miles but when they were sent to 600mls they were never seen, but back ta the strain pure i bought a youngster off solway king in 1974 when he was 19 year old and one off london doo misty lady and 1 direct off double top,T kirkies he died in the early fifties thats more than 20 years when i bought them i would say well diluted, now Old yellow comes away we pure kirkpatricks 38 years later which takes it up ta 60 bloody years PURE your some stock man when did you start in the doos ? But steve your spot on yours are well diluted and the only way you can keep on with the strain, you start with and keep at the top is keeping the winning genes going into your birds inbreeding and crossing out but you dont expect ta throw any old bird off a pedigree and say its a kirkpatrick or busschaert etc down fall of many fanciers that try the 600miles ? Dont cross anything through your own birds unless there on par with your own birds and the only way to find that oot is the basket ? But always trust your own family if they are not letting you down , this strains have come up on these sites how many times with the same old story a strain is what you make of it as there all dollie mixtures NOW THATS A FACT ?

[PATTY BHOY]

Did Bobby carruthers no have these pigeons?

[billt]

Walter I've got a record of Nan's Pride winning 1st. Open SNFC Nantes 628mls.

[Rooster J. Cogburn]

Did Bobby carruthers no have these pigeons?

 

He had them in some form,but through John Carmichael and Jimmy Callan not direct from Galabank lofts.