Roland

Spencer, it is fine, and I like most would say healthy to disagree, and offer views. Not so to be 'Disagreeable, which I feel may be implied to you. I, for one, certainly don't believe that to be the case. Now that is where most 'Eye Theorist' let their side down They often take umbrage and , or sulk. Only ever knew one that always had a answer in relationship to the 'Eye Theory' and he would always also substantiate with a lot more reasoning on the subject. But one must also remember that there is no 'Code' or 'Practise' let alone a fundemental basis, let alone a mandate! It isn't even scientifically feasible. So then it must be definately the opposite in reaction! That is - to me - the biggest failing in the Eye theory game, that there is no agreed upon basis, or fundemental formatt amongst the so - called experts, which if there was any basis to the ability then there would be. But Spence, no disrespect, but I doubt very much if you will get an answer. Try Albear, for I feel he would definately have an oppinion, and one worth of note.

Where is he from/ and how far radious? I must say that £30 for a returned bird is more than dear.

Only time when a 'Pick me Up' may be needed is when it has had a totally hard day! Never mind the 'Channel' many of them are easy ones, and eve the 8 hours ones would only need three peanuts and water! Yes Glucose / Dextramine etc. are good. But the reason that one should only offer small seeds, with even a little linseed, is because it may have had to dig deep, and as such may have burnt some units off it's muscles. This will - especially with further high Protien or forced exercise over the next few days would become very toxic. Protien in excess is a sure way of putting pioson into the system. And why anyone when a bird has flown out, needing water, they think to use electros a good thing to further dehydrate a birds is beyond me, and the realms of reason! JMO

http://www.albertaclassic.net/hawks/EagleOwl.zip you cn download it and put it straight onto a CD / Dvd or VCD or whatever you want to.

Dehydrates them further I believe. Mollasses ... But the best thing is surely just three peanuts...

Best place for them... you will see and observe more there than anywhere. They will trap from race ok I'd wager. When us natural flyers have birds out, regardless what misleading stories are said, most are in the garden or on a roof top. Learn thm to trap to the Whistle, feed can, rattle or whatever... Jmo.

Do and stick to it... that is obviously a pleasurable way to go... untill he retailiates, and he will. Are you both in the same club?... How about everytime he goes out someone nips in and bonks he's wife eh! Nah, probably be pleased saying him having too ... Probably pays someone already to and he'd be happy saving his money lol.

Well only to be expected I suppose... from Durham eh!!! Say no more lol... just joshing. Personally I honestly believe after I'd ha a quiet word we would be geting on like a 'House on Fire' or he would have probably decided to pack up or move lofts.

Just goes to prove the wisdom of 'Checking' besides taking the word of the smiling feather Merchant. Yes mny are cosha, but a lot more aren't. Not saying owt aboy The Kais of course etc. In fact I have never even heard of them. So trhey could have the first bird to fly from Timbucktoo to queensland for all I know. And I don't know much as you all know lol. About on parr with Al I suppose.... lol

Well I'll be dog gone... it got home in time for it's tea... a day late lol.

Sorry did I write it too fast for you Georgdie... forgot you must be a slow reader...! lol

Nice to hear Bilco. But he has some records still unsurpassed in Belguim I believe...

Don't need no edivence here mucker, no need to tel me fibs, ... I ain't your wife ... Besides why should anyone doubt you!!!!

Well, I sent 8 hens to their first race just 112 miles, had had a couple of 20 mile tosses.... was doing in the upper 1800's, was just in the top 20 with over 400 birds. Winner doing 1920. I had three together other 4 within 3 minutes and that Late return from last year not home. Yes gangster should have given you it lol. Jansenn or no Jansenn, it has probably gone back to it's other home. Will be back as soon as he chucks it... or may just dispose of it. Now that was a waste of corn better spent in this their 'Hotel'.

Not so difficult to 'Firm Up' the droppings! But one has to make sure that they aren't just camaflaging, covering over any problems. Most have seen glorious looking birds empitomty of health ... that aren't fit to fly up to the top perch so to speak.

Getting everything up on NFC. now, no prob...

Don't Mess With Mom! My son came home from school one day, with a smirk upon his face. He decided he was smart enough, to put me in my place. "Guess what I learned in Civics Two, that's taught by Mr. Wright? It's all about the laws today, The 'Children's Bill of Rights.' It says I need not clean my room, don't have to cut my hair No one can tell me what to think, or speak, or what to wear. I have freedom from religion, and regardless what you say, I don't have to bow my head, and I sure don't have to pray. I can wear earrings if I want, and pierce my tongue & nose. I can read & watch just what I like, get tattoos from head to toe. And if you ever spank me, I'll charge you with a crime. I'll back up all my charges, with the marks on my behind. Don't you ever touch me, my body's only for my use, not for your hugs and kisses, that's just more child abuse. Don't preach about your morals, like your Mama did to you. That's nothing more than mind control, And it's illegal too! Mom, I have these children's rights, so you can't influence me, or I'll call Children's Services Division, better known as C.S.D." Mom's Reply and Thoughts Of course my first instinct was to toss him out the door. But the chance to teach him a lesson made me think a little more. I mulled it over carefully, I couldn't let this go. A smile crept upon my face; he's messing with a pro. Next day I took him shopping at the local Goodwill Store... I told him, "Pick out all you want, there's shirts & pants galore. I've called and checked with C.S.D. who said they didn't care if I bought you K-Mart shoes instead of those Nike Airs. I've cancelled that appointment to take your driver's test. The C.S.D. is unconcerned so I'll decide what's best." I said "No time to stop and eat, or pick up stuff to munch. And tomorrow you can start to learn to make your own sack lunch. Just save the raging appetite, and wait till dinner time. We're having liver and onions, a favourite dish of mine." He asked "Can I please rent a movie, to watch on my VCR?" "Sorry, but I sold your TV, for new tires on my car. I also rented out your room; you'll take the couch instead. The C.S.D. requires just a roof over your head. Your clothing won't be trendy now; I'll choose what we eat. That allowance that you used to get, will buy me something neat. I 'm selling off your jet ski, dirt-bike & roller blades. Check out the 'Parents Bill of Rights', It's in effect today! Hey hot shot, are you crying, Why are you on your knees? Are you asking God to help you out, instead of C.S.D..?" Golly, mom's doing what was the thing to do 50 odd years or more lol. Send to all people that have teenagers or have already raised teenagers, or have children who will soon be teenagers or those who will be parents someday OR ANYONE WHO'D JUST GET A LAUGH .I love this One!!! from a MOM (Mean Old Mother) "

Would love a Crack at Rome... but don't think it will happen again. I seriously believe that the East Rd could have som great Libs for the Distnce.

Best was a YB flying Thurso 1989. Bred in June, sent three just under the 500 miles. Was 1st and second bird in the fedand nigh the Midlands... No didn't win it, but the third came home on Xmas Day... Been a day early might not have had Rook Pie for Xmas dinner lol.

One of the best in the WORLD, never mind uk etc. Had a great teacher, and learnt, added and became...

Why don't Champions produce champions equal to or better than themselves? Hardly an eye-sign question but that any eye-sign man should know the answer to. Why?

Now that's enough for now, but another 20 or so to come.

At weaning time, the pigeon man has nothing he can use to determine the true capabilities of his newly raised team except the race basket. The average healthy pigeon looks exactly like the rest and gives little indication that it just might be the elusive Champion we all dream about one day owning. These birds are born almost annually on a regular basis. They are unbeatable and win out of turn under almost any conditions and management systems. Over the years I have made it a point to pay special attention to these birds in an attempt to find out exactly what it is that makes them so different with athletic abilities far and above those of the normal racing pigeon. I have never did discover why they are what they are however, I have discovered that they do share certain eye features. The following is the result of my studies of them over the last 40 years or so. I know of at least 17 of these eye features but of these only five will regularly be found in the eyes of true Champions and most of these can be clearly seen at the very young age of one month old. This is just another way in which the eye-sign man can find himself with a slight advantage over his fellow competitors. In the order of outright value and importance, I shall list them accordingly. No 1 Clusters. No 2 Drifting pigment in the pupil. No 3 Smudges and or wires in the eye. No 4 Combine eye style racing composition. No 5 A flat enamelled looking Iris. Though there are many more signs that depict racing ability, these are the most reliable and by far the most significant pointers to any pending Champion. Taking them in that order, I shall tell you more about each one in turn. The Cluster. I believe I have said enough about these eye's in the past and that they need no further explanation at this point in time. The same applies to the next on the list which is the same eye as the Cluster but in a different stage of development. No 3 Smudges and wire is another thing all together. This is best seen on the Van Breeman site in the eye picture of the bird called KEISER. If you look closely at this eye, you can see that there are dark lines appearing beneath the iris which runs from the inside of the eye near the pupil, out toward the outer edge like spokes in a wheel. These are called smudges and wires. Some times they can be found in large numbers in the eye and on other occasions there are only one or two lines visible. Keisers eye contains several thin lines and these are spread around the eye in various locations. The locations where they are found have no bearing on the bird’s value. These lines also come in another form which is more like a wider dark area beneath the iris and looks more like a dark patch or blob located under the iris and is covered by the pigment of the eye together with the capillaries which form the coloured part of the iris. No 4. This is another of my own discoveries and is called the Combine eye. It's existence was first divulged on this site less than two years ago and since then, I have had literally hundreds of them reported to me from around the world. Where the pigment on the eye-sign ring can be seen to end or stop cleanly and abruptly, and NOT fade away gradually as in the normal eye, this bird will usually be a combine winner for you. There are 19 of them amongst the eyes on the Van Breeman site, can you find them? No 5. The iris of the flying Champion is usually a flat looking iris which looks as if it is made up of many coats of paint as it were. You could even be excused for describing it as being flat and unimpressive. Not quite washed out looking but not far from it. SEE KEISER AGAIN. This is the eye of the that fools most eye-sign men and often turns out to be another discovery of mine I called the Single Tubed eye, which though it has been described before, shall be discussed in detail at a later time when I am able to post pictures of some with my new scanner which is supposed to be especially made for this purpose????? I will also explain why this eye is listed as being No 5 in order of value as a flyer, despite it's reputation as being a smash race winner. The some what brief explanations of the eyes were not originally intended but, I felt I could not in all fairness just post the answers without some kind of explanation of each. I am sorry for the long windedness of them. I trust you enjoy them and gain some more insight into this subject.

The ability to breed good racing offspring has nothing to do with it's flying ability. It is not a detriment of any kind but an attribute or bonus. That's why the dual purpose bird is by far the most important bird of them all. It does everything. The only time the better breeding ability of the one will come to the fore and prove to be better than the other is in the breeding box. Other than that, it's a toss up as to which bird will perform the best. They will alternate from week to week.

Question No 4 How many rings can be found in a pigeons eye and can you name them. I have seen eye's with 11 even 12 rings in them but the real question is. Is this number of rings question really important. The answer is very simple, NO. It isn't a matter of quantity but, quality that really matters. There are 7 basic rings in the eye which the pigeon man should concentrate on and these make up the basis of the entire subject. Starting from the pupil and moving outward toward the outside of the eye, they are called. 1 THE CIRCLE OF ADAPTATION. 2 THE CIRCLE OF CORRELATION OR EYE-SIGN. 3 THE CIRCLE OF SERRATION. 4 THE INNER DUAL CIRCLES OF THE IRIS. 5 THE IRIS PROPER. 6 THE OUTER DUAL CIRCLES. 7 THE VERMAYEN RING OR, THE CIRCLE OF HEALTH. There are people who try from time to time to change these names which were originally given by the discoverers of the subject, but I prefer to use the traditional names which I also feel helps to eliminate any confusion caused by changing the long established and traditional names. The value and significance of each will be discussed at a later time. Questions No 5 and 6. How many circles are there in the Single tubed eye and what makes it so outstanding compared to other eyes. The Single tubed eye was first discovered back in the sixties by me and has in it's short existence proved to be a major break away from the tried and true eye's of the old Masters. At first these eyes I'm sure were discarded by many because of the washed out looking appearance of them. But in my travels looking at birds which had performed far above the norm, I began to realise that this kind of eye was to be found in some truly remarkable birds. To this day they are still among the most sorts after of all eyes and for very obvious reasons. Reliability. They deliver the goods, especially in the harder or tougher smash races. The one thing that distinguishes them from the rest, is the absence of the underlying clear jells like tube in the base of the Iris. The single tubed eye does not display this underlying tube but instead, shows only the top tube which is the blood filled tube that carries blood to the eye which in turn warms and activates the eye. If you look closely at the inner dual circle area of the iris, you can often see, by looking between the gaps of the loosely arranged pattern of the two tubes, each tube quite clearly displayed one on top of the other with the top tube being the only one in which blood is carried to the eye. Why this is so and what the second tube is filled with is unknown. But, when the underlying tube is missing from the eye, then that is a Single Tubed eye. Like all things in this subject, they are easy to recognise with practice. Question No 7. Speed lines, if not the faster birds then what do they signify. Speed lines were first described by a friend of mine who worked for the British Homing World. His job was to travel around England and Europe photographing the eyes and birds of distinction. He was at one time regarded by many as the best in his field and I still use many of his photographs in my seminars. He concluded that the faster birds could be recognised by these lines which radiate out from the centre of the eye like spokes in a wheel. Unfortunately he was wrong. His findings were published in the press and eventually became accepted as being true and accurate through comparisons made with the winningest birds around at the time. So why was he wrong. Most experienced pigeon flyers will agree that not all birds can handle the higher velocities reached in many races throughout a season. These are commonly called, Blow Homes. Often these entail speeds of 100+ MPH. Although we do not know for sure why this is it has been suggested that they are ill equipped for the task in some way or, that they are just plain scarred by the experience. The simple truth is that, we don't know for sure why this is but, this doesn't explain why there are certain birds which do show a REPETITIVE ability to do just that. It was in such birds as these that the speed lines were first discovered and, misinterpreted as signifying the faster birds. They are NOT faster birds but, are the ones with the ability to handle the higher velocities and any claims to the contrary as FALSE. The final conclusion is that speed lines can be used as an indicator of the bird with an ability to handle the higher velocities reached in blow homes but. DON'T BET THE FARM ON IT. It is not all that accurate of a sign.