like i said last week dell you could time a piece of paper in these races no disrespeck to anyone but it makes all the hard work with the latebreds worth it thats why i breed them to play with in these early races and there bred from my best birds another two races ill stop the hens the latebred cocks might go on a bit yet as ive to many cocks but im not going to throw them away and a wins a win m8 il take it when its going lol