Bleach + Cider Vinegar ????

[Guest slugmonkey]

I just heard that if you mix bleach with cider vinegar that it can poisin the birds I dont think that anyone would purposely mix these but I have been known to bleach the drinkers heavily and then use cider vinegar afterwards, I dont give the birds bleach but I am sure that there is a reside and also what about chlorinated water ???

[blaz]

i would never give bleach to my birds or use it on the drinkers.i know a man that does give bleach in some form to his birds.would not be me

[pigeonpete]

Interesting, as i do the same, always rinse well, but like you say could be bits left over.

[Guest slugmonkey]

I wouldt give bleach either but a lot do

[Guest stb]

read the bottle. warning . bleach is toxic.

 

some modern bleaches have chemicals in them to make them stick to surfaces.

 

by allmeans wash your drinkers with plain thin bleach and rinse well but dont put it in water for birds.

my mrs is food saftey officer and they test food for chemicals bacteria foreighn bodies etc.

 

she says bleach in water is not good

[JB STAINFORTH]

unless im wrong isnt there a little bleach in milton used to steralise babies bottles about 2 percent i think

[edwards]

it all depends lads on the bleach you use very important and yes it is used to disenfect the birds gut thin bleach is used at a rate of 1 teaspoon to 3 pints of warter and left over night with the birds thin bleach kills viruses in the gut certain ones i use it once a week mate but you have being told thin bleach and nothing else.

[Guest slugmonkey]

I see another bleach vs vinegar thread going  LOL

[Guest stb]

yip your right but u rinse the bottles well after with boiling water and you dont put it in there bottles.

[breakaway]

know a fancier who gives his birds neat bleach  via a syringe  , to kill salmonella etc   without any probs, and he,s a good flyer!

[Novice]

I worked in a plant which manufactured bleach and it must be treated with respect.

It is a toxic chemical.  I avoid it at all costs.

Without looking at a book to confirm this I believe mixing it with cider or any other vinegar----all vinegar is basically acetic acid--will liberate free chlorine which is toxic.

 

To the guy who syringes it over the throats---I wonder if he would perform even better not doing this?

[Guest stb]

know a fancier who gives his birds neat bleach  via a syringe  , to kill salmonella etc   without any probs, and he,s a good flyer!

neat blech would burn the skin of them. if you dont beleive try a tespoon youself

 

(puke)(puke)(puke)

[blaz]

when i first started racing birds i always,s cleaned my drinkers thoroughly.till i visited a top flyer near me .i seen his drinkers thy where all near green with algae .so i asked why he told me the bacteria build up is beneficial to the birds so now i dont clean with any detergents what so ever. as for giving bleach  would you drink it.

[edwards]

why do certain vet fanciers use thin bleach i asked this question and the answer was mixed right once a week only and thin bleach not thick it helps the gut stay free of certain bad bacteria the use it on other birds other than pigeons mate but vinegar mixed with it sounds strange cider vinegar only helps acidfye  the crop .

[chickadee]

If you Google "bleach" you will find there are many different types, i used Milton which is used to steralise babies bottles so they can't all be the same

 

http://chemistry.about.com/od/chemistryfaqs/f/bleach.htm

 

There are several types of bleach. Chlorine bleach usually contains sodium hypochlorite. Oxygen bleach contains hydrogen peroxide or a peroxide-releasing compound such as sodium perborate or sodium percarbonate. Bleaching powder is calcium hypochlorite. Other bleaching agents include sodium persulfate, sodium perphosphate, sodium persilicate, their ammonium, potassium and lithium analogs, calcium peroxide, zinc peroxide, sodium peroxide, carbamide peroxide, chlorine dioxide, bromate, and organic peroxides (e.g., benzoyl peroxide).

 

While most bleaches are oxidizing agents, other processes can be used to remove color. For example, sodium dithionite is a powerful reducing agent that can be used as a bleach.

 

[greenlands]

If your using bleach when cleaning your drinkers and you think it might not be safe for the birds,have a read of this.

 

                                                 A GIFT FROM MOTHER NATURE

Grapefruit Seed Extract has proved to be effective in combating hundreds of pathogens that affect birds, including parasites, bacteria, viruses, and fungi. This inexpensive substance is used by aviculturists, pet bird owners, and veterinarians. It is a safe, natural disinfectant and cleaner that can be used to prevent mould growth on home-grown sprouts as well as to clean cages, aviaries, and homes. Surprisingly, this powerful product is made from grapefruit seeds. The antimicrobial properties of the extract of grapefruit seeds and pulp were discovered in 1972 by Jacob Harish, a physicist and immunologist, as a result of his curiosity about the bitterness of grapefruit seeds. At the University of Georgia, tests were conducted to evaluate Grapefruit Seed Extract (GSE) as a disinfectant in tests against E. Coli, Salmonella sps, and Staph aureus. According to Roger Wyatt, Ph.D., and Microbiologist for the university, "Our studies indicate excellent potential for these products (GSE). ...The toxicology reports that I reviewed indicated that this product poses very low toxicity risk, which is important because most disinfectants currently used in either animal or human environments have moderate to high toxicity ratings and care must be exercised when these products are used... In view of the reports that we have discussed, the wide spectrum of activity that GSE offers (antiviral, antibacterial; Gram positive and Gram negative, antimycotic, and antiprotozoan) will undoubtedly aid in its acceptability.†Some physicians have found that GSE is as effective against candida, a yeast infection, as Nystatin or other antifungal preparations. It is also effective against protozoans such as giardia or entamoeba histolytica. Researcher Dr. Leo Galland wrote that it is more effective than prescription medicines such as metronidazole against these protozoal parasites. As a germicide, GSE has multiple uses and it is non-toxic and non-irritating when diluted as directed.Bio Research Laboratories of Redmond, Washington, USA, tested GSE, a commercial chlorine bleach, and colloidal silver against Candida albicans, Staphylococcus aureus, Salmonella typhi, Streptococcus faecium, and E. coli. The test report concluded that GSE proved superior."All micro organisms tested were inhibited with moderate levels of GSE liquid disinfectant. High levels of chlorine bleach inhibited the test organisms, but moderate levels were not effective. Because the GSE liquid was inhibitory at much lower levels, it may be assumed that it is ten to one hundred times more effective than chlorine against the organisms used in this study. On average, GSE proved to be ten times more effective than the colloidal silver."GSE is compatible with most antibiotics and the manufacturers state that it does not produce the negative side effects associated with antibiotic use. Proponents of GSE claim that it does not attack normal gastrointestinal bacteria as antibiotics do, which has proven to be true in my aviary. A probiotic can be given after treating giardia with therapeutic dosages of GSE. Even if it isn't unnecessary, it will do no harm. GSE rarely if ever causes allergic or toxic reactions. Aspirin is said to be 25 times more toxic than GSE.According to The Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine, Volume 5, No. 3, USA, 1990, an international research team examined the effect of GSE on 770 strains of bacteria and 93 strains of fungus and compared this with 30 effective antibiotics and 18 proven fungicides. GSE was found to perform as well as any and all of the tested agents.

GSE USES AND DILUTION RECOMMENDATIONS

•     To disinfect surfaces in the aviary and nursery such as brooders, incubators, cages, perches, and carriers, make an all purpose cleaner by adding 30 to 60 drops of GSE to a 32-ounce pump spray bottle filled with water. Mix well and spray.

•     To disinfect wood surfaces, apply a few drops of GSE to the cleaned wood while still wet. Let stand for half an hour.

•     To clean formula from baby parrots' faces and feathers after syringe feedings, add a few drops of GSE to a bowl of warm water to wet the cleaning cloth. It kills bacteria and gets the skin and feathers squeaky clean.

•     To sterilize syringes, pipettes, spoons, and other hand feeding utensils, make a solution of 15 to 30 drops of GSE per pint of water. Soak between feedings.

•     To make your own antibacterial soap for the nursery and kitchen, add ten to fifteen drops of GSE to an eight-ounce pump dispenser of hand soap.

•     To make a disinfectant soak for produce, add 10 to15 drops of GSE per gallon of water and submerge the fruits and vegetables for 15 to 30 seconds.

•     To make a disinfectant spray for produce, add 20 or more drops to a quart spray bottle and spray on fruits and vegetables.

•     To prevent the growth of algae and mould in incubators and humidifiers, add three or four drops of GSE per gallon to the water reservoir.

•     To clean and disinfect cutting boards, apply 10 to 20 drops of GSE to the cutting board. Rub it into the board with a wet sponge or cloth. Leave the GSE on for at least 30 minutes and rinse.    

•     To purify water, add 10 drops of GSE per gallon of water and stir vigorously. It is more effective     than iodine.    

•     To treat skin fungi, parasites, or bacterial diseases of the skin of birds and other pets, mix 30 to 50 drops of GSE per quart of water and spray on the infected area.    

•     To boost the cleaning power of dishwasher detergent for bird dishes, add 15 to 30 drops of GSE to the dishwasher along with detergent.    

•     To disinfect towels and cloths used for baby parrots, add 30 to 50 drops to the wash cycle, or add 10 to 15 drops of GSE to the final rinse to ensure that the laundry is fungi and bacteria free.    

To disinfect carpet in bird rooms, add 10 to 15 drops of GSE per gallon of water to the reservoir of the carpet cleaning machine. During hot weather in outdoor aviaries, pathogens grow quickly in drinking water once organic matter has been introduced by food-covered beaks or food dunking. To prevent bacterial infections, I use one drop of GSE per large cup of drinking water when I must be away from home and cannot change the water when needed. I credit this practice with helping to prevent illness and I have never had any indication that it adversely affects my birds' health. Water bottles also can be contaminated by dirty beaks or food stuffed into the opening of the drinking tube. I prefer to use a food based preventive substance than chlorine or other harsh disinfectants. Otherwise, I follow the advice of veterinarians and other avian experts who recommend that parrots be provided pure, clean drinking water without additives such as vitamin products, medication, or disinfectants. Any substance that changes the taste of water can discourage birds from drinking. This can cause dehydration which is a life threatening condition so it's a good idea to give birds extra fruits, vegetables, and melons in hot weather for their high moisture content.I don't sell Grapefruit Seed Extract or profit from its sale in any way, but I definitely am sold on GSE for bird keeping.Citricidal® liquid concentrate is triple the potency of NutriBiotic® GSE liquid. For online information about GSE or Citricidal, visit www.nutriteam.com or other web sites that can be found with an Internet search.

Why take chances if your not sure.

Lindsay C.

 

 

 

 

[pjc]

interesting Lindsay

[REDCHEQHEN]

Grapefruitseed extract - I wouldn't call it inexpensive

 

Enviroclenz is good - and costs about the same for 1 litre as Grapefruitseed extract does for 100ml

[pjc]

Grapefruitseed extract - I wouldn't call it inexpensive

 

Enviroclenz is good - and costs about the same for 1 litre as Grapefruitseed extract does for 100ml

 

Like a lot of things, probably inexpensive to produce but limited market so sold at a premium.

 

 

[Guest HighSpeedLofts]

bleach mixed with vinegar (acid) will produce mustard gas which will suck all the oxygen out your lofts and kill your birds

[Guest strapper]

just to let everyone know...a very respected vet in america(pigeon fancier) once stated that he gives a t spoon of bleach in the water from time to time...quite regular.

he was the only person in his club not to contract youngbird sickness .

its well known that some medications have toxics in them but at a low dose.

toxcins kill germs...how many give their birds the purple powder stuff in the birds bath water?

 

although i havent this year as much i have given bleach in the past and found no ill effects. each to their own as they say.

you have to understand that given in quantity it will no doubt effect the bird...this is why there are dose advice on ANY medication....which will effect you if taken in extreme.

cider vinegar or garlic would be laughed at and dismissed at people not in the know,if not known to be given to our birds.

[just ask me]

cant imagine how the full strength bleach could have a positive effect on the stomach of a bird  i can see why people would want to use Milton which is a very mild bleach but the full strength stuff im not sure dont people unblock drains with the stuff on garlic and cider vinegar there are certain studies that show that these have certain benefits to pigeons i wonder can the bleach users show a study where this would have positive effects on a bird

[Guest IB]

As far as I know, bleach is a chemical and (usually) alkaline, and you are not supposed to mix anything with bleach, nor are you supposed to mix chemicals. Cider vinegar is an acid, and when you mix acid + alkili, you get a gas given off, usually harmful to life.

 

Bleach in drinking water is to kill bacteria etc in the water, won't do the same in the bird. Same applies to us humans, we have it in our drinking water to kill bacteria etc in the water, but it doesn't prevent us from falling sick with the likes of bacterial food poisoning, does it?

 

[Guest slugmonkey]

what about feeding gse or just the seeds ???

[Guest strapper]

cant imagine how the full strength bleach could have a positive effect on the stomach of a bird  i can see why people would want to use Milton which is a very mild bleach but the full strength stuff im not sure dont people unblock drains with the stuff on garlic and cider vinegar there are certain studies that show that these have certain benefits to pigeons i wonder can the bleach users show a study where this would have positive effects on a bird

 

info for you....

 

Article on Bleach in Drinking Water

 

In March 1985 a personal friend of mine, Mr. Ralph Bevan, in an interview with Mr. Ralph V. Forbes for the Racing Pigeon Facts International, wrote one of the best aids to good form according to Ralph is the proper use of bleach in the water.  Some years ago Ralph experimented with it in the drinking water and the bath water.  He noticed his birds feathering became silkier as the days went by.  He added 3 drops of bleach to a gallon of drinking water and 1 capful of bleach to a 5 gallons of bath water.   Further to this study in the late '90's, Dr. David Marx also used bleach in his bird's drinking water everyday.  His dosage is 1 teaspoon per gallon of water.   He feels that it makes the droppings of the birds very acidic, therefore the birds are less likely to pick up any diseases such as Cocci or Canker.  He stresses NOT to use anything else when using bleach and only use bleach with no additives.  If you must give vitamins or medication of any type just stop the bleach until you have finished the vitamins or medication then you can start the bleach again.    

 

dr david marx very well respected in his field.