Feeding Time

[Dave barrie]

whats the reason then robbie, members mebbe not havin enough left after training to go to many races mebbe?

[Roland]

True Delboy. But then fanciers will spend a fortune on birds, feeds etc. but won't raise as much as a eye brow to try and sort out a way forward.

Me! Well I/we are lucky here about. Had a Peregrine - I hear - at the Royal hotel... but moved on after 2 or 3 days.

Was one I hear too a little while back, but seems to have gone now. Hear tale we may have a Goshawk or two, but never have seen them.

Now in the BHW Rag we see letters and even the RPRA say that at Portland the Percy will line up race days --- likewise now Kingsdown.

Yet when we put in to have a ne course, or road it is boo hooed with silly sayings like 'They are every where' 'Why they will soon find out after a release of two'. Meaning 'A new lib site may favour others and they wish to defend their patch .... regardless of costs.

By the way I don't send to the lib sites.

Now I ask myself. When I speak to fanciers in the other side of coast it would appear it to be a far better and safer route.

Gosh the RSPB ETC. must laugh themselves to sleep saying ' You want us to curtain and work to save your' birds when you won't even consider helping yourselves I SHOULD CO -COA'... 'You are a Joke'.

[geordie1234]

Aye Phil that's exactly what I am saying. The will get basket trained but only 3 will go road training and only because I feel obliged to give the ppl who's birds I am racing in the competitions the best opportunity of winning a prize.

Couldn't care less if I am last every week in Yb racing am just not feeding the predators midweek when it is completely unnecessary.

 

Dam of Told You So, no training or racing as a Yb and won 3 races and a wallet of money as a yearling. Bred off her at end of season and Told You So was her latebred son. No training or racing as a Yb. Scored in Yrlg Derby and won £388 outa Maidstone carrying 4 nest flights. Stayed with me for 5 seasons winning over £3k.

Equipoise, latebred G/ Dght of TYS, untrained/raced as Yb won the Sec fae SNFC Ypres and a wallet of money. Also 12thSec 70th Bovingdon SNFC.

 

Training IS OVER RATED. The proof is above.

John that's the difference you don't want to win a yb race for people who do want to win yb races I think it's 100% necessary

[Roland]

I believe, sincerely, that too many think of a pigeon as being human. In their field they are classes above us in knowledge, instincts etc.

Further I believe that many myths are boosted because certain traits, beliefs being so - call good and a proven success should in reality be laid at another door. Because what is thought, believed has no real merit, by has passed on time after time till it is the normal to believe and one is able to point a finger as proof..

[Delboy]

I believe, sincerely, that too many think of a pigeon as being human. In their field they are classes above us in knowledge, instincts etc.

Further I believe that many myths are boosted because certain traits, beliefs being so - call good and a proven success should in reality be laid at another door. Because what is thought, believed has no real merit, by has passed on time after time till it is the normal to believe and one is able to point a finger as proof..

 

Good post Roland. Maybe its time we tried something different rather than follow the so called proven methods, just to see what happens.

[Roland]

I tried one season - granted with old birds, a system based on a Ricky Mardis system.

Simply they were out. Only Saturday / race days.

First race Thurso 479 miles. I won one club and 2nd in another the others filling the places behind them. - I only ever bother to time in one bird... unless arrives with another loft mate.... 7 of the only 9 day birds locally. This on feeding only to achieve the results.

 

Now as you may have read, I just send the y/bs to a race was usually the 4th race at 140 mile Northallerton ... no training. Saves on losses and fuel etc.

AND Losses to the B.O.P. - many just train every day 10 miles, some 20.

But before any one boo hoo's this, or are sceptical I will just say 'If not tried, then leave it at that.

Maybe it is time for us to put our house in order! Stop breeding for losses and think out a new regime. Because if one thing is certain the present way is very costly in losses and expence.

[geordie1234]

You would not win a yb race in my club or fed with no yb training...if you don't want to win fair enough

[kingziemckay]

i would rather get good returns,not worry about winning crappy tickets,

[geordie1234]

i would rather get good returns,not worry about winning crappy tickets,

I think well shooled ybs would give you better returns?

[Roland]

You would not win a yb race in my club or fed with no yb training...if you don't want to win fair enough

 

And you know this because you, and others, have tried it! Or is it because you listen to myths, fads, and so - called proven past events by those of long ago.

Have a once a national winner in our club that states 'If naturals aren't hammered up the road regularly then you will be far behind .... But does well not training lol.

Another top fancier, with a wealth of winners and experience, laughs when he hears 'My birds are tearing up the skies ... Be far better in the loft saving their energy for the race ahead.

[geordie1234]

And you know this because you, and others, have tried it! Or is it because you listen to myths, fads, and so - called proven past events by those of long ago.

Have a once a national winner in our club that states 'If naturals aren't hammered up the road regularly then you will be far behind .... But does well not training lol.

Another top fancier, with a wealth of winners and experience, laughs when he hears 'My birds are tearing up the skies ... Be far better in the loft saving their energy for the race ahead.

 

 

I've tried both and my YOUNGBIRD performances are better when I train FACT

You show me a man in Lanarkshire fed who wins out of turn with ybs without training I'll show you a liar

 

Now oldbirds and so on is completely different but we are discussing yb racing

Edited July 12, 2016 by geordie1234

[Roland]

Fine Georgie, but as I know very little of the Lanarkshire fed, I of course can't, so I'll pass. BUT I know many that HAVE won with first time in Basket Y/B'S, including me! Yes and several others. Yes and fed wins.

Of course O/B's is different as they have what! experience? ... Experience of WHAT? Flying? How to fly? Locations afar afield? I don't think so.

When released they hone into a direction heading for home. Hardly seeing anything as the last ditch hedge hopping, swerving around and over houses. They don't race as such, but fly at a speed they are comfortable with, with a little turn of speed if needs be. Some tire quicker than others etc. hence first to time in. We know that they fly in a arc for instance. Also that they zig - zag. One won't see this when they zoom over head of course as the distance won't show.... Yes granted it is notice sometime at speed.

So what is this Experience one craves about? They can fly the distance times over and get lost at 5 miles.

So as y/b's will home at 7 weeks etc. What have they to learn? Nothing that we can teach them that's a fact. They, after roaming, are more than race fit.

So I believe we are again relating to as a 'Human' context.

[Roland]

I'll ask, how many are conscious of their mental health before training? Let alone when entering a race.

[Roland]

Baroness Young in her capacity as Chief Executive of the RSPB proposed that we try taste aversion.

Basically we should fly pigeons which don't taste very nice to predators. Perhaps her proposal should be acted on.

 

What do you suggest? The juice of the Rhubarb leaves, or a pain killer splashed over them.

[geordie1234]

Unfortunately Roland I'm not a pigeon psychologist so dont know how there mental health is

[Delboy]

Fine Georgie, but as I know very little of the Lanarkshire fed, I of course can't, so I'll pass. BUT I know many that HAVE won with first time in Basket Y/B'S, including me! Yes and several others. Yes and fed wins.

Of course O/B's is different as they have what! experience? ... Experience of WHAT? Flying? How to fly? Locations afar afield? I don't think so.

When released they hone into a direction heading for home. Hardly seeing anything as the last ditch hedge hopping, swerving around and over houses. They don't race as such, but fly at a speed they are comfortable with, with a little turn of speed if needs be. Some tire quicker than others etc. hence first to time in. We know that they fly in a arc for instance. Also that they zig - zag. One won't see this when they zoom over head of course as the distance won't show.... Yes granted it is notice sometime at speed.

So what is this Experience one craves about? They can fly the distance times over and get lost at 5 miles.

So as y/b's will home at 7 weeks etc. What have they to learn? Nothing that we can teach them that's a fact. They, after roaming, are more than race fit.

So I believe we are again relating to as a 'Human' context.

 

Im enjoying this thread, its what Pigeon Basics is about, opinions without hidden agendas or nastiness. The beauty of the pigeon game is that nothing is set in stone . Basically, if we asked all the top pigeon fliers in the Uk about their systems, they would all contradict each other. That's what makes the sport intriguing.

[Delboy]

I'll ask, how many are conscious of their mental health before training? Let alone when entering a race.

 

We know racing is all about confidence so I agree with you on this Roland, the birds mental health must be spot on or its a waste of time.

[geordie1234]

Fat chance of doos being mentally fit when doo men are bongo lol

[Delboy]

Fat chance of doos being mentally fit when doo men are bongo lol

 

hahahhahaa

[Roland]

Delboy, the simple logic, and it is a fact, it is the same for pigeons, horses etc. or any athlete. One has to be equally Mentally and Physically fit to be 'Fighting Fit' or super form etc.

Not to use a 'Human' trait lightly, and not back tracking on fanciers treating their birds as Humans. But in this case the element is exactly the same. Fighting Fit... Fit Fighting weight. A boxer can't be fighting fit if a little over weight ... nor mentally not fit. One has to gain and know their best weight. Mine was 10 stone 2lb up to 20 years of age. Then 10stone 6 lb. If I had worries, or getting married (lol) etc. weight would fluctuate and form would go down. No matter if weight was above or below, same thing one couldn't be 100% fit.

Hence before any one trains a bird, for instance the bird has to be mentally fit. Best observation of course has to be when they are out and about. One will see in minutes what others won't in a life time. ... I'd wager now that nigh all will say, or know 'Gosh the way that bird acted I just Knew he was on song ... Next week he gets bullied say, loses his perch, or nest mate etc. and it's form dips badly.

Remember a realistic fact, for animal, birds or man 'A fit man trains to get fitter'. One can't train to get fitter unless fit in the first place. Takes too long as the body takes no notice till one becomes NATURAULLY fit.

the bird that is always second perch from the top suddenly becomes better when the bird is lost / removed from the top spot. Pecking order needs to be taken note of too. Mentally fit etc.

[Guest johnhunter]

Delboy, the simple logic, and it is a fact, it is the same for pigeons, horses etc. or any athlete. One has to be equally Mentally and Physically fit to be 'Fighting Fit' or super form etc.

Not to use a 'Human' trait lightly, and not back tracking on fanciers treating their birds as Humans. But in this case the element is exactly the same. Fighting Fit... Fit Fighting weight. A boxer can't be fighting fit if a little over weight ... nor mentally not fit. One has to gain and know their best weight. Mine was 10 stone 2lb up to 20 years of age. Then 10stone 6 lb. If I had worries, or getting married (lol) etc. weight would fluctuate and form would go down. No matter if weight was above or below, same thing one couldn't be 100% fit.

Hence before any one trains a bird, for instance the bird has to be mentally fit. Best observation of course has to be when they are out and about. One will see in minutes what others won't in a life time. ... I'd wager now that nigh all will say, or know 'Gosh the way that bird acted I just Knew he was on song ... Next week he gets bullied say, loses his perch, or nest mate etc. and it's form dips badly.

Remember a realistic fact, for animal, birds or man 'A fit man trains to get fitter'. One can't train to get fitter unless fit in the first place. Takes too long as the body takes no notice till one becomes NATURAULLY fit.

the bird that is always second perch from the top suddenly becomes better when the bird is lost / removed from the top spot. Pecking order needs to be taken note of too. Mentally fit etc.r u mental lol

[Novice]

What do you suggest? The juice of the Rhubarb leaves, or a pain killer splashed over them.

No Roland I was thinking of something slightly stronger. Application on the skin behind the neck would suffice.

[Guest johnhunter]

No Roland I was thinking of something slightly stronger. Application on the skin behind the neck would suffice.

the chest area would be even better

[moscow master]

If only pigeon racing was as easy as just breeding them let them out for a fly put them to the racing and win everything mmmm going on the logic of this no schooling or training am going out tomorrow at lunchtime to buy a set of clubs and nip over to Troon and win the open this week canny be that hard !!! Wonder if top athletes boxers etc just decided acht I'll be world champion couple of sparring sessions that do me 😂😂

[Delboy]

If only pigeon racing was as easy as just breeding them let them out for a fly put them to the racing and win everything mmmm going on the logic of this no schooling or training am going out tomorrow at lunchtime to buy a set of clubs and nip over to Troon and win the open this week canny be that hard !!! Wonder if top athletes boxers etc just decided acht I'll be world champion couple of sparring sessions that do me 😂😂

 

I don't think Roland was saying that they don't need to be fit Ricky, hes saying they don't need road trained. Fitness can be gained around the loft.