Preparation for 500miles+

[sapper756]

Hi folks lets get back to PIGEONS

I would like to ask, what preparations do fanciers take, when planning to send a hen/cock to a race over 500miles?

 

1. When do you pair these birds?

2. Do you allow them to rear youngsters, if so how many rounds?

3. How many races prior to the big race, and what sort of distances are these races?

4. What do you feed, and do you alter it, as the big race gets nearer?

5. What, nest condition for (a) hens, ( cocks?

6. What is your routine on the day of basketing?

 

Cheers Lads and Lassies

[Guest asha]

Hi Strapper,How long`s a piece of string!!!!,

[OLDYELLOW]

1 ) i race on widowhood and pair either after Blackpool and before the 14th of febuary , i then will pair 48 hours before the race

2) one round of ybs is reared by the race team be it one or two ybs  , but i only get one chance at it sometimes they havent been reared from and still flown well but i think there bond with the loft and box strenghtens after rearing

3)i start these birds about 4 races into the season and like a couple of channel crossings into them then plenty of tosses on there own to get them used to flying alone then a short inland race prior to the 500 mile race

4) I use a few mixes mainly Versa Laga superwidowhood , small seeds ,peanuts and hulled sunflowerseeds i feed according to there staus if resting i feed light if racing i feed the better fuel i dont want my birds performing during the week but at the weekend  

5) they will be technicaly driving but i still class this as been widowhood

6) i feed then bath the birds helps relax them they can eat all they want as most of the feeding will be done when there away

7) great questions

[Guest asha]

Really it`s not so much distance,time on wing is the real question here,and how to prepare for it,Time does something to a pigeons heart,i mean mentally,something happens,it`s as thou they hit a brick wall,i`ve seen it happen with real good sprint lads,step up class into longer stuff,and with wind up their ass can pull off great result,but year after same birds same distance wind against them,brickwall time.

[OLDYELLOW]

my birds are hard day birds so i actualy wish for head winds but if no head wind they fly just as good  

[Guest asha]

I know what you mean old yellow,but time destroys,honest to god,as you say,yours are good hard day birds,but when they day comes they worked 10-12 hours,down,then back up next morning for another good days fly,90% at least would be finished. i`m not saying yours,i`m talking general like.I suppose it just breaks them mentally.

[OLDYELLOW]

some birds are actualy better for having a night out my uncle said most of his good birds when he was flying had nights out , but theres some strains if you dont get on the day there gone and just give up , pigeons at this  distances must have a great heart and a bond to the loft to enable this kind of flying and the lactic acid that must build up during flyte must be tremendous

[Tony C]

Hi folks lets get back to PIGEONS

I would like to ask, what preparations do fanciers take, when planning to send a hen/cock to a race over 500miles?

 

1. When do you pair these birds?

2. Do you allow them to rear youngsters, if so how many rounds?

3. How many races prior to the big race, and what sort of distances are these races?

4. What do you feed, and do you alter it, as the big race gets nearer?

5. What, nest condition for (a) hens, ( cocks?

6. What is your routine on the day of basketing?

 

Cheers Lads and Lassies

 

Who's the best distance flyers on the site? I would like to hear how their opinions differ if indeed they do.

[Guest]

my birds are hard day birds so i actualy wish for head winds but if no head wind they fly just as good  

 

Mark I think you make a very interesting comment. A comment that tends to be the watchword of long distance fanciers, in that they wish for hard days.

Now what I am about to write is theory on my part but based on my practical study of the eye. The problem we have is that we rarely have tough hard day races on the south road at 500/700 miles. Not even Barcelona!!! What beats most birds from 550 mile + is not the conditions but the actual distance. The bird physiologically is not equipped to race that far. It may be a super pigeon perhaps the Steve Ovett of pigeons a multiple winner at 300 mile but has not the physiology to get 10,000 metres or the marathon.

We all dream about the only bird on the day (I had the only 2 on the day from 473 mile this year, though the competition in terms of numbers was poor) and that tends to happen either because it is tough but more invariably because you are at the time limit for timing on the day. On the south rd early season you may get north in the wind and then it does turn tough but these early races are not the distance ones. By the time you get to June / July 9 times out of ten the wind will have south in it, so it is a help. The continental strains have been bred to take advantage of this, they have been bred to fly with the wind at velocities around 1200 at 700 mile, the prevailing sw on a Barcelona race is a great help for them where as for us well, if you live in Kent, East Anglia East coast you have a much better chance, a because the drag has pulled the birds up through the NE France and when they cross the channel , it's only a few mile. For the birds in the west they have to dog leg and add in many instances a few hundred mile to their actual journey and if you happen to have that outstanding pigeon that has broken and stayed on line up the West of France, in effect continually fighting in to the west in the wind to stay on line the bird then has over 100 mile of sea to get over. When I look in the eye of the 500/700 miler in this country I can see the dominance of the continental pigeons especially the jan aardens of Massarella. They are faster pigeons than the good old fashioned British strains that would excel at 1000yd -. Those strains were developed in my opinion two ways. Firstly on the North Road, the North Roaders particularly flying in to the west flew in to headwinds and that's where the hard day pigeons were founded. The Lerwick pigeons comicg down to Plymouth must have had fantastic constitution. The sw distance fanciers who flew Lerwick one week and Bordeaux 2/3 weeks later withn the same pigeons must have been some of the finest distance fanciers in the world. They had a breed of pigeon that you refer to Mark that will come on any day. I have recently bought a pigeon (very cheap) with NRCC winners from Thurso and Lerwick at grandparent level (waiting for it). I bought it on the basis that even though Lerwick is only 500 miles for the breeder, it is a hell of a race spot, with often 250 mile of water to fly and more often than not a partial head wind, I am hoping that this pigeon will have that bit of grit to put into some lovely 500/700 mile distance hens that I have but that are more good day pigeon than hard.

The second way they were developed was on the south road by 'poor' liberations. I use the word 'poor' not as a criticism but the reality was 30/40+ years ago race controllers/liberators did not have the technical support the modern day convoyers have, so often birds would be liberated in conditions that on route became very hard and only the toughest got home. I realise for many what I write can be an absolute bore, I apologise to them. But when I sit down the stuff just spews out, I have a basic principle thought in my mind and then try to explain it.

Getting back to the question as a (half successful) long distance novice

1 Feb 28 last year, not sure this year whether 14th or 28th, I missed the first few races last year and had to jump them in to 100 mile to get them going.

2 One round let them lay again and took hen away at 8/10 days sitting, though am considering taking the yb and hen away when the yb is 12 day old.

3 All inland races, then if they are only going to 500 mile every fortnight channel race, if they are going to Tarbes / Barcelona 3 / 4 week rest then a 50 mile toss Saturday before basketing.

4 Fed Irish mix all racing season no breakdown, 2oz hemp per eight birds and half dozen peanuts per bird, 5 days prior to basketing once channel racing starts. Probiotic and cod liver oil two days in last 5, rehydration salts in water day before basketing, clear day of basketing .

5 Widowhood every race, never pairing, showed hen on basketing.

6 Birds kept in, fed one ounce Irish, then double hemp and peanuts, left for half an hour, then removed any food left. Hens let in to cocks, cocks taken away when hen is standing over cock, never (if I can help it!) let them tread.

 

[OLDYELLOW]

great post Albear i also buy north road birds in that have flown Lerwick to add to my old strains these range from 420 mile to 500 mile winners

[Roland]

Good post Albear.

You have hit the nail on the head where I always say that North is by far the harder road, and I fly both.

Single tossing strengthens the heart.

Home contentment from a very early age, just lots of piddling about and leisure time creates, as far as I am concerned the all important 'Want to be Home' syndrome.

Now t me, that is by far the most important vasis of a distance pigeon, creating their want and contentment of their home. healthy / condition etc. are then of course very important.... But without the first part, the others won't apply.... well not on a hard day or the distance they need that want to be home factor first. Everything else, a far as I'm concerned is a bonus. And of course you want a 'Good' pigeon, but that goes surely without saying.

Soon have a team that 'Home' getting them to race on the other hand needs the traits put into place straight off. Like when they nip back from one appartment to the next where you find them in their old nest box... That to me is the first test, seldom seen any good birds that didn't. JMO

[Roland]

And must add that it is the BIRDS' proven constition that is all important- whether to hone if possible and certainly when buying.

[jimmy white]

Hi folks lets get back to PIGEONS

I would like to ask, what preparations do fanciers take, when planning to send a hen/cock to a race over 500miles?

 

1. When do you pair these birds?

2. Do you allow them to rear youngsters, if so how many rounds?

3. How many races prior to the big race, and what sort of distances are these races?

4. What do you feed, and do you alter it, as the big race gets nearer?

5. What, nest condition for (a) hens, ( cocks?

6. What is your routine on the day of basketing?

 

Cheers Lads and Lassies

 

hi sapper ,, good to get back to the birds,, many good posts on this thread,,ol try my pennies worth

1,,, 90 days b4 intended race [varying on systems and bird]

2 allow them to rear two yb,s

3,,,,3 to 4 races for a mature pigeon with 5 to 600 miles in mind

4   feeding would again depend on system,, but would increase protein then last week high carboheydrate,, yeast tabs down them each second day

5 again depending on system,, natural sitting 10 days,, cocks or hens ,,w/hood to suit the individual bird

6  again depending on system but if natural , keep to the same routine,, pure water ,,a must ,,,normal feed high carbo

 

the bird must have it in it,  to cope with this flight, i,e breeding, and showing signs of comming in a hard race, would emphazise [ big word spelt wrong ]  personally prefer the bird to have done 8 hours on the wing a few weeks prior to sending,,, just rattled this off quickly     hope you do well o9,,, all the very best jimmy

[Guest LBuddle]

1. When do you pair these birds?

** between the 1st and 14th of Feb.

2. Do you allow them to rear youngsters, if so how many rounds?

**every pair of racers breeds one round. We like the good racers to have two rounds of babys so we foster thir first round to a pair of yearlings then they bring up their own second round

3. How many races prior to the big race, and what sort of distances are these races?

** 3 short inland with club, 2 short Channel with BICC and/or NFC, 1 channel at about 300miles (would like at least 7hrs maybe more on the wing) then there 500m plus race 3 weeks later.

4. What do you feed, and do you alter it, as the big race gets nearer?

**100% Versele laga Best all round 365 Day of the year. Just give then a little more plus some fats 10 days before basketing

5. What, nest condition for (a) hens, ( cocks?

**We race roundabout, But don't mind lesbian hens (hens paired in there race section) sitting 4 or more eggs due to hatch.

6. What is your routine on the day of basketing?

**Give then at leastan hour in the box with nestbowl, and water.

 

This is our way of doing things, Hope you may find a bit usefull to youself.

Lee...

[grizzal]

:)great post with some very good points . cheers lads

[PATTY BHOY]

the most important factor is that the birds must be good enough.

[hotrod]

I know what you mean old yellow,but time destroys,honest to god,as you say,yours are good hard day birds,but when they day comes they worked 10-12 hours,down,then back up next morning for another good days fly,90% at least would be finished. i`m not saying yours,i`m talking general like.I suppose it just breaks them mentally.

 

asha  10/12 hours? you must be joking try 15/16 hours thats a wee bit more like a good days work/then carry on next day were talking about long distance here not 300/400 miles

[Guest cloudview]

no1 14th feb

no2yes  1 round

no3 about 4 inland races up to 185 mile , and 1  race with 8 hours on wing  two weeks prior to the big one

no4  normal widowhood mix, but increase the fat content   1 week  before basketing

no5 some on roundabout , some sitting 7 days and over

no6 no different to any other week , just go in and basket them

      keep it simple as possible

[Guest asha]

\That`s rubbish hotrod,real distance birds ain`t that stupid,if they got to get back up next morning to fly another 10 -12 hours and maybe a few more the day after ,they know when and where to rest up.Pigeons that fly 16 hours in a day are 1 in 10,000 and may well fly a few hours next morning but time on wing destroys not distance.

[Lennut Tar]

 

Mark I think you make a very interesting comment. A comment that tends to be the watchword of long distance fanciers, in that they wish for hard days.

Now what I am about to write is theory on my part but based on my practical study of the eye. The problem we have is that we rarely have tough hard day races on the south road at 500/700 miles. Not even Barcelona!!! What beats most birds from 550 mile + is not the conditions but the actual distance. The bird physiologically is not equipped to race that far. It may be a super pigeon perhaps the Steve Ovett of pigeons a multiple winner at 300 mile but has not the physiology to get 10,000 metres or the marathon.

We all dream about the only bird on the day (I had the only 2 on the day from 473 mile this year, though the competition in terms of numbers was poor) and that tends to happen either because it is tough but more invariably because you are at the time limit for timing on the day. On the south rd early season you may get north in the wind and then it does turn tough but these early races are not the distance ones. By the time you get to June / July 9 times out of ten the wind will have south in it, so it is a help. The continental strains have been bred to take advantage of this, they have been bred to fly with the wind at velocities around 1200 at 700 mile, the prevailing sw on a Barcelona race is a great help for them where as for us well, if you live in Kent, East Anglia East coast you have a much better chance, a because the drag has pulled the birds up through the NE France and when they cross the channel , it's only a few mile. For the birds in the west they have to dog leg and add in many instances a few hundred mile to their actual journey and if you happen to have that outstanding pigeon that has broken and stayed on line up the West of France, in effect continually fighting in to the west in the wind to stay on line the bird then has over 100 mile of sea to get over. When I look in the eye of the 500/700 miler in this country I can see the dominance of the continental pigeons especially the jan aardens of Massarella. They are faster pigeons than the good old fashioned British strains that would excel at 1000yd -. Those strains were developed in my opinion two ways. Firstly on the North Road, the North Roaders particularly flying in to the west flew in to headwinds and that's where the hard day pigeons were founded. The Lerwick pigeons comicg down to Plymouth must have had fantastic constitution. The sw distance fanciers who flew Lerwick one week and Bordeaux 2/3 weeks later withn the same pigeons must have been some of the finest distance fanciers in the world. They had a breed of pigeon that you refer to Mark that will come on any day. I have recently bought a pigeon (very cheap) with NRCC winners from Thurso and Lerwick at grandparent level (waiting for it). I bought it on the basis that even though Lerwick is only 500 miles for the breeder, it is a hell of a race spot, with often 250 mile of water to fly and more often than not a partial head wind, I am hoping that this pigeon will have that bit of grit to put into some lovely 500/700 mile distance hens that I have but that are more good day pigeon than hard.

The second way they were developed was on the south road by 'poor' liberations. I use the word 'poor' not as a criticism but the reality was 30/40+ years ago race controllers/liberators did not have the technical support the modern day convoyers have, so often birds would be liberated in conditions that on route became very hard and only the toughest got home. I realise for many what I write can be an absolute bore, I apologise to them. But when I sit down the stuff just spews out, I have a basic principle thought in my mind and then try to explain it.

Getting back to the question as a (half successful) long distance novice

1 Feb 28 last year, not sure this year whether 14th or 28th, I missed the first few races last year and had to jump them in to 100 mile to get them going.

2 One round let them lay again and took hen away at 8/10 days sitting, though am considering taking the yb and hen away when the yb is 12 day old.

3 All inland races, then if they are only going to 500 mile every fortnight channel race, if they are going to Tarbes / Barcelona 3 / 4 week rest then a 50 mile toss Saturday before basketing.

4 Fed Irish mix all racing season no breakdown, 2oz hemp per eight birds and half dozen peanuts per bird, 5 days prior to basketing once channel racing starts. Probiotic and cod liver oil two days in last 5, rehydration salts in water day before basketing, clear day of basketing .

5 Widowhood every race, never pairing, showed hen on basketing.

6 Birds kept in, fed one ounce Irish, then double hemp and peanuts, left for half an hour, then removed any food left. Hens let in to cocks, cocks taken away when hen is standing over cock, never (if I can help it!) let them tread.

 

Interesting post etc & certainly not boring, not by a long shot in my view. "Food for thought thou" for those ?????????????? that wish to read it closley I would have to say.

Enjoy.

 

 

[Guest]

j williamson aberdeen starts his 2y olds and upwards at 200 miles

they go to every fed race thereafter except the one before a national when he tosses at 50 miles

eg 200 then 260,320, 50 mile toss, newbury 400, comeback race 150 then hastings 450 comeback 96

then eastbourne 456 then a couple of weeks later falaise

 

hes won or been in the hunt at each of then nationals hes entered  (sections)

just some off the top of my head

 

2006 falaise 1st section

2007 due to bird flu flew eastbourne instead of falaise 1st section

2008 falaise 2nd section beaten by jammy donaldson

 

and this without using any treatments/medication  (true)

all he treats for is the paramaxo jab

 

you must admit thats some amount of miles he sends his birds

[Guest Vic]

Be it widowhood or natural, the birds must be well presented. A quivering good health specimen, that without saying, has been  conditioned through the races leading up to the ultimate race. Feeding? I normally, over the years, conditioned  them on hemp, but since the introduction of W/H racing, I have introduced  sunflower and peanuts in very moderate quantities. Fitnesss is the yardstick be it natural or W/H.      A PIGEON WILL TELL YOU, WHEN IT IS READY TO GO.  All the very best to the REAL fanciers left in this wonderful game of ours .Best of good health to the doos and you,  Vic.

[Guest]

Be it widowhood or natural, the birds must be well presented. A quivering good health specimen, that without saying, has been  conditioned through the races leading up to the ultimate race. Feeding? I normally, over the years, conditioned  them on hemp, but since the introduction of W/H racing, I have introduced  sunflower and peanuts in very moderate quantities. Fitnesss is the yardstick be it natural or W/H.      A PIGEON WILL TELL YOU, WHEN IT IS READY TO GO.  All the very best to the REAL fanciers left in this wonderful game of ours .Best of good health to the doos and you,  Vic.

 

Vic happy new year and hope your birds are back to their best for channel racing in 2009. Hope we get more distance men answering, great question Sapper.

Asha what would your answers be if you were competing in 2009?

[Guest]

j williamson aberdeen starts his 2y olds and upwards at 200 miles

they go to every fed race thereafter except the one before a national when he tosses at 50 miles

eg 200 then 260,320, 50 mile toss, newbury 400, comeback race 150 then hastings 450 comeback 96

then eastbourne 456 then a couple of weeks later falaise

 

hes won or been in the hunt at each of then nationals hes entered  (sections)

just some off the top of my head

 

2006 falaise 1st section

2007 due to bird flu flew eastbourne instead of falaise 1st section

2008 falaise 2nd section beaten by jammy donaldson

 

and this without using any treatments/medication  (true)

all he treats for is the paramaxo jab

 

you must admit thats some amount of miles he sends his birds

Interesting that he should start them at 2yo, for me I would send yearlings to 700 mile if I thought they could do the distance and were fit and healthy.

 

 

[Guest]

hi albear he starts the yearlings at the 1st race and sends about 50% through to 450