if birds are put up for sale on the open forum then i think that all bids should also be put up on the thread then everything is seen to be open and above board useing the pm method to me is open to abuse where everything is kept hidden false pm bids can be quoted and the price bumped up i know a few members who dont like to bid in sales /auctions where the pm system is used im not saying that this goes on but it is a possability jmo dave