Wiley

Whoever gets lot 16 I'm sure he'll do them a turn he looks stunning if I had the room and at that price I would have ripped your arm off

Will be a very gd score for ya mate

Any other details on them Sapper they look a nice pair

Is friday the last day to pick your team?

Bad move feel this week left it to late to take Ba off the bench

Always an early start in the lofts had old birds out. Happy there fitness seems to be increasing each time they go out. Kept the young birds in today and just spent a few hours playing with them fighting ect

Any aspect would like to discuss would be supplementation. We talk about the use of fats, carbs ect to fuel the muscles, however we do not mention the importance of oxygen to the muscles. Does anyone supplement vitamin b12 for more blood formation prior to a race? More blood means more oxygen to the muscles. It's something I have done for a number of years either on a Wednesday or Thursday prior to the race for any event.

You are right geordie, however you wouldn't be able to train at a high intensity for 14 hours, without the right fuel. You can gather with any physical exercise give or take you and pigeons will lose weight, but for an endurance event many will lose weight as the body has run out of fuel, and is now converting it's own protein(muscle) into fats to give the bird energy to compete. But it has it's consequences it is basically now eating away at it's own body.

Tony, done bit of research on what you said mate, and gathering the information from it I gathered a few points of interest; Fat is stored in the liver and the liver produces 50% fat for use as fuel for the pigeons body. The liver can export these fats through the bloodstream in the form of fatty acids to storage cavities in the body, but many are sent to the red muscle cells in the breast which are used in flight and give an energy source for endurance. Also reading A high fat diet reduces the levels of fat the liver can produce, the same is said for a high protein diet, however a high carb diet has the opposite affect and will increase it's production. And it is said protein should be fed lightly, fats in moderation, however when high fat diet is being fed the diet should have a higher carbohydrate percentage.

IB, I was giving 10 hours flying as just an example to show a calculation on what I had read whether it is right or wrong I couldn't say as it is not what I practice here, I could have given any time it wouldn't have made a difference. But 14 hour fly would be 840 minutes so the week leading upto the race using the calculation 78g during the build up would be required but as I said it is something I read and haven't tried. Interestingly you posted the weights of each bird before and after being sent. Did you do this for all races? How many races did you candidates have? What where there previous weights say 2 weekends before the race, and there weight at the beginning of the season?

IB, please re read what I mentioned I never mentioned 600 miles, I mentioned 600 minutes which is a ten hour fly minus the first hour which uses carbs so my maths was wrong the bird would only require 54g of fat prior to the race. Many people give or take feed rough measure of 28-35g per day but more for the distance. The bird whatever distance you send to should never be over weight but as Lee says like a cork. Lee could you give us an insight on how you achieve this big and corky feeling prior to a distance event?

Noel lippens speaks on the subjects of fats on secrets of champions double disk series I recommend anyone interested in feed to take a look, Noel works for Matador corns I believe

It would depend how long the birds are basketed for. A pigeon has two type of muscle White and red. In the university of Ghent the research suggested carbs where only used for the first 60 minutes of flight, and where used by White muscle tissue. The red muscle tissue kicks in when carbs are burnt and they are fuelled by fat reserves. I read somewhere that a pigeon needs 1gramm of fat for every ten minutes expected flying if you expect the birds to home in 600 minutes they need 60 gramme of fat building up to the race during the week.

Best product for breeding is a light bulb increase the hours of daylight and you'll have no problems. But keep a keen eye on your health of your birds

In my boxing days Dave we would carbo load prior to a fight, but during the process of carb loading our exercise would decrease before the event. And in my experience I would notice during carb loading my muscles would swell and feel full much like a pigeons should feel like blown up paper bag big but light. I also found that due to the amount of carbs consumed I would be quiet sluggish and lazy apart from when any exercise took place, then I would explode, carb loading has different effects on different people I feel the effect would be the same with pigeons. You mention a lot of fighting in the crates, this is something the real distance fanciers try to avoid, by feeding in the hoppers to make a community amongst the pigeons. The real distance men very rarely send there birds on the widowhood when these events come along, so there mainly sitting or feeding young birds and are sent in the calmest position possible. You can tell the experienced distance cocks who as soon as they are in the crates lay down and rest as they know they have to store the energy sources as there in there for the long haul

Supplements or vitamins aren't going to make him tread unfortunately mate he has a sex drive otherwise he wouldn't be jumping on the hens back

Maybe try triming his vent and his hens, if his a racer I wouldn't do this. Other then that I am stumped

It's the process of carbohydrate loading exactly the same as protein loading, as you are filling up their bodies with more then they actually require carbs and protein that cannot be used immediately converts to fat, which is the best energy source available

He is a strong pigeon, a quality that all my best sprinters have always had

Very interesting reading peter

Thought protein can only turn into fat which is a better energy source then carbs?

Tony c, could say something on this subject he done something very similar as a test I believe and it payed off

All athletes have to eat a high protein diet after any physical exercise, muscle fibres get torn and need to be repaired. On the north road which I race sprint racing isn't an easy task as the majority of weeks our birds face a nose wind, which will take more effort then a tail wind race, hence the feeding of maples and tic beans.

Will do mate. Peanuts at first pigeons can be wary, I tend to feed it to them when rearing then they gobble them with relish. And as tony says they'll go through anything to get them. Best thing is they always have appetite for them which they do not for other grains Another thing that cropped up quiet common was the use of duck or goose fat prior to the race on the grains.

A top sprint man in London does something very similar. He has three sections, two sections with v perches and a middle compartment with ten widowhood boxes. This man is the elite if he isn't fed champion every year he is always the runner up. What he does is have 10 cocks each in these v perch sections. 1 cock from each sections gets paired at a time. So basically saying 2 cocks are eventually paired up with one hen. These cocks are let out and got in separately in there own sections apart from a Friday evening, when they all trap in the breeding section and the hens are in the bowls, both cocks believe that that nest box is his domain, they also believe that they have rights to the hen. He does a few changes ect, but on return from the race the cock that came first is the only one that can spend time with the hen, while the other cock watches, the other cock seems to never be that far behind his opposing cock again