pigeonboyuk

where do you get your facts from delboy? ive been studying pigeon circovirus infection for a long time now and the only thing that you may be doing that is different from others is taking away the stress from the birds? {birds returns are almost always linked to a happy stress free loft, the more stress free the loft the better then number of returns, no big secret}. its also more of a fact that YBS is often asymptomatic (without symptom) so most fanciers wouldnt know if their birds have got it until its too late, as for the week after recovery, it would be interesting to know how you could even tell if the pigeon has recovered to allow for the week of post treatment respite before racing them again? what about letting them out for training after treatment? do you simply go by after you've treated the birds with adenosine as the period? not knocking your knowledge, im fascinated by it, but you should never claim things as facts, there's no room for that in science, there is only supportive evidence to an hypothesis

nobody has any real idea of the causes or if they have a problem and thats not discrediting anybody, not even the more experienced as perhaps delboy is has any real answers, if he did he's be a very rich man with recipe for the cure tucked away safely in the bank. strapper was the closest to the answer when he said that it depends on the way you've developed an immunity, some kids/YB's do, some don't. until we understand it fully why that is the case we wont ever get rid of YBS or reduce the number of outbreaks, and delboy is right that denial and lack of knowledge is usually YB sickness' best friend. the way i approach it is to help build the birds promote their own immunity to any number of illness and whilst not foolproof it has helped reduce the number of incidents i've had over the years. the more i learn to adapt the better at prevention but i would never be so complacent so as to say i will ever be free from the threat. one path that not many have even considered is somehow introducing stress b vits into the YB even before its born, because stress is the one common denominator found as a precursor for YB sickness. i've experimented with giving the birds extra vitaminB cocktails just before and during pairing up with the theory they pass some of this re-enforcement of the nervous systems (which we know vitamin b12 does) down through the egg to the chick. the scientific theory behind this is just like an alcoholic can pass the alcohol through the blood to a baby there is no reason why the same principle cant be applied to the egg. all options are worth exploring and dont all cost a fortune

most are too quick to blame overuse of anti-biotics but theres no real evidence that this is the cause. It takes many many years for a human to gain resistance to a drug (dozens of years not just one or two) so for birds it would probably be a little longer. Most already know about YB sickness but for those that dont hope this snippet helps... Young Bird sickness is a mixed infection, involving viruses and bacteria (especially E.coli and cocci, but also protozoa). The pathogens are transmitted by air, dust and contact between birds, as well as via communal drinking water and feed; Outbreaks of the disease are promoted by stress factors such as weaning, the introduction of strange birds into a loft, it can also be brought on by vaccination, even by increased heat (accelerated bacterial growth, water shortage), training of juveniles (basketing) and young pigeon flights. just like albear said, he treats his birds but hasnt got any problems (fingers crossed for him) so it does support the fact that its the time and the way we bring up young birds that does it. the problem with YB sickness is that most of us dont know how to accurately diagnose the disease and are probably labelling it wrongly. from my reading its hard to recognise the disease owing to the numerous pathogens involved in this disease and it is only possible to make a speculative diagnosis. Recognition and Treatment: Similar conditions: E.coli infection, Hexamitiasis. Treatment: There is no vaccine against young pigeon disease that could be used to prevent infection. However, sick pigeons can be treated with adenosan. And timely use of adenosan may also prevent an outbreak of the disease in birds suspected of infection. 1. adenosan is used: For at least 7 days at the first symptoms of young pigeon disease. If the disease is only recognised at a later stage, it is additionally necessary to use a chemotherapeutic agent with antibiotic activity (preferably furazolidon+) in order to contain the bacterial infection. The active ingredient furazolidone has been shown to possess specific efficacy against E.coli infections in the gut. 2. adenosan is used in the following situations, where there is reason to fear infection as a result of contact with other young pigeons: For a 7-day period when introducing new youngsters to the flock. During the flying season, for 3 days after flights. 3. adenosan is used when a disease outbreak is likely as a result of a challenge to the immune system: In connection with vaccinations (paramyxovirus infection, Salmonella, pigeon pox) - for 3 days before immunisation and 4 days thereafter. 4. adenosan is used where a change in gut flora predisposes birds to a disease outbreak. When treating birds for trichomonads, we recommend parallel administration of adenosan over a period of 7 days, beginning 3 days prior to treatment. this information is probaby already somewhere in the site so excuse if duplicated

not my words but of some use maybe?, do they sell these canker pouches in the UK?

lol, probably cut up the car for bar stools ;D ;D

dont think the council can do much if he isnt charging anything for drink, maybe for noise levels but thats it. he's entitled to have friends around and as long as garage use isnt hard and fast in deeds he can do what he wants cant he? strapper is right though with councils in wales, they are backwards and unless its a cousing of theirs who runs the garage pub they will find a way to cause problems and close it. look at slough, most garages up there have been converted to 12 bedroom houses for illegal immigrants ??) ??) ??)

there is definately a cause and effect between yeast and canker just as there is with stress and canker, its a widely debated topic at the moment though and eventually someone will nail the problem and eliminate it without the use of antibiotics. i'm trying to get some good articles on the studies being done and if and when i get permission to reproduce them i'll gladly post them here for people to read. nice to see a topic debated with passion but without too much nastiness.

i am right m8, and pigeons anatomy isnt that far away from humans so the relationship on many levels can be crossed over and that includes illness and disease.

there is a definite relationship between yeast and canker in the humans so i dont see why this cant be the same with pigeons?

sad but true there are very few women in sport, less on pigeon forums, can count them on one hand dark_chequer

sorry but i dont know and it was a bit cold of you to suggest that i do :-/

the same Derek Nichols from Barry i take it?

sorry i annoyed you, wasnt meaning to, just saying how i see things, bad habit i guess. thought your site was okay as it happens apologies if i rubbed you up wrong way m8 :B

how do they do that?

lol, dont' know what came over him! ;D ;D ;D ;D jeeze they're getting worse. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

who was the auctioneer at the sale? is Ed sitner his name or was he someone else? i want to know for other reasons than the thread so sorry if im butting in, my attention has been aroused by something here. :-/

dont know about a goodyear but he just finished a hard days work, or at least it looked like he was tyred. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;

now come on you know as a lady your not supposed to ask age ;D ;D lets just say experienced then clean keeps em keen. wonder what the stats are on a clean versus deep litter system when it comes to producing winners? anyone know?

if your prepared to learn by mistakes even in the twighlight years of life then your a man i want to take example from.

I dont need to take time to study brewers yeast m8, know pretty much all there is to know about its properties. dont lead a sheltered life either which is why i said your answer was rubbish which it is, or if it isnt then explain to us where you can support your claim of BY being the best thing ever available. why is it people with other pigeon sites feel the need to come to this one to advertise their sites, shouldnt you be concentrating on yours? as said in p.m nothing personal m8 but it does look as if too many people have a pop at oldyellow when all hes doing is trying to help with advice. agree with websites being better than others which is why i chose this over yours.

do you have a ballpark figure to go from?

dont know who she is but my wishes with her.

sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind Anna, none of us want to see a bird destroyed but its part of pigeon life and if it means saving other birds from catching a pretty nasty virus then its the best thing to do. just a word of warning with the vets, they will usually sting you for as much as they can get and often dont know much about pigeons, or at least thats my experience. do let us all know and if it is good news you'll hear us all cheer.

you mean froggies 22 scotland 13, unlucky m8 was rooting for my celtic brothers.

sorry stevie, must have sounded bitchy of me, was jesting. :B good luck with your venture