Roland

It beggars the question what we put first of course. But 90% of the time every action we make, I believe is intended for the betterment of the pigeon, us... then the sport merit. However, sadly we all sometimes over step the mark with our hopes and 'Maybe's'. Then all too often gives us a timely warning … Again sadly though too many hopes and maybe's tend to ignore her. So this in it's self has a downward happening.

I, as you know, like a very high majority whom sadly won't voice their opinion if the 'Ear Ticklers' are about would actually welcome a later start. 2nd week in May or later. Now June surely must be the time for short races.. to a little of middle races. This could serve as two purposes. Later and better breeding for starter. Light training then better start to the Inland races. The pigeons pencilled in for the longer and harder races could have the odd shorter races to freshen or condition them etc. End of July young birds could start racing into September. The old bird distance raced at that time would be going into middle distances and onto the longer and harder races in August. Also many hens used for widowerhood could be raced in 2-5 different systems as the owner wants. Indeed this would also help the birds in their racing as they could be rotated with the sexes. Smaller but better class of pigeons would ensue. Smaller teams and fewer losses. Strains and stresses of the minimised with better conditioned pigeons. Will it ever happen? Off course not. people hate change and get comfortable with their' habits. No two ways about that! Yet WE love our pigeons … Mostly I believe that. We feed and water and care for them 365 days a years. Spend a lot of time, money and many others things take a back seat as we put our love of the pigeon before most else! Now that last sentence says a lot. A lot of things and much truth. Also on the outside looking in says a lot in as much that we contradict our self's. Indeed a good case can easily be made that it is a fallacy, or best ONLY a half truth put forward.

Remember this well too: by Gord Chalmers » Wed Jul 17, 2013 1:53 pm A lot of old bird racing now appears to be over for the most part, or almost over, and fanciers are turning to training for the young bird series of races. At the moment, I have concerns about the welfare of racing birds, whether old or young, when I note the extremely hot conditions + very high levels of humidity (and the potential for the complicating factor of smog alerts) that are now occurring, especially in eastern Canada. Even in the usually dry west, there is currently a lot of standing water in fields coupled with water saturation of the soil as a result of continuous heavy rains and severe flooding problems, so the potential for the same combinations of very high heat (it's coming this week) and humidity to occur here is also very real. Studies have shown that pigeons can fly from a distance of approximately 200 miles (320 km) in 4.25 hours while maintaining an average metabolic rate that is more than 17 times the resting level. The resulting heat production naturally raises their body temperature. It is a fact that under the extremely severe combined conditions of high environmental temperatures and high humidity, in training tosses and races, pigeons have a great deal of difficulty controlling their internal temperature. As a result, pigeons will normally stop flying when their core body temperature rises from an average resting value of about 104.5F (40.3C) to about 110F (43.3C) or more because of such conditions. My point in raising this issue is that I feel very strongly that it is definitely inhumane to send birds racing (except possibly for shorter races that are liberated very early in the cooler morning) from the middle distance and longer races when they are held under these extremely severe conditions. I know, I know - the die-hards will argue that after all, these are merely birds, that nature will take care of them, that this is part of the natural selective process (it's not because in a natural setting, nature would curtail their normal activities under these conditions), that we have never held birds back in the past because of severe heat/humidity, and on and on with other indefensible protests. In my view the time is long past due for a critical look at this unreasonable aspect of the sport in Canada. It's time for individual fanciers, clubs, combines and yes, the CU too, to tackle this issue and to lay out standards of activity that are much more humane. (I note that workers in the terrible Lac Megantic tragedy now have to struggle in 50 C (122 F) heat and can only handle 15 minutes (max) of work at one time. We need to be as concerned for the welfare of our pigeons as we are for these workers. JMO. Gord. End off. …. Maybe it is time to look at the Race season(s) altogether. Yes we can control the moult etc. Also there is NOTHING in my book that says that Old bird racing can't and shouldn't 'SPLIT'into two parts. one where a rest is taken? Indeed why not have a combined race season. I feel a rest for Nesting could be beneficial for starters! At tye moment the best youngster 'BY FAR' in our race circle are the Later bred.

Andy it is in the questions and answer done by Steven Van Breemen etc. Many famous name took part etc. http://www.stevenvanbreemen.nl/?Hints_2_Win:Flying_racing_pigeons_in_the_heat

Scientific answer about flying in the heat: Total heat load = environmental temperature + body temperature + UV thermal Load If you change any one of these variables you change the total metabolic rate of the bird which corresponds to high energy demand and there by higher consumption of minerals, fat, and other vitamins. So giving Electrolytes Before? The week prior to the race After the race the question again beggers 'Why'! ......................... Colin Walker states: The two most common diseases that lead to excessive thirst during racing are; wet canker and respiratory infection causing inflamed air sacs. With wet canker the trichomonad organisms produce a toxin that makes the birds thirsty, while when the air sacs become inflamed they lose their moisture conserving ability and the birds lose excessive moisture in the exhaled air. When correcting the ensuing dehydration they often over-compensate and drink excessively. As you say however, there may be concern that the conveyers are not watering and feeding the birds adequately. Experiments have shown that pigeons deprived of water for 24 hours at 25C become 5% dehydrated. Given the high body temperature of pigeons(41.7C) and the number put in race baskets, the temperature within the basket can get much higher, even on cold days particularly if the race basket is poorly ventilated. Birds released that are only slightly dehydrated can be expected to orientate poorly and take longer to recover. In Australia water is continuously available even when the birds are being basketed except when the transporter is actually moving. I hope these short notes are a help. Regards, Dr. Colin Walker.

Electrolytes. As said above, pigeons do not sweat - so where is the loss of the electrolytes, that have to be replaced, supposed to come from? It is stated that sodium and other salts are excreted when bound to lactic acid and that the lactic acid forms when the pigeons do anaerobic exercise (exercise in the absence of oxygen). It is my contention that racing pigeons do not do anaerobic exercise and therefore conserve their' salts. Now to the current dispute about electrolytes. Unless a pigeon is losing them in some form, maybe with enteritis or when the kidneys have been damaged by PMV, there is NO indication for using them. I think that the current great hullabaloo was created by drug companies and merchants who marketed the electrolytes for use by horses and humans (when they sweat) and for all other animals when they vomit, have diarrhea and so on. In these cases the marketing is fully justified and use of the medicines absolutely essential etc. But not for healthy pigeons. Above words are from Dr. Wim Peters.

I have many that have told me I'd be welcome to visit etc. Delboy. But feel that won't happen this season. I fear it would only make me want to start again and miss my own. Yet know I will be involved in some way or other. this I have no doubt about.

Many Roads Greenlands eh. I'd also say one has to do what one thinks / knows, works for them. In life's experiences much can work that shouldn't, or we don't how, or why it does. For example I was in Canada for a few weeks in 2005. I was a guest and stay for one week with a good fancier. We looked over the birds as one does etc. He handed me a pigeon that was light and not displaying vigour etc. says he to me 'Can't seem to get this hen back in good health. Tried all sorts and much more if truth be known. Has been a good one too, and she's only three, so I am disappointed' etc. I recalled similar saying from a very good knowledgeable fancier back home here. Indeed had tried it twice to good effect. So I said 'You hold her with the tail pointing to me'. 'Why, what are you going to do'? he asked a mite bemused, if not worried lol. 'I will pull out the two end feathers. The two right on the outside'. Only one feather each side of course.'. Well he looked suprised and a bit off saying 'What good will that do'? 'Don't know' says I ' But very often it will put her back on song in no time'. After a few moments of pauses he said 'Ok'. so did. I pulled out the two outside tail feathers. This was in October / November. Back home a few weeks later we spoke like on the net. 'What did you do' say he to me regards that hen. I don't know what, or why I did it... but it usually works. What were the results'? 'Like I said before she picked up nigh instantly, and is now as good as ever'. Ok the question arises 'Why'? A rare accasion here where there seems to be no answer to Why which can only be normally be 'Because'! Never found the answer... But seen many atime it working.

Personally I can't see how it can help in the least. Many a good fancier smile when talking electrolytes. P.R says much true. But then they are making money. True some good names recommend electrolytes … but then are they being paid! Over the years I have listened quite a lot to many different views and people. First question 'Is there any gain in what they are actually saying'? Secondarily 'Do they actually know the merits or not, them selves... and do they understand or are they having their ears tickled,'? Thirdly 'If there was no money involved in selling / buying would it be an proven asset'? Then the most important being of all 'does it make actual sense... or not'.

Good to hear mate. Glad you didn't leave it long before letting them out. Pigeon never forget. Further they have to be content where they are, in systems and methods that they like. One can't motivate a unhappy pigeon, or one that is not overly bothered to home. the 3 plus one C's are the most important thing one can do with pigeons. speak soon Paul.

After wanting pigeon for 67 years and having them around for 65 years, I am sorry to say I no longer have them. They all went yesterday. I took my time regards where they would go and the vast majority went to Ireland yesterday. Some to Scotland. Yes of course I'm already missing them … and I know that will get worse of course when the reality hits home. Living past events, and having the constant Dreams and hopes what to be when I could afford and race properly. However through health reasons I wasn't able to fulfil them. To feed and water them and see their' conditions and knowing that they should be racing was a torment in it's self. Got to the stage where I had a job to watch them fly around as such. Have / had struggled for a few years with the hope it would be better, and soon … but haven't even been able to go to the club meetings in over a year … I never missed a meeting, whether Club, fed or RPRA. I know that the new owners will do more than justify their' merit etc and have been placed in very good hands. Now I will continue on here as norm.

Thank you Kyleakin Lofts. I was going to look up as such this morning - afternoon actually as I read this, also had a class Avian Medic and a National flyer explain why they wouldn't entertain the Idea of Electrolytes and certainly don't use them..

True Fifer. In 1976' heat wave the government proposed we took salt tablets.

Many used to give a cattle salt lick. Mind that was for Minerals. Some truth in your jest actually Hillstreetblues48. I have seen that 'Ice Lolly' being eaten by the pigeons on very many occasions mate. But then I doubt you would know why and how

Electrolyte is a "medical/scientific" term for salts, specifically ions. The term electrolyte means that this ion is electrically-charged and moves to either a negative (cathode) or positive (anode) electrode: ions that move to the cathode (cations) are positively charged ions that move to the anode (anions) are negatively charged. Of course we know which is which and what is what eh! For example, your body fluids -- blood, plasma, interstitial fluid (fluid between cells) -- are like seawater and have a high concentration of sodium chloride (table salt, or NaCl). The electrolytes in sodium chloride are: Electrolyte is a "medical/scientific" term for salts, specifically ions. The term electrolyte means that this ion is electrically-charged and moves to either a negative (cathode) or positive (anode) electrode: ions that move to the cathode (cations) are positively charged ions that move to the anode (anions) are negatively charged For example, your body fluids -- blood, plasma, interstitial fluid (fluid between cells) -- are like seawater and have a high concentration of sodium chloride (table salt, or NaCl). The electrolytes in sodium chloride are: Electrolyte is a "medical/scientific" term for salts, specifically ions. The term electrolyte means that this ion is electrically-charged and moves to either a negative (cathode) or positive (anode) electrode: Another example where electrolyte drinks are important is when infants/children have chronic vomiting or diarrhea, perhaps due to intestinal flu viruses. When children vomit or have diarrhea, they lose electrolytes. Again, these electrolytes and the fluids must be replaced to prevent dehydration and seizures. Therefore, drinks such as Pedialyte have sodium and potassium in them like the sports drinks do. However, pediatricians do not recommend giving sports drinks to a sick child! Sports drinks have much higher sugar concentrations than Pedialyte and the high sugar is not a proper treatment. Yet many will spend good money to give an already ill / tired, dehydrated pigeon, most likely suffering from Toxics after a hard race etc. Before! Why. Surely the pigeon is in as fine racing condition any way … or why send it! All sports drinks are no more than Sugar and camaflaged! Whatever maybe added to them. Of course whatever is added has no bearing on the coffee other than for Taste and P.R. Any one with a little knowledge KNOWS salt makes on thirsty!

Well I'd soak rice in water over night to feed them with that … and Groats... Also, personally. I'd keep Electrolytes in any strength away from them. Can't see how drying them out/ dehydrate them more helps! May squirt a little lemon juice on their' feed, if a distance race / or hard race envisaged... My loft is always naturally cool in summer, and warm in winter. Before I used to use hessian sacks on roofs and well water. Would keep them cool.

A man in a hot air balloon realized he was lost. He reduced altitude and spotted a woman below. He descended a bit more and shouted, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised a friend I would meet him an hour ago but I don’t know where I am." The woman below replied, "You're in a hot air balloon hovering approximately 30 feet above the ground. You're between 40 and 41 degrees north latitude and between 59 and 60 degrees west longitude." "You must be in Information Technology," said the balloonist. "I am," replied the woman, "how did you know?" "Well," answered the balloonist, "everything you told me is probably technically correct, but I've no idea what to make of your information and the fact is, I'm still lost. Frankly, you've not been much help at all. If anything, you've delayed my trip." The woman below responded, "You must be in Management." "I am," replied the balloonist, "but how did you know?" "Well," said the woman, "you don't know where you are or where you’re going. You have risen to where you are, due to a large quantity of hot air. You made a promise, which you've no idea how to keep, and you expect people beneath you to solve your problems. The fact is you are in exactly the same position you were in before we met, but now, somehow, it's my f**king fault."

At the National Art Gallery in Dublin, a husband and wife were staring at a portrait that had them completely confused. The painting depicted three black men totally naked, sitting on a bench. Two of the figures had black penises, but the one in the middle had a pink penis. The curator of the gallery realized that they were having trouble interpreting the painting and offered his personal assessment. He went on for over half an hour explaining how it depicted the sexual emasculation of African Americans in a predominately white patriarchal society. "In fact", he pointed out, "some serious critics believe that the pink penis also reflects the cultural and sociological oppression experienced by gay men in contemporary society". After the curator left, an Irishman approached the couple and said, "Would you like to know what the painting is really about?" "Now why would you claim to be more of an expert than the curator of the gallery", asked the couple? "Because I am the artist, who painted the picture", he replied, "In fact, there are no African Americans depicted at all. They're just three Irish coal miners. The guy in the middle just went home for lunch".. The manager hired a new secretary. She was young, sweet and polite. One day while taking dictation, she noticed his fly was open. While leaving the room, she courteously said, “Oh, sir, did you know that your barracks door is open?†He did not understand her remark, but later on he happened to look down and saw that his zipper was open. He decided to have some fun with his new employee. Calling her in, he asked, “By the way, Miss Jones, when you saw my barracks door open this morning, did you also see a soldier standing at attention?†The secretary, who was quite witty, replied, “Why, no sir. all I saw was a little, disabled veteran, sitting on two duffel bags!â€

AT the end of their first date, a young man takes his favorite girl home. Emboldened by the night, he decides to try for that important first kiss. With an air of confidence, he leans with his hand against the wall and, smiling, he says to her, "Darling, how 'bout a goodnight kiss?" Horrified, she replies, "Are you mad? My parents will see us!" "Oh come on! Who's gonna see us at this hour?" "No, please. Can you imagine if we get caught?" "Oh come on, there's nobody around, they're all sleeping!" "No way. It's just too risky!" "Oh please, please, I like you so much!!" "No, no, and no. I like you too, but I just can't!" "Oh yes you can. Please?" "NO, no. I just can't." "Pleeeeease?... Out of the blue, the porch light goes on, and the girl's sister shows up in her pajamas, hair disheveled. In a sleepy voice the sister says: "Dad says to go ahead and give him a kiss. Or I can do it. Or if need be, he'll come down himself and do it. But for crying out loud tell him to take his hand off the intercom button!"

Nice one greenlands.

True Andy. She certainly is. I'm not ashamed to stand and shout at the telly and get emotional when I see the guts and thunder as she gives her all EVERY TIME! I get peeved when I see so called 'GOOD' Athletes, OR them supposedly 'having great potential' who can run against the clock, or inferior competition, but look for excuses against competition and fail miserably! Seen many that finish fast and strong but well behind. Commentators spouting 'poorly judged finishes' or 'if Only they had stayed up with the pace', or 'If only they had given themselves a chance'. etc. Truth is they are taking money under false pretences as far as I am concerned. Won't name a couple of sprinters that fast times .. One second only to Linford Christy, but get disqualified, or is well down, finishing like a train. Another yet again last week in the 880 and 1000 metres 50 yards behind but finishes so fast. They are simply making excuses before they compete. Simple as that, and for them to be paid to train and race is a diabolical disgrace. Yes one learns and ACCEPTS that they have to run through a pain. That it hurts! But to take the money every week and just turn up. That means as far as I am concerned that each performance should be paid on merit! Or get a job, or fiddle the dole. I'd much rather see a person trying than a class act faking personally. It is often said 'It is he that TRIES and fails that is a defeated, but the one that doesn't try that is the defeatist'.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/scotland/44582424 Every thing about this fine young lady is truth from the heart. Tenacious (Like once was the scots' trade word and mark) and great, who wears her heart on the sleeve for all to see. May not beat the every best in the world, but by golly you know she will give her all and more if possible, and will be close when not!

How so very true. Pigeon Fanciers and their Apathy and blaming any one and every but them self has a lot to answer for. Plus the stupid old aged so glumly used 'Well you know I would … but the others... well' wink, wink nodd nodd. P,s YOU are one of the others. Too many just don't want to KNOW and still cling to the scenario that 'Some One else will' … or 'It will get better... or won't, but what can I do'!

100%

I believe - personally - scared to lose them is another cancer in our sport. So many breed even more to LOSE. Time one, I feel, looked at 'pastences' and see what the big changes were and are. Yes you Too Andy. Nothing to do with the 'Good Old days' … but acceptance that compared to today we aren't even in the same field. This is in fact!