
Roland
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Everything posted by Roland
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The climate of the times... The ways and means of today's racing don't live up to yesteryears pigeons. Nor can anyone offer a shred of proof on that score. Well certainly with any consistency. One swallow doesn't make a summer so to speak. Likewise, the convenient myth of saying the pigeons are a lot faster today. I sometimes hear the talk about how they get birds doing 1500 pm etc. Yes, we do ... as we did years ago. Fraserburgh I timed in doing 1900 odd. Thought that was good and great. Fed birds were doing over 2000 ypm. On the coast, they did 2300 ypm. Lerwick up at six home at one. Admitted it was in July and better than the heat stupidity of June 22nd rubbish of hotter days … however, 20 minutes more light! You couldn't make it up! I've said many times outcrosses. Indeed no incest... Fanciers point regards performances where they have done well, that's true. However, put the numbers in any column and compare to today's birds and their losses etc. and the talk just doesn't add up! First thing hampered in incest breeding is - and seems to be the 'Homing instinct. Agreed of course the B.O.P. has some answering to do. However, realistically - though they have an effect, they are blamed for a lot that they aren't responsible for. Lib sites get a crowd of B.O.P.. looking on and waiting for the Libs. But then we use them libs! Time to alter regularly the Lib points eh!
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Fact is, very few - very few indeed, trained their pigeons. Young birds split into two parts. Half went first two races - about 70 miles then 100 odd second race. The rest the same in the two come back races and all went every race too 250 miles or more. Elgin - Perth and even further. Yearlings usually stopped at Thurso just under 500 miles. Two year old and onwards Lerwick etc. Admitted races were chosen for future races. I.e. Berwicke for Lerwick etc. Morpeth for Thurso. Yes after two Northallerton in same week. A open Race on the Tuesday and Club/ Fed race week -end. Didn't need training. Few tried to still a march true... if able. But most lofts had a problem regards too many for the allocated Nest Boxes. What went etc.
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Often spout as such. First time in basket for me was race. (150 - 200 mile) Depends if they have freedom and rest I guess. Agree with Dal that the only reason for training is fitness … if needed. Was a case when a school boy held some pigeons in a collection of rabbit cages. Was a stray pigeon that started it off. Then a couple or so fanciers bred his some 6 in all. After the parents began to see it the phase wouldn't lass over they ordered that they went! Never trained of course. Rather than cull he gave all away bar one. He entered it in a NATIONAL, first time in basket and IT won the national. I believe a scribe called Titmuss wrote the article in the B.H.W Black country way.
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Personally, I truly believe that the fanciers have, and are, destroying the sport even further! Yes, somewhat since commercial and money came into the sport. No two ways about that! But that is only a very small part of the reason. The largest reason, by far, is the fancier themselves for very many reasons.
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Will stand you in good stead Eastcoaster. Mine went as yearlings 150 - 200 first time in basket. Maybe could / should have fed and watered them odd time in basket and left over a night or two. … Pigeons placed in a darken place and left as such before racing come on strong in condition. J.M,O.
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Well pleased too I'd bet. Yes hassle and then time to settle , both you / family and the pigeons. Good luck in coming season mate.
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As was explained to me, 40 years ago, a very good and realistic truth of an understanding. Our eyesight is far from as good as pigeons! We can see from ground level miles away comfortably. A pigeon way up high can see miles upon miles away. Obviously. Once a pigeon 'Locks On' (race time) with a determination to a destination it just misses hedges, trees etc. Now on a training toss, they circle - mostly high and will see 60 miles or more if looking. Some pigeons will land and go into a loft a couple of miles away! That bird is telling you something at the time. It's not happy with you or your loft. Or isn't mentally unfit etc. Times are now, inevitably, when a reality check of ourselves is needed.
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Who has the votes? who pays the wages? Who says and does nothing! …
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was in Canada when y/b's flew the 500miles, not twice, but back to back and then another. 100 odd years ago Jackson was sending and getting yearlings from 1000 miles. Now, instead of the fancier sending Berwick, Elgin or Perth etc. they voted them out and now moan that Morpeth is too far and many don't send. Strewth soon be 100 miles tops for youngsters and 350 miles for Old Birds! Oslo maybe a bit far for the south coast here... lol! Salvo we do / did. We sent Rome - in the heat and had decent returns.
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No disrespect Chanter, and you may well have had good returns and success. I don't doubt that for a minute. But it does remind me how many excuses are prevalent each time a disaster happens. Now, let's take a poor race controllers job, often slated for allowing them up or holding them over! If a racing controller had held over for a few days this past weekend and when question why and he replied 'I just felt it would be a bad result somehow... so I've held them back! Can one imagine the hassle and conflab that would no doubt ensue? 'Just who the heck does he think he is'? 'So now he's got a Chrystal ball eh'! 'Well, where I live (140 miles away) the weather was certainly good enough to let them up'. '[ yeah right! How about us that could get someone to time in for us'! I know lots more about what would be said too. Indeed no doubt you can all add a few. I see very many reasons put forward on this post already. Now was a time, I remember it well when many fanciers tried to steal a march and bred early' Why is amazement in its self! But the wise old fellows smiled and just sent an old cock or an experienced hen! just to keep in the averages. I never did personally send til second-week or so in May. 'What they'd laugh, sent in cold weather! Will ruin them for the season'! 'What' titter titter' Send youngster in an East wind lol... that's their season finished! Have so many that are often spouted AND yet this season I would guarantee, even wager, there will be constant tripe splutter and more silly excuses will abound over more losses and bad races.
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No! is the simple answer, because A. It doesn't suit them too. B. If the members are not concerned why should they be?. Plus a few more. However, the season in and season out many excuses are put forward regards the losses etc. Come seasons end members sit back and twiddle their thumbs... Not those though that are sitting on their hands. If clubs told the fed that they NEEDED change and put the proposals in and WENT along to the Fed meetings they would have to do many things to benefit the fancy as a whole and NOT just themselves. If earlier enough - EVEN now - IF the Nationals were told next season your transporters wouldn't be sitting doing anything In late June, through August BUT in MAY! Later nests in warmer weather (Late March even April) and the National would have to do to suit the fancy and NOT just their pockets and profits, Still, if Fancy's imagination does the same as last year, and year in and year out AS losses etc. get bigger, then simple reality is that there WILL be more losses year on year. remember its your money that they are after and taking! Also remember 'He who pays the Piper calls the Tune'! Well, apparently not!
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Maybe a First Race in MAY would solve many problems.... AND better returns eh!
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Quote '... Secondly, Nobody is blaming anybody for this problem and for Roland to come to the conclusion that I am " somewhat to blame and out of order " is actually rather insulting, if anybody is " out of order" then I can only say " Roland it the hat fits wear it"...' Sorry you read it that way. Wasn't intended as an insult. Asa for the agent, a lot nearer to me that you we still had waiting time. The crusp of what I meant was have you contacted the agent etc. If not why not! You have actually answered that point now... but hadn't before etc. So maybe it came across wrong... it shouldn't have Maybe the way you read... maybe not. But now that point has been solved. P.s. as a matter of interest how can a question be taken as blame? Best I let it drop.
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Where's the agent / site you acquired it from! They have a responsibility to help. No matter how long ago! Have you asked them for help? If not, then are you not somewhat to blame and out of order? I know for a fact Unikon doesn't give a brass farthing once sold. But a club I was in till this season gets the Agent in real quick. Always sorted quickly. Yes a member of that club was a good friend of the Unikon agent... strangely after seasons of not caring came down for him and set it up. But then, Like I say was and is the only time I'd ever heard of such. Friend eh!
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Scare mongering? one thing for sure the shower suppose to sorting and running this country couldn't, nor would give a toss. … Mind in reality one can't for a moment fathom that the French wouldn't sale cars and parts here and continue to make vast profits... All my eye as my dad would say.
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Sorry only ever had, or heard, a good word for Benzing. But must be an local agent that will come to the club and sort it!
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Well nothing knew there then.
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Hmm... Think it could be best to leave the wife out :emoticon-0140-rofl: Just doshing. there are very many good and knowledgeable wives that race a fine pigeon. Back in 1984 I learn a very good tip. Let the wife call and talk to the young birds … their voice is softer, more sincere and they will respond better. Very, very true. Indeed had a fellow from another club 6 miles away, named McCloud, who came for a stray pigeon of his. I took him into the garden where the wife had just let the youngsters out. They had gained a fair height. 'Ah' he said, 'how long before they come back. They were circling well now when the wife said. ' get them in'! then in her pigeon talk said 'Come on my babies. maybe once or twice more as the swooped down and entered as one straight off! I have never ever been able. Mr McCloud said if he hadn't seen it he would never have believed it! True.
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Let's for fun, but more so let us put thoughts and beliefs in help A. US and B. just as importantly any newcomer or a person that may have an interest. Not for a moment forgetting everyone on the site that may garner a little understanding of a help. Obviously, a Chicken or egg starter … However, then that is in itself a no goer. Would have to be Two! A cock bird or two eggs. However, then again to eliminate the chances of having at least one pair it would take ten eggs mathematically. Likewise to an extent is our pigeon game. Loft first? Alternatively, reading up? Visiting a fancier to learn. Even when and where to get the pigeons/ Joining a club first... having youngsters promised, or stock birds for y/b racing? Then after much and many, the thoughts carry on. However at some time, one will have to have a place for them to live. Yes, rabbit hutches upon rabbit hutches with excellent ventilation. A shielded nest box! Now You have time for a little thought I'd guess. Me! Well, if old birds might take the Y/b loft and turn it into a section for old birds you are starting with, I wouldn't clip any wings personally. Would be an added cause of stress! They will be stressed out a bit any road — no wanting that for their breeding. Aviary will calm them and help them to settle. However, I would build an aviary for them to sit out all weathers if they want. Then between now and then, and them breeding youngsters, you can design and build a loft to suit your self! Remember all them 'I'd wish I'd done this ...'. I would have an aviary for every section. I prefer one where the birds trap into the loft. I used a drop door, and then they had to go through Bob Wires to trap in. Great for settling the youngster too before letting out. IN and OUT of the avairy door. I make mine entirely in a wire mesh. Not the chicken stuff, but firm and robust. Yes, on support legs and trays underneath for cleaning out. Just pushed wood through the wires for perching. The loft itself Had just two air bricks for ventilation. Moreover, some times I left the trap doors open at night. More than enough air circulation. Was warm in winter, and cool in summer. Best made of Bricks, but the same principle applies with wood. Twin walls with Plasterene between - get it free from shops packaging. I've seen many traps placed above the aviaries. However, it can slow trappings and may also entice the birds to hunch and not going in. If through the aviary they don't see a bird but hear them and trapping is usually very quick. I once had an excellent and quick trapping device. The birds could land on the trapping board and drop straight through it. Instead of the wooden holes like many had/have when upright I did the same. Instead of being vertical I had them Horizontal. I had a glass window in all sections: I and placed Car window tinting. So was always a little dark and comfortable for the birds and their all-important nesting. I feel this may be the only chance - maybe the last chance- to build a loft that suits you, and is practical for the well being and control of the birds. Personally, when weaning, I took the youngster and placed and fed and watered them in the basket for a couple of days. Then I moved 'In the Basket' to their new loft. After two days I'd leave the basket open for two days or so. Them remove the basket. Then open the Bob wires so that they could go in and out of the Aviary. Stress-free when opening the Aviary to let them out! They will go in and out on their' own. Indeed it is the very first Co of 5!
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I have built many lofts. Best place - if wood etc. is go to a Demolition site. Get good seasoned pillars etc. etc. Or bricks even. I found first talking regards pigeons and their merits set a good seed. You will / would be surprised how helpful the boss or workers become!
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First off, how far will the new home be from the old one? Can you put up loft in new abode before leaving old home? Rgards new or old loft! No you don't need to take old loft. You could take old loft etc. of course. But more hassle than worth. Now is the time to be deciding system and distances you want to excel in. Will it be a new start with old pigeons? Easy to break if they like the new loft. Not so clever pigeons may be lost. Do you intend to race the same birds then as now? Best way of breaking if possible is to Stop feeding and watering them in old lofty. Then take then to new loft. to feed and water. Leave door open! Soon they will fly to new loft to feed and as no concern or frightened regards locking in the will settle. b Some put a mate locked in new loft after a time. But I wouldn't. If not able to, arrange for old loft to be left up. It may be an understanding involved. Maybe even new tenants would use the loft as a shed / storage etc. or become pigeon fancier In new loft feed same time each night and LET out every three days. they will never ever forget the old loft, so keeping them if for yonks somes may work ... but mostly that would be the not so clever ones...
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Golly Yeboah, we are nigh singing from the same hymn book. As for youngsters and the B.O.P. They will have a built-in instinct regards them. Like so many wonders of nature. Do we teach them to fly? Nor do the parents. B.O.P. the very first time they see an S/H they will climb above it. How do they know? Well, we don't know how, yet they do. '... Have found that the condition and fitness of the celibate pigeons far exceed that of the natural pigeon. It's then just up to observation and motivation..'! When the birds become mentally fit, then physically fit. The whole PARTS of their nature becomes one. Contentment of home and the Perch / Nest box is all they need for motivation. their territory! They fly to either as strongly. Yes, 'celibacy' has an excellent edge. Always ready to run so to speak. They home to their territory. As us, fit (FIT) train to get fitter. Till becoming fit, they can't and won't. You can't, nor can any animal/bird unfit train to get fit. One becomes fit/part of Conditioned, then TRAINS to get fitter. Too many pigeons are - I believe - ruined for the season via not letting a pigeon become naturally mental fit. Then allowing them to become all-around fit before training.
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A very good read Yeboah. Most and much done. Indeed a blueprint plan for any body I believe! I, personally. used to give the Late Bred a toss or two on nice days before Xmas. That of course changed in later years. They were only given a couple of races up to 150 miles next season ... If at all. Later, as often posted, due to ill health. I never trained the y/b's. But as yearlings or 2yo's they went first time in basket. Indeed I hardly, if ever trained my birds. Fortunate in that I could have a open loft etc.
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Well, the past weekend passed would have finalised – hopefully, what birds were going to be paired to what bird. You being happy with— new mates or staying the same. ( Well always that nagging doubt eh!) The close season would have given us ample time to decide what was going to make room in the nest boxes. - lists on what the yearlings and two y/o's had done etc. Would the y/b's have made a mark themselves? The urge to ad nest boxes meant deciding NO! Maybe next years yearlings would prove themselves worthy of both racing and nest box. Now this week or over the next two weeks pairing would be done and birds settled for the first of two rounds. There would be plenty of time for the youngsters to mature. Certainly enough and race the program. First rounders would go to the first two races in theory, and the second rounders the next two – come back races. The close season would be soon enough to see if your matings tested by Mr Basket were spot on! Maybe a tweak or two needed...! Or a complete change!