Merlin

Steel floor grills from local scrapyard,cut into handling pieces with angle grinder,with a two foot pit beneath,cost only effort and a few bob.support your local scrapyard.

They have flown and won at 600 miles

Welcome Dublin Flyer,it doesnt really matter what way its done so long as birds are kept healthy,I use the torch on the lofts myself

Stilll of opinion some sprinters would make good distance birds regardless of vel if prepared correctly,in its infancy all races were by to days standard compartively short races,even then its obvious there must have been birds with ability to fly distances,otherwise distance strains would not be here today,I beleive its more to do with fancier than birds,how many fanciers would take a good winner at say 250 mls vel 1200 ypm and following season prepare her for 600 mls,most will go with tried and tested 500/600 mile lines,posssibly a safer bet no doubt,at distance I beleive the most important thing required is the thing you cant evaluate or see, its heart,tenacity,and sheer guts.on that day. Total agreement a very enjoyable thread.and hopefully many more to come.

A general rule re peanuts is the lighter coloured brown the skin/husk is the better the peamut, they should always be firm, always hand feed and sparingly,there is nothing worse/better to put fat on birds

Did feed Beans many years ago,too much energy required to digest same,for birds to retain water in basket,I feed a handful of rice before basketing for race.

By many of the posts thoughts above,is it not possible that these sprinter strains with careful selection,proper preparation,patience, feeding, and very important item in this case,fanciers ability could some of these be also capable of flying the distance,a good bird is a good bird regardless. P.S Best threadt for a long time.

one cock to several hens.

My answers with particular attention to the word my in this instance is . Rear three rounds only/re health and well being of parents and youngsters Race Birds are mated 14th Feb ( romantic at heart) All year round,with Big Moult starting x amount of weeks after first youngster left nest. One of each or use Bull system,with feeders

In agreement with Ch Pied on this the most elusive is the one who can sprint and can stay,with Roland also with birds of yesterday being a lot more determined,which was down to the systems of yesterday,with all thats available to us today feeds,medicines.many others,the older fancier seldom had this gear at his disposal,his methods of selection were his big asset,with a loft of working pigeons,bred from generations of others like them,no paper pedigrees,a stock loft was dodgy gear in the attic,each and every bird had to earn its corn,meagre by to days standard,but how funny this is it was good enough to have old birds home from 500 on the day,and youngsters 234,on a regular basis,money wasnt plentiful, if ever it was,there was many things more urgent than pigeons,not so much pigeons havent stood the test of time,more the methods of the fancier. The Wescott strain with certain fanciers where the blood is still rich,is a strain I would include if requiring distance and tenacious ability

Most birds with the exception of Widowers to-day are overfed at all times begining in the nest,our image of what a healthy fed bird should look like is far removed in most instances from what a healthy bird should be fed.truest words that apply to most working creatures,master the feeding and you are almost there/carbs/proteins/etc they are like a yo yo at different times,with the golden rule being enough should never be too much, there is never a reason for overfeeding

Full agreement with Tammy re WHO THINKS THEY BOUGHT THE BEST BIRD. this will be applicable in two to three years only,and only then with the help of the fanciers ability,testimony to this being amount of sales and amount of buyers attending them on such a regular basis.

Fly aways by this very title dont exist,when it happens its down to errors of judgement of youngsters and or fanciers in most cases ,with this happening chiefly to birds of a young age,who have not at this stage of their life developed /acquired the ability to navigate, to leave birds out at this stage of their development with lots of daylight hours is asking for trouble ,,clashing with race/training batches/B.O.P.AND and any multitude of other reasons / mine is late evening excercise only, till they are at least after receiving a few tosses,helping to hone their navigational ability,losses will not be as damaging then. After first race for Y/B, I have open loft for next month,hoping they will be taken away by any passing batch,and often they are,with the worthwhile ones always back. i do notice when nestmates are Cock and Hen if left to chose their own mates which I do for Y/B season only, they will chose each other about 50% of time

Its a long time since I have heard that expression Stilling Eggs,and have done it many times with many different birds,remove egg straight away as soon as laid ,keep at loft temp,and turn on a daily basis,I have had eggs hatch after 17 days myself,how long after this they would stay good for I couldnt really say.

Copper Sulphate level tea spoonful in their bath water on a regular basis,also very useful for keeping coxi and canker at bay

All the debate re E.T.S the amount of energy and time spent discussing it,the expected fall off with membership,Birds of Prey, Young Bird Losses,Young Bird sickness, Councils stance,D.E.F.R.A re Avian Influenza,Foot and Mouth Price of and rings on an ongoing basis,security of same not forgetting its a micro chip with said info,so has Bank Cards look at embezzling there.,would it not be benifical to all our birds welfare,if just half the effort and monies expended on above went to solving any of above problems, I am neither ant/pro E.T S. and if it was used to help disabled no problem,give it free,but the way it has been introduced,diability act, should each club now have wheelchair access,race sheets in braille,commercialism was the reason for its introduction,nothing else.in general its of no benifit to our birds,or problems they face.

These drugs and their misuse of are definitely causing problems re losses,there are other factor also,my own opinion being that main culprit is too many inferior birds are bred yearly,in most cases from in lots of instances pedigrees rather than performance birds, estimated that there is 40% less fanciers now than25 years ago,with rings issued having doubled in that time,less fanciers breeding more birds,there is no single factor responsible for abnormal losses,but many,bad libs,clashing,inadequate schooling training,over training,hawks,bad management,the list goes on, they are only youngsters for one season,lose one,you have dropped a potential 1 year old/2 year old etc, the most successful fanciers are those who can mind their youngsters,they are the future of the loft,without a good selection at seasons end, eventually you will be in trouble, or buying yet again.

My sympathy goes out to you Dark Knight its awful to want something an not have be able to have through no fault of your own,a third party in this instance,is there no one in your area that you might go into partnership with.

I keep racing them till their performance diminishes on a somewhat regular basis,an this depends on bird in quest,a general yardstick is at 4 year old for widowers,they then go natural and on to chanel and distance. Ideally they should only go into stock loft if they and the rest of their family are good performers racing/ you can have a top class bird with any amount of wins, from obscure lines,it certainly should be bred from, into a close bred bird of good working lines, I think a better percentage of good birds produced if all of its family have proven themselves,again a yardstick I use is crosses for racing,and inbreeding/close breeding for stock.this is my system,but to each his own.

Welcome back Bruno,and as usual your input is totally logical,educational,with a relevant amount of insight,on this issue

I have no problem in understanding what Sammy is on about,being of the same mind as regards health of pigeons,and I believe to administer most medications ad lib on a regular basis to birds,in most cases when its not even required,now who is being irresponsible,the immune system is most important in all living creatures,boost this by all means,dont abuse it with conoctions of different chemicals,its when immune system cant cope,troubles begin,healty immune system,equals very little illness,practices this for many years,my birds are as healthy as one can expect,they win in good company for myself,and also for others,and have done for years,I have no problem with fanciers who wish to fly what I term (dopeheads) they come and go with regularity,my own methods are tried and trusted,a good healthy immune system,if one should show signs of illness,dispose of it,its a weakness,a flaw in its make up,these are working athletes, and nature has decreed it so,why bother to medicate something inferior,which you should be trying to eliminate

Well done to the ladies,all are winners.

Agree with above,but,before I use Vaseline leg is held under cold running water for some time,leg size will shrink somewhat,now apply Vaseline which will make it so much easier, try twisting it on rather than pushing or pulling.

An open mind to try most of those,with ones that aid and benefit my birds no longer a theory,but practical, I like to think I have an open mind regarding most things,an hopefully never too old to learn,two I nominate are throat and eye-sign,they work for me,and are to my mode of thought no longer a theory

I like to see both youngster having an abundance of (yellow) if a darker one ever appears( Foxy rather than yellow) so much the better,crops always bulging with parents milk from 2 to 6 days old, pellets I feed sparingly and only from about 14 days old, all pellets are digested too easy and will result in overeating and overfeeding,my last and what I consider my best barometer at this age,lift parent from nest in dark,shine a light directly in to youngsters eye,and watch reaction and speed of muscle,how quickly the pupil changes from small to large,the slower it changes,the quicker they fail these are my preferences re young birds,after that its fingers crossed for the rest of season,very good post Fifer.