andy could it not be the case that the east winds and most of your birds have only been raced east have not picked up how to race up the west coast or are not good enough speaking for ourselfes weve lost 18 to 20 doos and still have 40 or 50 left and we train both sides berwick galaSHIELS JOHNSTONEBRIDGE AND ELVANFOOT SO OURS KNOW BOTHSIDES and as you know we will race from anywhere the birds are theyre to race and if theyre not good enough theyre gone simple :emoticon-0138-thinking: