TIME FOR A CHANGE

[robbie]

After yesterdays race, i feel that it is time for a change.I personally have lost 20 birds in the last two weeks,( all raced out of Otterburn, approx 90 miles) and i am, by all accounts not alone, we have persisted in racing down this East side of the country, for a number of years now ,because of the Raptors,down the middle of the country would cause havoc, i have never lost as many young birds before flying down this route!  and we all know now, these birds are everywhere.We are told it is cheaper to convoy with other feds  because they are down this route!, so money before welfare of our birds.Almost ever fed in the country is on the east side of the country, which race on Saturday's,( our last race we had over 10 feds at the same racs point) so clashing is inevitable.

The race controllers have an almost impossible task to get the birds into the air with the weather, other libs and and depending on the location the time factor of birds getting home.

The solution ,I PERSONALLY HAV'NT GOT  THE ANSWERS, nothing is full proof, but surely we could look at either Scottish feds race Saturday and English feds Sunday,( or vice versa)

Midweek racing for Young birds!

Scottish birds racing from the north?, anything to stop this happening ever year,

I dare say a lot of these ideas have been looked at before, but personally if this kind of self distruction continues, i wont be around to see it happen.

 

[Roland]

Always told in past the reason that we have to stick to the East side was A. 'Raptures and B. that Pigeons wouldn't rise up and go over the mountains....

Well A. raptures are every where now,  and B. is a load of cobblers, and more like the East coaster won't allow it. Fanciers won't accept change to push forward. Now in reality if the pigeons would riseover the Back bone of britain, then it would be fairer for everyone in Leicester, Northants etc. etc. as they's fan out after say Worksop ... but funnily enough when we race Worksop, as always in a West wind East benefits...

[square_peg]

After yesterdays race, i feel that it is time for a change.I personally have lost 20 birds in the last two weeks,( all raced out of Otterburn, approx 90 miles) and i am, by all accounts not alone, we have persisted in racing down this East side of the country, for a number of years now ,because of the Raptors,down the middle of the country would cause havoc, i have never lost as many young birds before flying down this route!  and we all know now, these birds are everywhere.We are told it is cheaper to convoy with other feds  because they are down this route!, so money before welfare of our birds.Almost ever fed in the country is on the east side of the country, which race on Saturday's,( our last race we had over 10 feds at the same racs point) so clashing is inevitable.

The race controllers have an almost impossible task to get the birds into the air with the weather, other libs and and depending on the location the time factor of birds getting home.

The solution ,I PERSONALLY HAV'NT GOT  THE ANSWERS, nothing is full proof, but surely we could look at either Scottish feds race Saturday and English feds Sunday,( or vice versa)

Midweek racing for Young birds!

Scottish birds racing from the north?, anything to stop this happening ever year,

I dare say a lot of these ideas have been looked at before, but personally if this kind of self distruction continues, i wont be around to see it happen.

 

THINK DOOS GOIN NORTH ON SATURDAY  AND GOIN SOUTH ON SUNDAY  IS A GREAT IDEA     FOLLOWING WEEKEND IT COULD BE SWITCHED,BUT

 

WHAT ABOUT THE WEATHER     ONLY 1 GOOD DAY IN THE WEEKEND,

WHAT ARE THE LOGISTICS REGARDING TRANSPORTATION     WILL IT BE MORE EXPENSIVE ON A SUNDAY

 

STILL THINK ITS A GOOD IDEA THO 8)

[Chris Little]

Some good pointers there Robbie.

 

Our fed decided to switch back down the traditional M6 racepoints a couple of years ago for some reason. My worst fears were realised as returns have been shocking particularily with the young birds...... the 'east' beckons....

 

One of the biggest problems with the 'east' racepoints is the sheer volume of organistaions both north and south roaders using these racepoints, if we are to continue using these spots perhaps say Saturday for north roaders only and Sundays for the Scots or even midweek racing, just food for thought but certainly worth a go

[robbie]

we have about 18 members in our club, there is only about 5/6 going to the open next week due to either being cleaned out or keeping what they have left for next year.

[doos r us]

Some good pointers there Robbie.

 

Our fed decided to switch back down the traditional M6 racepoints a couple of years ago for some reason. My worst fears were realised as returns have been shocking particularily with the young birds...... the 'east' beckons....

 

One of the biggest problems with the 'east' racepoints is the sheer volume of organistaions both north and south roaders using these racepoints, if we are to continue using these spots perhaps say Saturday for north roaders only and Sundays for the Scots or even midweek racing, just food for thought but certainly worth a go

 

think the proof is in my ayr nth rd post if u want to continue east coast which national minded fanciers will think u got to be looking along the lines of feds having joint libs ie dundee /angus/aberdeen/fife all going together  the same of lanark/midland/central etc may not suit some but its yb returns we all want

[frank-123]

sorry to hear robbie you have had it bad

 

lanarkshire seems to have faired a lot better we have had three races from kelso and one from otterburn i have lost 5 birds maybe because we are holding till later in the day most feds that went early at otterburn the hawks would have had dinner before lanarkshire got a liberation

 

still think we should buy some eagle owls and release them into the borders they maybe clear the hawks out of our race route

i woke this morning looked out my bedroom window to see if my latecomer was back only to see a sparrowhawk sitting on top of the loft the things are everywhere

[swilcox]

Everybody has lost high numbers, all over the UK, i still have 10 missing from saturday and some were on there 6th race!!!!!!!

[Guest jason]

Theres definately somthing in regards losses I've been racing from the same location for 20 years now and on saturday we saw 6 batches going over with upto 300/350 birds in.........in 20 years this is a first for us and me and the wife couldn't believe what we were seeing....... :-/

 

there was one pack with approx 100/150 birds in and they were lost.....they didn't know which way to go....they were back and forth over our loft for a good 15 minutes.

 

As I say never seen this in 20 years

 

Jason

[Guest]

We had a previous discussion about Saturday and Sunday racing. Personally I think it is a good idea. Might be very cost effective too for North /South organisations, if each transporter was carrying loaded baskets in both directions.

 

We had a previous discussion about 10 or more feds at one liberation point which considering the one we were both involved in - Otterburn - has no facilities, honestly don't see point in that or even being there in the first place.

 

Otterburn is also a strange one because I know I never seem to get birds in decent time out of there. Our convoy headed south last week, club mate had a bird reported in Newcastle - to be expected, perhaps, but to also have one reported in Liverpool???? Discussion yesterday turned up word of a large 'radio transmitter' just north of there, guy that trains there says if you are listening to the radio in car it goes dead when you approach this?? Is this a cause?

 

Agree with North road racing in Scotland. Its not very fashionable tho, and if you mention it in an open meeting, folk look at you as if you're mad. Second organisation, WoS racing North with YBs this year, seems to have been successful. Worth a try for Feds in Central Belt to Borders.

 

Lastly, don't subscribe to 'hawks are everywhere' homily. You could say same of the British, you'll find them all over the world. But the one place you're guaranteed to meet them in large numbers is Britain. Same with peregrines, the one place you're guaranteed to meet them in large numbers is west coast: M6 corridor, Wales and SW England. RSPB tear us to shreds for racing that corridor against their advice. But we should at least make sure the skies are clear before the birds go off, and rockets have been suggested, and used, we must use deterrents more.

 

 

[Guest Vic]

Surprised that losses are high around most areas, becauseI have found mine have been minimum. We were at Taunton yesterday, with excellent returns, once again. Not entirely happy though, as mine are just off the pace this yb season. I still have 43  ybs left, having  lost very few indeed. I will be saving the best bred cocks  for next year, with 20 hens and 10 cocks going to the NFCs Guernsey YB race. I have two racing today in the Amal  breeder buyer race from Poole, liberated 8.45. Looks like a hard race for a change, about time too!  

[Guest REDFOXKRAUTHS]

when channel racing was band last year we went to sunday racing and we didnt loose many birds at all

[blackjack]

sir i do not race young birds but they get a damn good education 100 miles n,s e and w and get broken up and have to think they are trained where ever i go .I have never had a problem with them as yearlings as long as you use common sense give it a go .

[Alex]

Robbie i myself lost 28 out of Ripon on Saturday and i am not alone with these heavy losses,this is our second year jumping the young birds from Otterburn and then race Ripon an 80 mile jump and again i have had these heavy losses two year running,i wont being doing it next year,also the strong west wind may have contributed to the disastar i only know that like most fanciers who had these heavy losses i am sick and what do we do,go west or north or just educate up to the 100 miles with y/birds i am certainly rethinking for next year as for change Bruno's right the agm just go on as usual ignoring a call for change.think of the money lost to the fed next week at its open race,fees up next year?to make it alright for the lofts with the overfly? :'(

[robbie]

spot on Alex, this jump was done ( so i am told ) to enable OUR transpoter to be used for the national on the 8th sept! Makes you think is it the tail wagging the dog here???

[Fair Play]

Mobile phone masts the b-----s seem to be everywhere if humans are complaining about them and having them removed because of one thing or another then what will they do to a young pigeon that is just developing. Nothing will ever be done as there is too much money involved. Is there not a US listening station outside Harrogate could well be a problem God knows what is being unleashed into the atmosphere we are not allowed near it what about the birds that fly over it.

[robbie]

i totally agree with you fairplay, but as you say these things are here to to stay, we have to come up with the solution, we cant afford to sit back and do nothing.

[Guest]

spot on Alex, this jump was done ( so i am told ) to enable OUR transpoter to be used for the national on the 8th sept! Makes you think is it the tail wagging the dog here???

 

Sorry, but your information is completely wrong. This is the 1st 'jump' year, and the jump was proposed by management committee at 2006 agm after we were wiped out at Witton Castle last year. Their study showed every fed liberating at any racepoint in the area between Otterburn and Ripon got wiped out last year - the opinion was that this is a 'black spot' for pigeons caused by the huge number of TV and Radio Transmitters in the area. Birds seemed to be able to overfly the area, but not come out of it when liberated within it.

 

At one of our moots, T Blair our then Race Controller let it be known he was told that Ripon was a problem for the birds too, as it is low? and the birds can't get height to go over hills just to the north of it, so they turn back. The alternative recommended to T Blair at the time was Wetherby.

 

And there appears to be a problem with Otterburn too.

 

 

[robbie]

so our transpoter isnt being used to convoy the national birds?

[Guest]

Agree that we have the contract to transport SNFC but honestly don't know which transporter will be used as that depends on numbers going to the race.

 

We have agreement on the use of other Fed's transporters,  for example we raced on the same days as SNFC this year and last year, and still transported them to their racepoints, and our own birds to ours. Recall that I helped load the Midlothian Fed transporter this year for one of the inland nationals, transhipping out of the Central Fed transporter.

 

 

[billymac]

YES IT IS,YOU ARE CORRECT ROBBIE!

[robbie]

 

Sorry, but your information is completely wrong. This is the 1st 'jump' year, and the jump was proposed by management committee at 2006 agm after we were wiped out at Witton Castle last year. Their study showed every fed liberating at any racepoint in the area between Otterburn and Ripon got wiped out last year - the opinion was that this is a 'black spot' for pigeons caused by the huge number of TV and Radio Transmitters in the area. Birds seemed to be able to overfly the area, but not come out of it when liberated within it.

 

At one of our moots, T Blair our then Race Controller let it be known he was told that Ripon was a problem for the birds too, as it is low? and the birds can't get height to go over hills just to the north of it, so they turn back. The alternative recommended to T Blair at the time was Wetherby.

 

And there appears to be a problem with Otterburn too.

 

 

Can i ask the question then, why were we at Ripon last week if we had all this information available to us!!!!!

[frank-123]

because people go to an agm and sit there and say nothing

if there is a problem with a liberation site why do the shu/rpra still give these site's the ok

1: water point for the transporter

2:toilets for the convoyer/driver

3: is there room for a liberation hgv able to gain access

 

then we can ask the convoyer if he waits that long did the birds clear the site

if they never

did other feds have the same problem

[robbie]

because people go to an agm and sit there and say nothing

if there is a problem with a liberation site why do the shu/rpra still give these site's the ok

1: water point for the transporter

2:toilets for the convoyer/driver

3: is there room for a liberation hgv able to gain access

 

then we can ask the convoyer if he waits that long did the birds clear the site

if they never

did other feds have the same problem

 

Yes Bart these points have also to be taken into consideration, but if you look at Bruno's reply, they had all the facts before them last year and even our Race controller telling them that there was a problem with the Ripon race point,

Is it ME who is missing the point here!!!!!!

[Guest]

I wasn't able to attend the agm last year [holiday in spain] but I did pass on what had been said about Ripon this year, just before the comeback race, when I was told it had been re-arranged from Thirsk [complaints about lack of facilities at that racepoint] to Ripon. Was told Wetherby was too far. Expect something to happen to both Otterburn and Ripon after this year tho.