Breeding birds from unknown racing ability

[Speckled Jim]

Have recently been offered a share in a Loft, the current owner is very busy with work and doesnt have much time for his birds hence they havnt been raced much, but am told are bred from good lines. Was wondering if it is possible to breed from the birds once ive raced them a few times next season, then pair up the birds that get the best results. I dont really want to breed from unknown pairings. Most people say breed the best from the best.

[pjc]

If you are going to race them first then hopefully by the time you decide to breed from them you may have sorted out the birds that are going to perform and some will have been lost or disguarded.

If you are going to make it a serious/competative partnership then you may want to purchase some stock, if you do buy from a proven loft putting up regular good performances and buy birds as close to the winners as you can, not from studs that sell birds generations removed from anything thats won.

[OLDYELLOW]

well theres many schools of thought on this subject , one is some racers that have won wont breed a sausage and some breeders of winners wont race , so by racing the birds out could leave you with racers with a few winner  but no breeders of winners , but then theres the best catogory racers that have won that also breed winners , so i would personaly breed a full round and eliminate from the ybs performances as yearlings , so basicaly if not made it as ybs swap pairs round if no winners by 3rd year remove  

[peterpau]

Let 'em breed and bang 'em down the road HARD and you may get some surprises.

[Guest cloudview]

really speaking you should breed from everything in the loft , providing the quality is there

as no one knows where the next champion will pop up from , this more easy with a small team

i liken it to humans   ie have all the words best athetes come from winning parents , also are their siblings just as good at sport , i think not , most are one offs

[DUBLINFLYER]

in my opinion it would depend on a couple of things

1 have they raced before? if not breed from them an race young birds from them against your own

2 have you ever raced successfully before? if so it will be a good yard stick to measure against you own

 

[Roland]

Welcome to the lottery. A good stockman is born with the invisable infinatiny that makes the excell, shine above us others.

You have it, or you don't and 99% of us don't.

So we have trial and error and hopefully learn from ours, and others mistakes, expierences.

Duds can breed greats, and oh too many good birds breed rubbish. the vast majority are  - in a racing / breeding context rubbish. - Now may well be superb for what God intended, but we get our pleasure, excitement in a way that wasn't intended.

Best advise is 'Race them through' and mate like for like and size to size.

Next season or two you will have a far better idea than any scenario's that you may pick up here. That is not to say that very much, and worthwhile info won't be gained here, for it will.

First off try not to reach for the 'Bottle'!

Clean blood and fresh air. A dry and draught free loft. A haven is when they feel safe there.

Birds contentment, fit, lean and ready to fly.

Then give mr a basket his job. Try and keep the birds fresh, like alternative weeks of racing....

Seasons end will be a different view and ball game. Good luck.

[hotrod]

just a word of caution it's not always the best racers that breed good racers sometimes it's the opposite,i would say try a round off them first then race them lightly and see how the offspring go before you throw them away

[Roland]

Would certainly put them through their paces this coming race season. Any bought in would also be kept seperate.

[Guest Owen]

A lot will depend on how old these birds are. Most pigeons require education and training as youngsters. Very, very, few will be able to cope with training and racing if they are aged birds and are asked to race for the first time.

I agree with the person who said that you would be better breeding from the best of them and racing the young right out. This should tell you all you want to know.

I would hedge my bets by buying one really good cock that has won well and use him as a bull cock. This way you will save years of time and your young will have one parent that has proved he can do it. It is probably is true that non winners will produce winners. But I can not be bothered to spend the time and money finding out. I think you should breed from known facts. Winners to winners gives you more winners in the long run. And the more you go on doing it that way the better it gets.

[The Navigator]

The basket will always tell and I am sure at the end of the season you will know what to do.

[joe61]

roland i agree withyou 100% every word is correct but as you say not many fanciers have the knolledge thats the differance between top and bottom you can buy from any loft but you need to buy from a top loft and you need to know what a top bird looks and feels like so their you have it

 

oh happy days

[Guest spin cycle]

Have recently been offered a share in a Loft, the current owner is very busy with work and doesnt have much time for his birds hence they havnt been raced much, but am told are bred from good lines. Was wondering if it is possible to breed from the birds once ive raced them a few times next season, then pair up the birds that get the best results. I dont really want to breed from unknown pairings. Most people say breed the best from the best.

 

if i'm understanding you correctly you are asking if you can give the pigeons a few races and then breed a yb team off the 'best' and presumably still be able to have ybs old enough to fly the yb prog..?....if thats the case its probably possible but its going to be tight. you are sacrificing yb team age in the hope that the best breeding pigeons will show in the early races..that may not be the best trade. if it were me i'd concentrate on getting the yearlings/2yo fit and going well...and breed of the 3/4 yearolds. i don't know why or if its right thats just  what i'd do

[Guest Hjaltland]

Let 'em breed and bang 'em down the road HARD and you may get some surprises.

 

Yup... breed from them all first, dont wait until the yb's become late breds, race out the old birds and that will indicate what's good, then race out the yb's then select from what's left... at the end of the season you will have a fair idea of whats what and you may feel then you need to look around at new stock... or maybe not,  depending on how you do. Whatever you do  - give the existing stock a chance, dont assume they are crap, there could well be gooduns among them.

 

All the best

[Guest chrisss]

do not race any of the old birds [this year]breed off every bird you have, and race the yb this year,at the end of the year look at the yb left,or bin breeding for this year, and race the old birds hard,every bird is unknown until it breeds what you want,and i think that as normal ,everyones idea might not work for somebody else

[jimmy white]

i would suggest breeding a team of yb,s from these birds ,train and race them,, very very carefully [the basket is not the be all and end all ,especialy with yb,s , some fanciers put pigeons into races when their not ready or not fit or havent experience, in this case the basket can be a fools weapon where the fool will blame the pigeon ] i dont know if you have experience in racing pigeons or not,, all the better if you have,, but if you havent , i would read , study, pick up many hints tips from this forum , and above all,,,ask questions,, if these birds are decent bred , treated in the right way,, you would have as much chance of winning   or probably  ,,more chance if your loft management was better than your fellow flier ,,,best of luck

[Guest youngzimmy]

would that mean youngsters with star bright eyes darts on there backs and shaking like a leaf oh if only

[Speckled Jim]

Thanks for the replys. do have a few young late bred birds from this season wil see how they go in old bird series later this year.

[gooner]

when i started a few years back i obtained birds from various sources and bred off them, raced them hard and at the end of the season what was left the parents were kept and the rest disposed of, strangely most of the young came out of the same pairs

[budgie]

Depending on how long they have been of the road i would tread carefully.If they have been of for a couple of seasons and there will be stock pigeons amongst them i would check with the previous owner.If in doubt take 1 round of youngsters (no late breds) and give them every race including the Young Bird National.Check whats left after the racing, keep the parents and bin the rest (regardless of the cost) and remember the 98% sh-ite rule.

[Guest]

keep succesful pairings together

any that dont have youngsters left change the pairings around a few times

some birds dont work well together but with a different partner you might breed the goods

dont be in a hurry to discard birds after one season especialy as you dont know the birds

 

just my opinion

dave

[Taylorsloft]

Let 'em breed and bang 'em down the road HARD and you may get some surprises.

 

every time we pair up .we don't know what we are getting its all on hope breed and race em  

[walterbmasson]

                                                                    

dave 2 years with different mates is long enough to see if theres any potential there the sooner you have breeding birds that you can relay on and start floating the

re eggs under some racers or spare good feeders or you will struggle breeding off anything means for sure you will be left very little do the same again the next season your back to square one for me find the birds you can relay on if the breeding is there certainly try them out but dont fill loft of rubbish remember once youve got a good breeding cock with a bull box you can try a lot of hens  8)  8)

[Guest]

i agree with you walter

was only saying to try a few different pairings to find the ones that work

as it looks like hes no knowledge of the birds hes going to have

i would try three different hens with a cock in the first year and vice versa

after y/b raceing you should have a good idea of what youve got that works

some y/bs dont mature and start to show until there yearlings especially distance lines

thats why i give a maximum of 2 years to prove themselves

 

dave