midnight_son

I think the SNFC had the ideal program years ago and never realised how lucky we were. It was:- Sartilly (2nd weekend June) Rennes (last friday June) Nantes (1st weekend July) Sartilly (3rd weekend July) For years this pattern worked perfectly well and it still would. Fashions have changed regarding racepoints, routes etc and you can substitute whichever preference you like for the racepoints but those dates were spot on to maximise the entries from the available pool of pigeons. The gap between the first and last channel race has to be long enough to allow the natural flyers the chance to get their birds down on chipping eggs/ babies again - 5 weeks is perfect. You can then recycle almost every bird that gets home from Sartilly 1 (or equivalent) into Sartilly 2 (or equivalent). That opens the door to things like Gold Awards and Dewar Trophys as you give so many more birds a chance to compete from France on more than one occasion. The inland nationals have complicated life for everyone, the only useful purpose they serve is to make a profit for the club (not to be sniffed at of course, the money is handy). However, is it a false economy if it results in the frequently significant losses of pigeons that ensue ? If the guys lose a heap of yearlings at the inland race then not only will they hold back from sending to France that year but it has a knock on effect the following year as well. If we can afford financially to live without them then we should try it and see what happens. How about 2 separate races from the coast, one for sections A,E and F (maybe D) and one for sections B, C and G (maybe D). The SNFC could do the organisation of the races and keep any profit but they wouldn't count for the averages. That would still allow the feds to get to the coast in joint convoy with the natinal but by having an east and west combine type of race we might get better returns which would filter through to the channel races in due course.

Sounds a good team you have away Gareth, you need something that still has the fire in it's belly to win these races, not old birds soured by bad experiences. Lets hope it's a good race and there are some top performances that inspire more people to compete in future but, sadly, I won't be holding my breath on the latter.

I sent 2, there was only something like 40 away from Musselburgh. Something needs to be done to revive this race, why are members not supporting it ? Is it the distance alone ? Would we get many more if we dropped back to the Tours/Nantes distance ? Probably not many, Andrezel didn't do much better and it was just the same as distance as Reims give or take a few miles. Would some kind of initative like free birdage make any difference ? Obviously a big sponsorship would be required to fund that type of thing. Going by last years results, over 400 members went to the gold cup but just over 100 to the long race. If those 400 guys get a buzz out of the gold cup surely they would also get a buzz out of the long race, how do we get them to try it ? Why do some members send 5,6,7,8 birds to the gold cup but none to this one ? To me, it's inconceivable to miss a national, i'd rather have 1 at each than a team at one and miss another one. Maybe we need to convince folk that it's not just a race for plodding old 5 and 6 year olds that just dodge up the road in their own time, that it is alright to send 2 and 3 year olds to these races. It shouldn't be thought of as 2-3 day race - i think that puts folk off for a start. 42mph is under 15.5 hours for 650 miles, no reason why there won't be birds on the night or early 2nd morning if we can have an early liberation and a bit of help from the weather. Maybe if members started with that mindset rather than thinking it'll be lunchtime or afternoon 2nd day they'd be more willing to send.

I'm sending 2 with my main hope being my 8th open Andrezel hen. The other one is not in her league in my opinion so it's pretty much all on the 8th open hen. Her babies should hatch tomorrow and her last race was Bovingdon but has had plenty training since then. Hope the race is well supported. I think my dad has 5 or 6 for it.

4/6 for me, others in the village that i know of are 2/2 and 5/8 so pretty content with that

There should have been a message on the SNFC website/lib line regarding Section B clock station but it's not there. Clocks for section B will be done between 1400-1500 on Sunday afternoon in Musselburgh Rugby club - spread the word !!

I'm in at 1808, 425 miles, just east of edinburgh

There is definitely at least one scottish bird at the barcelona race this year, not sure if any others

Great flying by Charlie Cameron, one of many top performances all over Scotland tonight. I think a good advert for 500 mile racing in this country - and for early liberations !

Aye, he's a sporting chap that Eggy !! I'm up to train the Ypres birds anyway. Tell him well done for his bird tonight, thats a game one at the back of 10.

Got my 5th open Tours hen from 2008 timed at 2132. So thats 2/2 100% returns and no 4.30am rise - i've had worse nights than this !

Jamie Combe Elphinstone 2044 and my dad Richard Combe at 2048 (just as I gave him my duplicate) !

Andy/Gareth, Bourges would be 652 miles to me as against 670 odd from Niort. Would be a great race with a decent convoy from UNC to help our birds up the road a bit. It would be ideal if it came 3 weeks later in the year. On the downside I was flicking through a yearbook covering the 1996 results and the entry for Niort was tiny compared to what we used to get for Nantes in that era. In fact the entry for Niort in 1996 was even lower than we get for Tours/Andrezel in the past few years. We're now 13 years later with a loss of members to SNRPC so the entry for the Nantes/Tours type of distance has dropped considerably. The danger with going back to Niort is that it scares off some of those who currently have a go at the 600 mile race - it clearly had that impact back in the 90s when compared to the Nantes entry.

When I was a lad (not all that long ago really) the SNFC staged 5 races a year, 80% of them were 500 miles or above to central belt and the only inland race was the YB national. Last season the SNFC staged 7 races less than half were over 500 miles to central belt and nearly half were inland. Introducing Newbury was the thin end of a very dangerous wedge for those who keep pigeons with the sole target of long distance racing. On the issue of feds joint convoying with the national. It’s all well and good the feds coming along, makes economic sense for them but one point that is missed is that national racing is a lot different to club and fed racing. They’re not all heading to roughly the same area like in club racing and the degree of difficulty of actually getting birds home is much greater. Is it wise for us to take a largely yearling convoy to Eastbourne for a national knowing it’s going to be tough for them. These are the 2YO’s for the following season, shouldn’t we leave the feds to sort out their own joint convoying with neighbouring feds where they will have a higher chance of good returns and therefore more 2YO’s ready for the channel the next year. I think the SNFC should forget about staging inland races bar the YB national. If we can all cast our minds back a decade or so we used to have the old Sartilly/Falaise/Avranches 1 race that was perfectly successful staged on the 2nd weekend in June 2 weeks before the gold cup race. Having a channel race on that weekend makes a spread of 5 weeks between first and last channel race which is just enough to get natural birds down on small youngsters or a long time on eggs. The pigeons that went to Sartilly 1 went back to Sartilly 2. That option no longer exists. If I send a hen to the gold cup and her favoured nest condition is chipping eggs or babies and she does well then I have no chance to get her back to the channel in that condition. I find this very frustrating because it makes it nearly impossible for these pigeons to compete for Dewar Trophies and Gold Awards as they are limited to one channel race per season whereas back in the 80s and 90s they had a good crack at 2 of them. I grew up with 4 channel races, it balanced the season and in my opinion it’s never been the same since we lost that race. In an ideal world I’d like to see 4 channel races spread over 5 weeks. The feds should bang their heads together and form amalgamations or combines to economically get to the coast for the yearlings and the SNFC should leave them to it and focus on staging 500 mile racing for mature pigeons that have had a good grounding in their feds and combines. My program would therefore be :- Fri 11th or Sat 12th June – 500 miles to central belt (whether that’s Clermont line or Sartilly line I don’t mind) Friday 25th June – Gold Cup (take your pick of racepoints 530-560miles) A race from Nantes Tours Niort area/distance with flexibility to joint convoy with best available fit on either the Fri/Sat 2nd/3rd July or Fri/Sat 9th/10th July Friday 16th July - 500 miles to central belt along the lines of the first race. At a push I would accept Ypres in place of one 500 mile race but I think before we all fall in love with Ypres and how good a race it was in 2009 we should remember that Ypres this season was flown in very favourable conditions. Let’s remember we live in a country with a prevailing west wind and one day we’re going to get a stiff westerly wind out of Ypres and we’ll very possibly get creamed. The issue of cost needs to be considered as well but it doesn’t matter if the individual races make a loss so long as the subs and the YB sales etc cover it. The SNFC doesn’t need to make a profit, that’s not the aim of the game – it just needs to clear it’s feet each year and not make a loss.

Thanks to everyone who has PM'd me, got a few options now so hopefully will get something arranged with one of you tomorrow. Cheers !

Can you post contact details for J & M please. Cheers

I'd be grateful for any assistance from fanciers in the Coventry area please who may be able to collect and hold a stray for me. I've had a yearling hen reported down there and having tried several couriers none of them can uplift her until next week. Normally that wouldn't be be so bad but she is being kept in a box by a non-fancier and it's a bit much to ask them to keep that up for another week potentially. If anyone is able and willing to help me out by collecting the hen and keeping her in their loft or a basket until I can arrange a courier for next week please PM me. Thanks

I wonder if those reported birds in Liverpool were genuine times or some red herrings. Have heard that Pennines fed who went at 6.15 from Falaise are doing 43mph and are slightly scattered but not too bad. The North West Grand national who went at 6.30 from Falaise are doing 40mph but getting a good race. That ties up with the conditions a bit better than those 53mph times we heard earlier - not sure they're right ? Either side of the 40mph mark sounds more like it for us.

Could be Andy - depends if they held a direct line up the west of the penines. Suspect our lot will have gone east and will be first drop in Eye Valley rather than Solway but hopefully not. We'll soon find out !

Could be Andy - depends if they held a direct line up the west of the penines. Suspect our lot will have gone east and will be first drop in Eye Valley rather than Solway but hopefully not. We'll soon find out !

That 12.45 time in Liverpool is from a 6.30 liberation according to their libline so that makes it even faster. According to the "as the crow flies" website Falaise to Liverpool is 335 miles and they're doing it in 6 hrs 15 mins. Thats over 53mph. Quite quick considering they were unlikely to get much help from a West wind going into Liverpool.

I got a Mealy cock from Alencon arrive at 9.20pm tonight. I wonder if he was one of those released in Manchester.

19:49 for me from Andrezel

Congratulations to the winners, excellent pigeon. My dad got his challenge entry (well it was his reserve as last years winner wasn't able to defend) home on Tuesday or maybe Wednesday I think it was. Poor wee hen was flown away to nothing.

Got my hen that was 1st Sect 5th open Tours last year. She was waiting to get in at 5.30am this morning when I went out to toss Falaise birds. Her tail has been demolished so she has had a narrow escape somewhere. Good to see a few birds still working in.