The Bernard Matthews Connection

[Guest]

Isn't it strange, they are saying it could be imports from Hungary......informed comment on here said no chance!! It's a good thing science isn't an exact science, 'cause sometimes it can make you (me) look pretty smart and other times it can make you (me) look pretty dumb!!

And before anyone says it I know I don't even have to try!!!

 

To be fair to all those who have posted here, no-one ever said 'no chance'. The nearest I can find is my own 'didn't add up' and Johno's 'well nigh impossible'. Both of these conclusions were based on what we knew at the time, and for me it's still 'doesn't add up'. EU and GB disagree, but EU hasn't stopped EU-wide distribution of the 'suspect' meat products.

 

Good thing the ability to read and understand what you read is an exact science.

[pigeonscout]

Well if that is how it got into uk then that is good news now at least we know it did not come in on wild birds and they are not still flying all over the uk.

[Pompey Mick]

So it was a'commercially confidential' decision not to tell the Public the Turkey carcasses from Hungary were delivered just days before this outbreak. How come poultry movements were allowed so soon after the Hungarian outbreak. DEFRA are quick enough to crack the whip over other, less commercial, issues but to allow imports of poultry in this situation is criminal. These turkeys could be in the food chain by now, so much for Bernard Matthews 'Norfolk' turkeys.

[Diamond dave]

 

Mick - that is a very good point that you have made.

 

PigeonScout -Also note that the report suggests that wild birds were picking over the carcases in the yard - dont hold yer breath mate

[Guest Vic]

I remember not too long ago, putting a posting on basics, regarding Green Peace, being concerned over plants that were facing extinction, subtly adding, that Vic  was more concerned about other PLANTS raising their  ugly heads  before long.TRUE OR FALSE?    VIC.

 

 

WHO BROUGHT THE GOLDEN GOOSE HERE! WITHOUT A BEANSTALK. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D                                            

[Guest]

Bruno, don't even think that can be said of reading!

[Bluedoo]

Don't know if anyone has already posted this. Just got it off of Sky News. Seems a lot has been hushed up...... Theres a surprise

 

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2008935,00.html

 

[Guest]

I've read the report and the only readily identifiable alleged lapse of biosecurity in it is in England at a processing plant. That would explain why Ireland and Jersey have both banned UK poultry imports, not Hungarian products.

 

I'm also seething at this government's handling of what to release to Parliament and to the Press. The reports from the site couldn't have been more glowing on the Bernard Matthews operation, including that given by the Local Authorities whose job it is to ensure that the processing plant operations abide with legal standards at all times.

 

At the time of the Hungarian outbreak, DEFRA carried out a risk assessment on it, as they do with every AI outbreak. It concluded that there was no risk from wild birds or the legal poultry trade spreading the virus from Hungary to Britain. That report also said that there were 907 farms within 10km of the outbreak, 57 of them fairly large concerns. Pure numbers crunching, probability: it is more probable for infection to have come from 907 chances only 10km away, than one chance 330km (165 miles) away. Unless of course, chance had nothing to do with the spread.

 

Personally, think they need to do more disinfecting in Parliaments to get rid of the diseased thinking behind how this bit of business was been handled.

 

  

[Guest]

Bit of a split, merger and renaming of threads because of cross-posting between the original and the new thread 'breaking news' on this subject.

[Guest]

Bruno, don't even think that can be said of reading!

 

Well don't you go driving then.  ;D

[Guest]

Conspiracy theory No1

 

This is an extract of mine from H5N1 thread:-

 

"Government ministers are on record during the Suffolk outbreak as saying everyone - poultry farms in area, general public - is to take their information from the TV. This followed complaints from the local farms and local community that they were receiving nothing in the way of advice or information from official sources. "You are getting it here on TV, it is the quickest way to get it out" (John Gummer MP).

 

The moment the outbreak was confirmed as H5N1 the BBC News 24 reporter on site remarked that 'people here are saying a pigeon with something on its feet may have got into the shed thro a hole in the roof and spread the disease' . Who were the people on the infected farm who said that? Why was it never refuted by Official sources.

 

The Public listen to the News and are told to believe everything they hear, it's coming from Official sources. The first thing the Public hear after H5N1 is confirmed, is (what sounded at the time as) a stupid off-the-cuff remark about a pigeon, which was never refuted by Official sources.  Then the Public hear pigeon racing has been cancelled by the Government and what do they think? Well they'd cancel that to stop pigeons spreading bird flu, wouldn't they, otherwise, what's the point of cancelling it?

 

We are being roped in as scapegoats. "

 

I'd like to change the original Human Health and Public Order contexts in that thread to take account of the new information.

 

Human Health and Public Order contexts

 

Given that it has always been government policy to press home that there is no danger to the public from eating poultry products, it would now be pretty difficult to widely publicise that a possible source of this infection was ... poultry products.

 

It is far easier to blame wild birds or pigeons for the spread. Funny how the first sound-bite after H5N1 was confirmed was a pigeon carrying something on its feet got in thro a hole in the roof. Source? "Some here are saying...".

 

Haven't posted this one up before, but it puzzled, worried and disgusted me at the time: AI expert Professor John Oxford interview on BBC:- "even if the poultry was infected with AI provided someone removed the feathers and the entrails for you, and you cooked it thoroughly, its perfectly safe to eat."

 

Funny how 'the lorry' was carrying part-processed birds, no feathers (definately not allowed) and possibly no entrails.

 

Said before, I tend to look at all the angles.  

 

[collect500]

think i,ll wait and see till more info is available before decideing if bernard mathews is responsible. but what i do find strange is the panic over avian flu  we are told that if it mutates to be able to spread to humans we could have a disease to rival the plague on the one hand

On the other hand we are told that 146 (think thats the right number) humans have contracted the disease and died out of a population of millions and they lived with the birds in the same housing. So whats all the panic about there as many if not more killed at work each year and how many were killed on the roads last year and i,m talking in this country alone.

The problem is non elected goverment bodies who do so called risk assessments based on conjecture not fact. these jobsworths are afraid to base their assessments on facts in case there made to realise that while there is undoubtly some risk its not as high as they would have us believe  remember the B.S.E. scare same people made that assessment  and the edwina egg saga based on risk assessments from defra  just my thoughts  keith

                                collect 500

[Guest Paulo]

send Jamie Oliver round to open a can of whuparse on him

[Guest jason]

round 2 ding ding lol

 

bet matthews has been giving them dodgy feed! Should get Jamie Oliver round to open a can of whuparse on him.

 

 

LMAO. ;D ;D ;D

 

Jason

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

just been on tv that they are now saying that they are counting out the outbreak to have come from wild birds migrating.

defra should have stopped incoming bird products from hungary as soon as there was an outbreak over there!!!..DEFRA are idiots wether the outbreak came from there or not!!

other countries are wise to other countries diseases unlike us we continue to let it go cos of financial gain,when there was foot and mouth in this country all export meat was banned from leaving this country,why wasnt this done in hungry ?...paul

[Roland]

just been on tv that they are now saying that they are counting out the outbreak to have come from wild birds migrating.

defra should have stopped incoming bird products from hungary as soon as there was an outbreak over there!!!..DEFRA are idiots wether the outbreak came from there or not!!other countries are wise to other countries diseases unlike us we continue to let it go cos of financial gain,when there was foot and mouth in this country all export meat was banned from leaving this country,why wasnt this done in hungry ?...paul

 

No! Tthey are certainly not idiots. Obviously they are all well educated in their fields, and often know a lot more, and definately a lot sooner than we ever will. First off they have to decide what is relevant, what they need to hold back, what and more importantly how much if anything the Media need to know.

And personally I can't see how Bernard Matthews,  -If he is in part responcible - can be blamed for trading as he has done for countless years, all to the good of many.

[Guest]

roland i didnt say bernaud matthews was to blame, wot i said was that trading should have been stopped from hungary not bernaud matthews places anyywhere else,...paul

[Roland]

But why, if at the time there was no out break. He, nor DAFRA have crystal balls, and he was doing what he has done for years. And DAFRA, nor the Hungarians new they was an eminent out break. The timing was a 'B**s**d I guess. Crap happens, but the good thing is, if true, that the blame won't be laid at the 'Mirgratory Birds'!

[Guest Hjaltland]

If it is the case that infection has been brought in, inadvertantly, from Hungary, then I apologise sincerely to the seagulls on whom I was casting dispersions, and ernestly hope they dont catch it. That goes for any other life form in the vicinity.

[Guest CS]

Did Bernard Matthews or one of his staff reported a bird illness ?

[Diamond dave]

Roland,

With the greatest respect mate I have to disagree with what you are saying.

Defra may well be specialists in their field but if it is proven that it has entered the country in the manner that has been suggested - you cant exactly call them strategists can you?. If (god forbid) this disease did start to affect humans and a pandemic did result from this foul up what will you say -dont blame defra they're good at what they do- they just forgot to cover the back door.

I think "idiots" is a good choice of word to which I could add several more expletives to.

And as for Mr. Matthews - the buck has to stop somewhere. The only thing that he can do to redeem himself now is buy all of us pigeon fanciers a new loft each !!!!!!BOOOOOOOTIFUL

 

D.D.

[Diamond dave]

Craig,

Two of the vets dealing with the slaughter of the turkeys developed respiratory problems - Both were tested negative for the H5N1 virus. - Probably just had a cold but saw the opportunity to make a revelation out of it.

 

D.D

[Guest Vic]

C'mon lads, it's getting past a joke! It could even be at the bottom of the road now, in THE BIG CORNER SHOP. Vic. :

[Roland]

Dave wrote ... but if it is proven that it has entered the country in the manner that has been suggested - you cant exactly call them strategists can you?.

 

Dave with due respect, how could DAFRA, or any one else know, anything at ALL untill someone, somewhere reports the illness. TO presume that they, or anyone else can foretell, forecast that so and such will have a Out break of Avian Flu ANY where is sure foolhardy to say the least. Or be like the weather forecasters and perm any six combinations from 20 odd different 'could be / maybe's.

Are we suggesting here yjat just outside of Kilmanock on March the 4th there will be, in a little remote village an Duck found with the virus!!! Surely not, and to say so is ludicriss. Dafra, like any one else can only go and then take action when there is something amiss. Then they are prompt and on the scene big time. Then they have to wiegh up the pro's and cons. They don't and aren't bless with our foresight then ... but we can spout what and how we like when being wise after the facts.

Yet to aim and point fingers saying they should know and take action Before any event is ... mind boggling. Even tests take time, and the most they can do in any a event id clamp down and close all and  any operations and seal of the area till test results are known and then concrete action is able to be taken.

I personally don't believe for a moment that DAFRA knew Hungry, or any one else knew there was to be  an out break till after there was! Sorry.

[Guest Vic]

OR at the bottom of the garden! :