Guest slugmonkey Posted February 27, 2007 Report Share Posted February 27, 2007 The Benzing system can give you live results in real time so I am sure this is a very easy fix if someone was intrested in using it I would think there would be NO problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slugmonkey Posted February 27, 2007 Report Share Posted February 27, 2007 P.S. once you guys have had ETs you will wonder why you ever fought it it is GREAT you will love it and the older you get with more wear and tear and creaking from your bones in the morning you will love it more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert.sutherland Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 isn't this still a democracy And if that's true doesnt the majority rule well if they wont give way to a handicap by putting so many seconds on to there time why don't we knock the same amount of time of our time clocked that should make thing fare and some way to being true your in sport BOB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 isn't this still a democracy And if that's true doesnt the majority rule well if they wont give way to a handicap by putting so many seconds on to there time why don't we knock the same amount of time of our time clocked that should make thing fare and some way to being true your in sport BOB One of the 'solutions' Bob that I've heard bandied about is to dispense with the need to put the rubber into a thimble, and pop it direct into the clock chamber. Point was raised recently following the RPRA? banning of T3 Flapper clocks which are designed for this. Do we need a specially designed clock for that? Would even things up but might be other implications in bringing it in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdman55678 Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 One of the 'solutions' Bob that I've heard bandied about is to dispense with the need to put the rubber into a thimble, and pop it direct into the clock chamber. Point was raised recently following the RPRA? banning of T3 Flapper clocks which are designed for this. Do we need a specially designed clock for that? Would even things up but might be other implications in bringing it in? Bruno, unfortunately it would not even things out. A manual clocker no matter how you use it will never beat a ET in a close race, its just flat out impossible. Personally as I have posted I would not want to do without my ETS. With the ETS you will always know which bird is actually first to the loft and its simple to pick your best birds each week. At the same time you can tell which ones are either overworked, needing more rest or sick or maybe just lazy or worthless all by the times on the clock, no guess work ever needed. I agree the initial cost is somewhat prohibitive and I had to save for a while to afford mine, but once you have the clock and the rings everything is much more simple from then on, the only added expense from then on is if you happen to lose a bird then you have to replace the electronic ring. I know there are many others with different opinions there but I don't know what else to say other than if you don't have the ETS and everyone else does you will only be racing for the thrill of racing and the closely contested prizes will not be yours. At the same time if your timing manually and your bird is out in front than you will still probably do well with the first few birds it. Without ETS you won't be totally out of it except on the close races, but me thinks there are many more close races than the others. Good luck to all no matter what clocking system you choose to use. Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Bruno with all due respect the Putting the rubber is only part of the equation. It is and will be like I said, the ET brigade will jealously guard and fight for every ounce of 'One Upmanship'. Never yet seen one even say they would be prepared to give ANY time whatsoever. And then they would have to be true to their word. But now it is in they won't no more give a manual clocker a second than fly in the air. Golly hat is the real so reason for wanting a ET! Not for training etc. because all them scenario's were taken care of when they were introduced and bought by many! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Was hearing that the Fed was not interested in having a master! Likewise most in my clubs! Maybe it will be, for a year or two, that they will be used as they were before this was passed, own interests. When clubs - and Feds - have to have Social events and Fund raisers to survive, and still lose money, I believe it will be hard to tell those that can't, or won't afford it, to cough up and pay for those that can! Maybe the ET brigade will pay for Masters etc. and the Feds etc. and form own clubs to fly them. I guess more, but the general consensus here is that we will lose 25% of our flyers. A high price indeed if that turns out to be the case! Everyone leaving puts more burdens on those left to pay more, which in turn means more leave which means in turn more expense... How will the circle be broken? Corporate races only with a satellite of flyers that run the One loft corporate concerns ... or no poultry keepers waiting for birds at all in 10 years or so! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 25% of flyers lost is a big hit but how much will it be offset by people coming back to the sport.Also are these people going to leave because of ETS or are they just looking for an exscuse to leave the sport anyway.Now dont take this the wrong way but the majority of fanciers i have met just want something to moan about and its my belief that if ets comes in these people who are going to leave the sport will stay in the sport and find something else to moan about.It is also a good exscuse for other people to moan why they arnt winning eg:"Well how can i compete with that guy he has an ets" when in reality the same guy has been getting beat by the ets flyer for the last ten years. I can agree with the argument over the sprint racing when timing in is everything between a card place maybe they should limit one bird per second for race's below a cetain distance.Anyway just my two penneth worth it will not effect me much either way as i will still be near the bottom of the race sheet for a season or two yet till i start to get to grip with the basics of pigeon racing.Still its more about seeing the birds come home for me .A card would just be an added bonus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 Ronnie, Ronnie, that old hot potatoe doesn't wash. MOST flyers left today are old grain anyway.Ben used detrimentally far too often. 'Well if they were going to leave any way.... just using that as an excuse'! Come on, why should any one leaving want to say that, better still wait till ET comes in. What has the % that has left prior used, certainly isn't that it WAS because the ET was coming in. Further as for enticing ne members, especially the younger ones, you will find that the cost of ET's will be a deriding factor. Sure they will be able to buy cheaper Manual clocker, so that might be a benefit. Now how about if most clubs don't have a disabled flyer, we don't, and the fed has only one, whoo is anti ET any way. Clubs won't vote him in will they! Feds won't want to know! So the act of ET could well be in it's self a cause NOW of discrimating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slugmonkey Posted February 28, 2007 Report Share Posted February 28, 2007 I have contacted a member about a program to use with ETs if anyone else is interested I will share same info please pm me if you need this info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slugmonkey Posted March 1, 2007 Report Share Posted March 1, 2007 My contact says there is a way to use winspeed there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 1, 2007 Report Share Posted March 1, 2007 ETS some say it will kill the sport because people will leave,now as iv not been in the sport long i didnt see previous changes,so i was thinking is ETS an unfair advantage,well what about when the T3 came out was it not faster than other clocks also what about stall traps these are also an advantage so there will never be a level playing field.Now as for killing the sport i do believe people will leave the sport but not directly because of ETS,although thier leaving will be because of SOME! ETS users. This sport has SOME selfish,narrow minded people within it. Who do i think i am you might say well im no expert far from it but i am one of the little guys & a novice why do i think these people will kill the sport well il give you an example, a local club has just lost (packed in) 2 old fanciers when i spoke to them they both gave similar reasons. This club gives prize cards for the first ten positions yet niether of these guys had taken a card in over 2 years although being 3rd 4th person to time on numerous occasions there were 7 members in this club 2 of which take the first 15-20 positions every week 30-40 widowhood cock sent each every week so the old guys say why spend time & money sending birds when i can fly them for free round home.so these mob clockers will be the ones that will kill the sport and will end up having thier own one loft race each week .We shouldnt take any credit away from these guys that are always first,bit when they say at the club in front of everyone "i only keep first 3 cards the rest i bin" so why clock so many, one last point the 2 old guys were prob the hardest working mbrs at the club whereas the 2 mob clockers will suffer from RSI from lifting pints at the bar while telling all who would listen how many positions they have taken. So i believe that if ETS is to be used the club should set a limit to the amount of birds clocked, to be set at club level this post is not aimed at anybody inparticular & is not meant to offend anybody but if it does TUFF i dont careLOL (only joking) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slugmonkey Posted March 1, 2007 Report Share Posted March 1, 2007 Poppy cock I am so tired of hearing all of this whining about how ets is ruining the sport, slow pigeons and bad methods and the losers who use them is whats killing the sport if a guy is putting 10 - 20 birds a week in front of you YOU HAVE A PROBLEM that goes WAY beyond what type of clock you are using Pigeon racing is NOT the SPECIAL OLYMPICS just because you try hard and are a good boy dosent mean you will be successful at it If I win the race I want to know I deserve it not that someone felt sorry for me and let me win or that I got positions because someone quit clocking after 3 birds If a guy is sending 3 birds and he clocks all 3 before I clock my first HE HAS KICKED MY ASS and no matter how i spin it I am still a loser keep feeding barley and breeding inferior pigeons and see what happens ??? guys like me that spend 50 dollars a week extra on shipping get tired of listening to this crap and we start flying only futurity races and the club goes tits up because there is no money in the coffers, I won when we were shipping 10 birds and I am winning with 50 birds and have listened to the same sorry excuses since this sport began, please get out and make room for real competitors !!!!! as I personally am tired of listening to it ETS is here to stay end of story !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 1, 2007 Report Share Posted March 1, 2007 Slugmonkey i feel that you miss read or miss iterpretated my post i was not whining about ETS i was pointing out that i feel it is peoples attitudes that will kill the sport also why were people not moaning about T3 users or stall trap users or were they at the time they were first introduced? Considering i work annualised hours including weekends hols & evenings 10-12 hr shifts i have no one to clock in for me so i dont clock in when im at work as my children will watch them come home but wont touch them so i would more than welcome ETS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slugmonkey Posted March 1, 2007 Report Share Posted March 1, 2007 I understood it and this was not directed at your post Every year we have the same debate on here and it always boils down to the same statements about cost and not being fair ect .... It is all a load of crap and those that belive it, are as they have been described just looking for excuses but unlike previous years I think a few like myself are just tired of the whining Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 3, 2007 Report Share Posted March 3, 2007 Bricon ETS advert on page 33 of BHW March 2nd 2007: 'simple to operate with free PC software and updates; data can be sent to to a PC for processing in a results programme; full compatibility with all other ETS systems; free system available to clubs (subject to terms & conditions).' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ticeye Posted March 4, 2007 Report Share Posted March 4, 2007 Bricon ETS advert on page 33 of BHW March 2nd 2007: 'simple to operate with free PC software and updates; data can be sent to to a PC for processing in a results programme; full compatibility with all other ETS systems; free system available to clubs (subject to terms & conditions).' free club system when 5 or more members buy the ets package Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 I understood it and this was not directed at your post Every year we have the same debate on here and it always boils down to the same statements about cost and not being fair ect .... It is all a load of crap and those that belive it, are as they have been described just looking for excuses but unlike previous years I think a few like myself are just tired of the whining Why should you be crass and slant others views and fears- real or not - as whinging. Same ol story from hem 'Able' every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest slugmonkey Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 If you dont belive this post go back and look at ALL the past posts and tell me that ANY of the arguments are different! These protests dont hold water it is simply fear of change that has got some buffaloed into thinking there is a problem Here in the U.S. those of us that first got the system listened to the whining but little has changed except some flyers are able to spend more time with family and others have come back because they are able to clock without being there I think just the oppisite is true I know of NO ONE who has left the sport but several that have came back because of ETS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 Sure and are you going to give some one a month to 5 weeks wages + band money to set it up!, and extra money for Club / Fed to get the Masters etc.? Are your lofts left unsecure at night! How will you guarantee that the ET will be there ANY morning let alne Saturday for Racing. I believe them to be real concerns and fears. a vast amount here are on US$10 per hour less Stoppages. So tha equates to $300 a week, and set up cost of $1500... yeah many are peeved. And many more with the bull dozing through the back door a DDA ruling that doesn't equate to Poultry, and this nor any other goermen has, or will allow us to be anything else, but classed as Poultry keepers, so how can one discriminate in a Sport that is not recognised. Fortunately it seems most clubs / members / will stay the same. And the only discrimanting will be when no one will vote in a person disabled! Most can't afford it, which means more will leave which means more expence between fewer which means more expence... no what part can't you understand? Not relate too for that too far above any one wanting an ET. So they can have one for training purposes etc. So just why do those that can afford one want one! To steal a march on those that can't, pure and simple. Yes less than 1% would like one because of work comitments, but for over a 100 years now we have manage without.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 Sure and are you going to give some one a month to 5 weeks wages + band money to set it up!, and extra money for Club / Fed to get the Masters etc.? Are your lofts left unsecure at night! How will you guarantee that the ET will be there ANY morning let alne Saturday for Racing. I believe them to be real concerns and fears. a vast amount here are on US$10 per hour less Stoppages. So tha equates to $300 a week, and set up cost of $1500... yeah many are peeved. And many more with the bull dozing through the back door a DDA ruling that doesn't equate to Poultry, and this nor any other goermen has, or will allow us to be anything else, but classed as Poultry keepers, so how can one discriminate in a Sport that is not recognised. Fortunately it seems most clubs / members / will stay the same. And the only discrimanting will be when no one will vote in a person disabled! Most can't afford it, which means more will leave which means more expence between fewer which means more expence... no what part can't you understand? Not relate too for that too far above any one wanting an ET. So they can have one for training purposes etc. So just why do those that can afford one want one! To steal a march on those that can't, pure and simple. Yes less than 1% would like one because of work comitments, but for over a 100 years now we have manage without.... AYE AND THEY USED TO RUN ROUND TO A WEE WOODEN BOX BEFORE WHERE THE FASTEST RUNNER WON THE RACE WHEN HE GOT A RUBBER IN FIRST, MOVE WITH THE TIMES ROLAND Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 Cheated they BORROWED the butcher lad’s bike.... no money, no buy! Ask the wife whether she minds missing the Odd mortgage payment to help pay for the ole mans hobby! Doesn't matter a jot how you cut it up, decorate it all you like. Facts are it is purely an 'Able' person’s way of stealing an even bigger march on the Have Nots’. Then the is Training expenses, etc. etc. and this young lass that THAT has 2/3 young kids, struggles to fork out everything she has, which is far short of what it should be, has to keep telling her beloved children's interests are more important that his fly a flipping pigeon. Not worth the agro eh! Now really just what is so hard for people to understand that! Nothing, Nothing at all... just that they don't wish to service their' own selfish whims. Just how does losing members, making the so called sport dear, causing a rife. An even bigger gulf between the ‘Better Offs’ creaming even more OFF the plebe makes this better sport and BRINGS one into the 21st Centaury. How does that simplistic fact make it better for everyone! How can losing members and making a large percentage unhappy to please a few mean it's PROGRESS! I see everyday, like most of you, the cost of Progress! And the cost is often is, has been a far far too high to pay... but then that doesn't matter I suppose as it's just the Plebes paying the bill again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert.sutherland Posted March 5, 2007 Report Share Posted March 5, 2007 ROLAND HERE HERE WELL SAID yours in sport BOB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chatrace Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 We have people in our club and combine that still use the old wooden windup Benzings and win against those of us with ETS. Now how can that be fair,they should have to not water there birds so they will have to stop for water and give me a chance 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 We have people in our club and combine that still use the old wooden windup Benzings and win against those of us with ETS. Now how can that be fair,they should have to not water there birds so they will have to stop for water and give me a chance 8) Because you don't have 10 -40 lofts on your door step! As simple as that. If say just 6 birds hit the lofts same time, all else being equal, but two have ET's and the other a manual, the Manual won't be in the first 4 Simple that. How far can a bird travell in 15 sconds,- forge the 2 seconds going into the trap. Of course you will say it depends on Wind strength and direction ... exactly too, but in any case DISTANCE(S) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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