chubs Posted February 14, 2008 Report Posted February 14, 2008 Hello, As a very green brand new to the racing 'scene' lad i find eyesign very hard to believe, i'm very sceptical, Is there any proven scientific fact that this works? has a pigeon with what looks like bad eyes turned out to be a winner & vice versa has a pigeon with good eyesign turned out to be a dudd?
ohiogsp Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 Hello, Is there any proven scientific fact that this works? has a pigeon with what looks like bad eyes turned out to be a winner & vice versa has a pigeon with good eyesign turned out to be a dudd? No Yes Yes Alot of good birds have good eye sign. I would not take 2 birds that had great eyes that had no racing history and call them my best birds. It is just one aspect of the bird.
Guest shadow Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 some people believe in it I personally don't as I have had pigeons with all kinds of eyes win
Guest cloudview Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 ask your self one question,. why are,nt the eyesign experts winning all the nationals etc etc .
madmaxlofts Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 a bloke in our club has won the humberside eyesign 3 years running and took three cards in the last three years go figger
PIGEON_MAN Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 Hello, As a very green brand new to the racing 'scene' lad i find eyesign very hard to believe, i'm very sceptical, Is there any proven scientific fact that this works? How about choosing a pigeon out of a sale of about 80 birds with no details of the bird on the cage at all (the owner had passed away and the birds were all for sale)I chose the bird on his eye alone paired it by the eye to a hen that had done nothing racing,the first nest the young hen had 2 firsts and 6th fed the young cock had a 2nd.Perhaps you would call it luck, but I know that eyesign works for me.
Ronnie Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 Hello, As a very green brand new to the racing 'scene' lad i find eyesign very hard to believe, i'm very sceptical, Is there any proven scientific fact that this works? How about choosing a pigeon out of a sale of about 80 birds with no details of the bird on the cage at all (the owner had passed away and the birds were all for sale)I chose the bird on his eye alone paired it by the eye to a hen that had done nothing racing,the first nest the young hen had 2 firsts and 6th fed the young cock had a 2nd.Perhaps you would call it luck, but I know that eyesign works for me. How did the birds do as old birds?
carlsberg Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 more than likely better than a bird with a PEDIGREE as long as your arm
carlsberg Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 i would rather buy a pigeon with a good eye rather than a pigeon with a good pedigree because the eye is real and the pedigree is just a piece of paper
PIGEON_MAN Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 How did the birds do as old birds? The hen as not raced since because I fly widowhood,the cock is still winning positons.
PIGEON_MAN Posted February 15, 2008 Report Posted February 15, 2008 i would rather buy a pigeon with a good eye rather than a pigeon with a good pedigree because the eye is real and the pedigree is just a piece of paper Exactly the way I have chosen my stock for many years now and I have be right (or lucky) with nearly everyone.
batusai Posted February 16, 2008 Report Posted February 16, 2008 I just wanted to share with you an Article that I have read...said article is written by a fancier from elite club Philippine Homing Association here in the Philippines.... Mr. Ben Chua " I have never encountered any scientific explanation of eyesign. To me, the eyes may look good if it has all the rings present as the expert would put it. But it should not be the basis for selecting a bird whether for breeding or for racing. If you will be misguided by eyesigns, you might only lose the years trying to breed the perfect eye and still have no results. The best is to breed birds and race them. Then take a look at the eye of your winners. And try to read some eyesign theories. Make your own hypothesis and later you may or may not find out the real answer. But just to read and base your breeding by eyesign, is nonsense. All it takes to breed a winner is not the eyes but the performance of good birds which will give you a better chance of producing a good racer. Basing it on eyesign is not only too complicated but in the real sense BASELESS. > > Another thought on eyesign. > Eyesign was conceptualized in the early years of pigeon racing by some merchants to put more value to the birds they are selling. It made them sell birds at a higher price. It has never been dealt with by science nor has it been proven by any scientific explanation about the effects of eyesign in the racing pigeon's performance. The only scientific study conducted was that of the signs of health in a pigeon. The eyes are glittering and the pigmentation is really very pronounced, when the pigeon is in tip top condition. It is a visible sign that the pigeon has enough vitality and ready to be raced or bred. > > With this article contribution of mine, I am not discouraging you to believe in eyesign. I am just cautioning you that EYESIGN is just a THEORY. And to delve into it too much might not be in essense a good premise to start your pigeon racing career. We as fanciers must concentrate more on the proper conditioning and breeding of our pigeons, and to develop some knowledge and skills in selection rather than concentrate on the EYESIGN of a pigeon. NEVER select a pigeon base on EYESIGN. To you I ask this question --- WILL YOU CULL A PROVEN BIRD WITH A BAD EYESIGN??? Definitely, NOT in a million years! > > To grade a pigeon base on eyesign is not only time consuming but also baseless. Eyesigns for me are only for merchants and for people who believe in eyesigns. Never have I heard a story that a Barcelona Champion was bred because it's parents have great eyesign. It is usually that the parents are themselves coming from a good origin of long distance birds. > > Hope this will open your mind in the THEORY... and I repeat.. THE "THEORY" OF EYESIGN, IT'S DEFINITELY NOT A FACT. BELIEVE IT OR NOT. IT'S UP TO YOU. thanks, batusai! PHILIPPINES
Taylorsloft Posted February 16, 2008 Report Posted February 16, 2008 u can have the best eyes in the world. but if u cant fly a kite on a windy day they wont do you any good
PIGEON_MAN Posted February 16, 2008 Report Posted February 16, 2008 u can have the best eyes in the world. but if u cant fly a kite on a windy day they wont do you any good You are certainly correct there mate,no person who practises eyesign would disagree I,m sure.
Guest cloudview Posted February 16, 2008 Report Posted February 16, 2008 im not an eyesign fanatic , i do like to see eyes with plenty of colouration. years ago i used t o race the sion pigeons after them i had ko nipius and dordins . my point being these families were known for there good eyesign but the percentage of good racers , breeders among was no different from any other strain of bird
Guest Posted February 16, 2008 Report Posted February 16, 2008 ask your self one question,. why are,nt the eyesign experts winning all the nationals etc etc . Probably the same reason all the race horse "experts" aren't winning all their races[alot of similar theories in the equine world]
Lennut Tar Posted February 17, 2008 Report Posted February 17, 2008 I just wanted to share with you an Article that I have read...said article is written by a fancier from elite club Philippine Homing Association here in the Philippines.... Mr. Ben Chua " I have never encountered any scientific explanation of eyesign. To me, the eyes may look good if it has all the rings present as the expert would put it. But it should not be the basis for selecting a bird whether for breeding or for racing. If you will be misguided by eyesigns, you might only lose the years trying to breed the perfect eye and still have no results. The best is to breed birds and race them. Then take a look at the eye of your winners. And try to read some eyesign theories. Make your own hypothesis and later you may or may not find out the real answer. But just to read and base your breeding by eyesign, is nonsense. All it takes to breed a winner is not the eyes but the performance of good birds which will give you a better chance of producing a good racer. Basing it on eyesign is not only too complicated but in the real sense BASELESS. > > Another thought on eyesign. > Eyesign was conceptualized in the early years of pigeon racing by some merchants to put more value to the birds they are selling. It made them sell birds at a higher price. It has never been dealt with by science nor has it been proven by any scientific explanation about the effects of eyesign in the racing pigeon's performance. The only scientific study conducted was that of the signs of health in a pigeon. The eyes are glittering and the pigmentation is really very pronounced, when the pigeon is in tip top condition. It is a visible sign that the pigeon has enough vitality and ready to be raced or bred. > > With this article contribution of mine, I am not discouraging you to believe in eyesign. I am just cautioning you that EYESIGN is just a THEORY. And to delve into it too much might not be in essense a good premise to start your pigeon racing career. We as fanciers must concentrate more on the proper conditioning and breeding of our pigeons, and to develop some knowledge and skills in selection rather than concentrate on the EYESIGN of a pigeon. NEVER select a pigeon base on EYESIGN. To you I ask this question --- WILL YOU CULL A PROVEN BIRD WITH A BAD EYESIGN??? Definitely, NOT in a million years! > > To grade a pigeon base on eyesign is not only time consuming but also baseless. Eyesigns for me are only for merchants and for people who believe in eyesigns. Never have I heard a story that a Barcelona Champion was bred because it's parents have great eyesign. It is usually that the parents are themselves coming from a good origin of long distance birds. > > Hope this will open your mind in the THEORY... and I repeat.. THE "THEORY" OF EYESIGN, IT'S DEFINITELY NOT A FACT. BELIEVE IT OR NOT. IT'S UP TO YOU. thanks, batusai! PHILIPPINES "Well done Batusai" ;) ;D ;D ;D a very good post here, one could say in my view & the way I like to look at this subject etc, with an open mind so to speak. "Of cause" We do have our resident (By invitation) "Eye Sign Guru" :D here :P & I note ?????? he hasn't as yet come here, to give us all his wisdom etc ;D ;D ;D. Still time will tell, what may happen. Enjoy
Jack Barkel Posted February 17, 2008 Report Posted February 17, 2008 "Well done Batusai" a very good post here, one could say in my view & the way I like to look at this subject etc, with an open mind so to speak. "Of cause" We do have our resident (By invitation) "Eye Sign Guru" here & I note ?????? he hasn't as yet come here, to give us all his wisdom etc . Still time will tell, what may happen. Enjoy Mr Tar, I also agree, Batusai has a very good post here for those against eye sign theory. Unfortunately we cannot say the same for you, who continues to have plenty of empty posts that are of value to know one. I have nothing to say in reply to Batusai, for I have no desire to attempt to change anyone's opinion, and I cannot agree with all he says. What I do say to you Lennut Tar, is please cease your jibes and veiled attacks at me. I have had enough of your childish and often silly remarks. We all have a right to our own opinions, but not to personally attack those who have written books and produced Videos and DVD's on a subject you do not agree with. If you wish to attack the subject this is fine by me, but if you attack me in this cowardly manner from a computer keyboard I will not ignore your low life attitude. You may have many posts, but they are of little or no value to anyone but yourself. What a pity you can not see that you portray yourself as an empty Yob of the lowest order. I intend requesting that you are moderated, as in my opinion, you are bringing down the standard of Pigeon Basics. I cannot see why you let my presence eat holes in you the way you do. Forget I exist man, and you will remain more healthy I will not carry on this senseless conversation any further. Once again I request:- LEAVE ME OUT OF YOUR WORTHLESS COMMENTS. Good Day to you. Jack Barkel jackbarkel@mweb.co.za http://mysite.mweb.co.za/residents/jackbarkel/
Roland Posted February 17, 2008 Report Posted February 17, 2008 Personally I don't see why a post that doesn't agree, likewise a person that doesn't agree with the eyesign theory neccates that they / it is against it. There in nothing to gain - either way by aguing whether it has benefits or not... Just some it helps, and others have other ideas. I, personally, can take it or leave it, and as of yet it has no sway with my views of it one way or another. I am sure that 70% of so called non believers feel the same way. So I feel jack that you have also a complex. Further I will add that what does iritate me, and many others, is that it will spread to any and every site topic. This I feel must be kept in check... I mean why are ther three headings the same under this heading!@ :-/ :that in it's self is sad ( . Further no need. I may look in at the topics and read, like countless others, but because I don't - at present - believe in the theory, that in no way applies that I am anti, let alone against, again like countless more.
Guest Posted February 17, 2008 Report Posted February 17, 2008 "Well done Batusai" ;) ;D ;D ;D a very good post here, one could say in my view & the way I like to look at this subject etc, with an open mind so to speak. "Of cause" We do have our resident (By invitation) "Eye Sign Guru" :D here :P & I note ?????? he hasn't as yet come here, to give us all his wisdom etc ;D ;D ;D. Still time will tell, what may happen. Enjoy Batusai's quote was very interesting, and unlike some posts he comes across stating his points respectfully. Good guidance from him for people who don't know anything about the subject! I personally don't know of any Barcelona winners that were bred from pairings made by eyesign either, but does that prove that there hasn't been any? One of the greatest fanciers of all time in my opinion is the legendary Piet De Weerd. Founder of many top named lofts. Apparently he could grade pigeons whilst in the egg, don't know how but apparently he could do it. I have no reason to dispute this, the great man is by far a better pigeon man than i ever aspire to be. This man is responsible for many top lofts and National winners at distance racing, and he used eyesign! Believe, or don't believe, enjoy or don't enjoy, IT'S YOUR CHOICE!!! Whatever path you choose to take, good luck with your pigeons and your endeavors, but leave the veiled "digs" alone, and if you choose not to believe, then at least respect the rights and opportunity of others to learn about this fascinating subject.
Roland Posted February 17, 2008 Report Posted February 17, 2008 No such word as Eyesign, or like in Belguim.... was debates, and very heated ones apparently at that in the 1920 / 30's between many of the top boys on all sides of the channel. Ad SChw says a lot on the non believing side of it and the Belguims views etc. But then what do I or he, or others know for that matter! We can only pay the money and take our choices so to speak. Often, I believe, that pigeons win / shine in spite of us. An if it works ...
Guest Silverwings Posted February 17, 2008 Report Posted February 17, 2008 dont very often see the eye sign enthusiasts on basics putting down any other of the theories that are discussed on here ? so why individuals on here that constantly put down eye theory dont give the same respect i will never understand ? after all any subject that creates an interest within our sport can only be for the good of it .......ray
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