Overfly

[Ronnie]

Anyone care to enlighten me on what it is?

i thought fastest velocity wins regardless of loft location.

I quite often hear people saying i have to give so and so 2 mins overfly.

Sorry if its a daft question but i'm still learning

[Chatrace]

it is when someone is longer in distance than another. Like 1 to 2 miles over fly of the shorter loft. You have to divide the extra distance and time, if both birds flew for a totatal of 75 min and one had to fly 3 miles longer it would win as it did the distance faster

[Tony C]

Lets say for instance you flew 72 miles from a given racepoint and a competitor flew 74 miles. You timed in 1 hr 12mins 00 secs from lib and your competitor timed in 1hr 14mins 00 secs from lib, you would both have the same velocity although he timed in 2 mins after you. that 2 mins difference is referred to as overfly.

[Ronnie]

So relatively speaking overfly is just a figure of speach as the highest velocity win's is that right.If my bird is  flying 1400 yards per minute and the guy who lives further is flying 1399 do i win or him?

[Guest]

Agree with both explanations. But overfly is a dirty word in some circles, and some fanciers complete an imaginary distance triangle which distorts everything, and then go on to quibble at the distance 'given away' to the other loft.

 

I tend to look at a race as a number of lofts competing from the same racepoint, but every loft has its very own measured racetrack from that racepoint. The loft with the highest velocity always wins the race, no matter its position.

[Ronnie]

Thanks Bruno .I listen each week to people going on how the beat such and such on the clock by seconds but the other guy lives 5 miles further as the crow fly's.

I think its the age old problem of hating to lose so look for any exscuse .

[Chatrace]

So relatively speaking overfly is just a figure of speach as the highest velocity win's is that right.If my bird is  flying 1400 yards per minute and the guy who lives further is flying 1399 do i win or him?

 

You

[Guest]

Thanks Bruno .I listen each week to people going on how the beat such and such on the clock by seconds but the other guy lives 5 miles further as the crow fly's.

I think its the age old problem of hating to lose so look for any exscuse .

 

 

That's the triangle I was talking about Ronnie. Line R-A is the racetrack to A's loft. Line R-B is the racetrack to B's loft. Might be 5 miles difference between RA and RB. But then one of these fanciers draws in another line A-B, which is maybe 2 miles 'as the crow flies'. How come he gets 5 miles off me when he's only 2 miles away?  :

[Roland]

Had a fellow that can't get in into his head that the amount of distance given alters from race point to race point. Nor can he understand that one may fly 6 miles, though only 2 miles away via road. I am 12 miles from Raunds for instance, but sometimes they fly only 2 - 3 miles further.

Best way is to get a thread / string and circle it like a compass from different points.

[Guest TAMMY_1]

Had a fellow that can't get in into his head that the amount of distance given alters from race point to race point. Nor can he understand that one may fly 6 miles, though only 2 miles away via road. I am 12 miles from Raunds for instance, but sometimes they fly only 2 - 3 miles further.

Best way is to get a thread / string and circle it like a compass from different points.

 

need some ball of string roland for that  ;D

[johno]

overfly  pigeon fancier meaning "the reason i was beaten"  reality/distance the shortest line between two points.  velocity= distance divided by time. the fastest pigeon wins.

[Tony C]

overfly  pigeon fancier meaning "the reason i was beaten".

 

;D ;D ;D

 

 

[Guest slugmonkey]

What you are missing is the percentage of time lost on overfly I consistently am flying against guys that are 20+ miles farther so on a 100 mile race they are 120+ miles so at 50 miles per hour I take 2 hours to get birds home they should get birds at 2 hours 24 minutes if it takes birds 12 minutes to orientate the percentage of my time spent orientating is 10% theirs is 8% on the same release because of the extra time because of the distance.  

here we fly in a tailwind about 80% of the time the wind here gains about 50% an hour ( 7am-10mph, 8am-15mph, 9am-22mph, ect,ect,ect ) when you couple  this with the distance advantage it makes it very hard to compete when you are short

Having said that let me also state that I win a lot of races even with this going against me I have some guys who sell birds in the club and they show performances of how they won this or that race,( this is a little message for you new guys) look at who these guys are CONSISTENTLY competing against are they REALLY on a level field ???

I Dont worry about the wind and the overfly if my birds are right I win if they arent I dont some days it is just about impossible to be in the top on those days look at the guys close to you if you are beating them then you are doing good and if you arent then all the overfly and wind aint gonna help you

Our club split over this issue and I cant really say that I miss the ones that are gone as stated earlier they were losers and used this as an excuse well in their new club someone diffrent wins every week they fly about 10-20 birds each in my club I have about 10 guys who will skin your A#@ if you aint on your A game I find no joy in beating those OTHER guys as they arent really on my level and never really were I have been at it since 03 and came out swinging I won 2 races as a rookie, this year I moved I flew all yearlings and still had a great year I won 4 or more races I didnt count because I laid off to build a team  

[johno]

slugmonkey what if the birds clear immediately? what if the weather deteriorates markedly over the last 20 miles? what if the last 20 miles is polluted by hawks? what about the days in a headwind when the wind is gaining strength the further you fly? overfly pigeon fancier meaning "the reason I was beaten"

[jimmy white]

sounds a bit harsh,,,but in nationals , the winning bird is not necessary the best :-/, you only need to look at the result to follow the birds ,,,,but up there,in the result  somewhere ,youll see the real good ones,e,g, maybe birds flying 150 mile further than the shorter flyers   and the 150 mile ,wind turning to north,[head wind] , but off course this could happen the opposite way   so if you race long enough and hard enough, youll get a day that suits you

[Ronnie]

You would think with all the technology these day's that they could work velocities  based on wind direction as well as loft location .It may create a fairer system but overall i think its about as good as it can be.From my point of view i never really took notice of overfly i look at my velocity and see if i am in the running if not no worries there's allway's next week:).

[jimmy white]

You would think with all the technology these day's that they could work velocities  based on wind direction as well as loft location .It may create a fairer system but overall i think its about as good as it can be.From my point of view i never really took notice of overfly i look at my velocity and see if i am in the running if not no worries there's allway's next week:).

 

yes i would agree with you ronnie ;D  but as you say its as good as it can be  

[Guest slugmonkey]

I agree with you there are days that favor the shorter lofts

HERE it favors the longer guy I wasnt making an excuse what I stated was a mathematical FACT not an opinion and merely a reply to a question

[Pompey Mick]

The maximum amount of 'overfly' between fanciers is the distance between the two lofts, and that only happens when both lofts are in a direct line with the racepoint. The reason that overfly can help in clubs is that the pigeons velocity is the minimum speed it has achieved, not taking into consideration time lost on lib, deviation of line and time lost on trapping. The pigeons are always flying at a faster speed than they are credited with.

Obviously as the 'overfly' distance increases a multitude of other factors come into play, some favourable, some not.

[doos r us]

an ex -my mesurement from gretna for a club race is 89 miles so you might expect 89 mile overfly say from the national alencon against a loft in gretna sadly i get 60 miles its all down to the racepoint location in or case how far east or west

[Guest]

an ex -my mesurement from gretna for a club race is 89 miles so you might expect 89 mile overfly say from the national alencon against a loft in gretna sadly i get 60 miles its all down to the racepoint location in or case how far east or west

 

That's 'the reverse case argument' of my previous post on the triange - I 'only' get [say] 60 miles, yet I'm 89 miles from there.

 

Well known scribe said something similar a couple of years back when race points moved further east , so-and-so lost 30 miles overfly in the deal.  ;D  

[Roland]

sounds a bit harsh,,,but in nationals , the winning bird is not necessary the best :-/, you only need to look at the result to follow the birds ,,,,but up there,in the result  somewhere ,youll see the real good ones,e,g, maybe birds flying 150 mile further than the shorter flyers   and the 150 mile ,wind turning to north,[head wind] , but off course this could happen the opposite way   so if you race long enough and hard enough, youll get a day that suits you

 

Yes Jimmy and that is part and partial of the game, a fact everyone does, or should know, and one that is generally accepted.

What peeves many of  is the silly denials by many when they are in thaeir favoured positions. I bet most know of many that have bought, or moved to a more favourable position. Seldom seen many that move to the Western side. One house hold name did... but he quickly packed up racing and concentrated on selling his birds. Like he says 'If I am to sell birds, they must be doing the bizz ... and when I moved i knew it would be very unlikely I'd win much, if at all in this western side'. Honest enuf eh!

[jimmy white]

yes roland if you are in an ideal loft position and a very good flier,, this can be done to sell birds ,so many firsts, duplications  etc ,it looks good on paper  when in fact if you look at the results properly youll soon see the best fliers [and their birds have to be cheaper :-/]

[doos r us]

 

Yes Jimmy and that is part and partial of the game, a fact everyone does, or should know, and one that is generally accepted.

What peeves many of  is the silly denials by many when they are in thaeir favoured positions. I bet most know of many that have bought, or moved to a more favourable position. Seldom seen many that move to the Western side. One house hold name did... but he quickly packed up racing and concentrated on selling his birds. Like he says 'If I am to sell birds, they must be doing the bizz ... and when I moved i knew it would be very unlikely I'd win much, if at all in this western side'. Honest enuf eh!

 

very true roland i fly to the west coast with very limited success this year we were invited to join a new nth rd club most of the guys said it will never work then you explain 1st drop shortest flying a compleat opposite of the sth rd 10 joined and a big success 3 races were up there and winning every week a big lift for me instead of the long waits of the sth rd you have to take advatage of whats on offer

[Roland]

Yes doos r us, and it is nice to have some Jam on the toast when you do yourselve proud every so often.

Good luck to you and every sucess.... after all we compete with the other boot every week nigh!your