Which is the best Long Distance racing?

[jimmy_bulger]

hi wiley.

i always thoght the marcellis was sion  X  jannssen.

i must been reading the wrong reports.

jimmy.

[Wiley]

Hi Jimmy i maybe wrong,but i know that when i looked further back in a marcellis pedigree at blackpool it had Hubens right back in the pedigree ,and a guy there only had marcellis pigeons and he was speaking about them!But thanks jimmy u maybe correct,i can only type what i have seen or heard,but ill ave to do some more diving into the strain to find out some more info if i find anything ill send it to ya mate,But i know for certain my wringer cock direct son of the wringer that if you go back 3 generations there is houbens in the blood,and that goes back to 82.However in the pedigree of a blue cock on here its down as a marcellis,and the info says it has all the best janseen bloodlines and is a pigeon albert brang in,So the post above i must have done a mistake!So as far as i know jimmy they are houbens and janseens but you maybe right mate

[Roland]

 

Bob Flemming once stated that true long lasting great families of pigeons must be built around winning pigeons from 600, 700 and 800 miles. I have been giving this a great deal of thought, and I think I agree with him. This of course does not mean that all pigeons in your loft must fly these distances or that pigeons that win at 200-450 miles and get lost at 500-700 miles cannot be great pigeons, just not the right type to build an entire family around. Since it is impractical and in all likelihood foolhardy to ship all our good combine winning pigeons to these extreme distances, the question becomes, how do we identify these great performers at 600-800 miles without throwing the baby out with the bath water. I think the key may be a specialty long distance club where the members would keep a separate group of birds with the sole purpose in mind of testing them at the extreme distances on a regular basis to try and identify those few key foundation breeders. Anyone have any thoughts on this idea? The need to test them is still a problem but, I think if all participants in any 500+ race were made to show proof that the bird had already flown 500 miles in the past, much of the business of using these races to sort out the left over’s from the race season would disappear. I often believe when I see how the greats blended the 'Families' and just how much distance birds are incorporated, that it has been widely acknowledge that these birds are mainly the very essence of any improvement in pigeon terms. I guess what I'm saying is. Retain the breeders and fly the others to the max.

You can't build a family on birds which have only shown an ability to fly the short distance races. ALL of the original old families on which this sport was created, were formed around long distance birds.

Therefore it stands to reason that these birds which can only fly competitively from 350 to 400 miles are lacking the original long distance qualities, or not allowed to show the merit that their’ predecessors possessed. The ability to fly the ultimate longer distances. 6 to 800 Miles. Even 1000! Because this is advice has been proven correct many, many times, the 500's are nearly a sprint.

Any and all owners who wish to build their’ own winning family, owe it to themselves to study, learn and record the features and all the other characteristics of the birds and they're eyes. Especially those of any FOUNDATION BIRDS and, watch for them re-appearing in the offspring of the breeders.

I am not an authority on Jim Biss or his doings. I am a fan of his and Pierre Dordin but, I know that he was regarded as an excellent stock man with an uncanny ability to select what he needs. Yet his Natrix etc. won at the sprints and the distance in the same season

On the other had I found this string in some archives, which I felt is well worth a read, some excerpts from a book written by Jerome J. Platt, a retired pigeoneer of the US military and published in the July 15th R.P. Digest. --- ‘The military certainly has no interest in long distance homing. Their purpose is to get messages from the front or just behind enemy lines to mobile lofts just a few miles away. Certainly rarely if ever over 100 miles! This is what caught my eye.

"Another important event in the company's history was the birth of our first pigeon. A silver cock and a blue hen donated to the army by Roland D. Birch of Salem, OR hatched a healthy baby. These birds were of a breeding line developed in Oregon and called "Old Line" strain. Later we discovered the "Old Line" strain of birds could out fly most any of the strains developed in other parts of the country. It was the result of "survival of the fittest" in Oregon's perpetual rain and fog along the coast.

Mr. Ralph E. Warren of Portland Ore is credited with the origin of the "Old Line" strain of homing pigeons. He started with two pairs of birds in 1908 and carefully selected his breeders for succeeding generations from birds THAT HAD FLOWN FROM 500 MILES AT LEAST TWICE. As recently as 1971, I talked with Ed Johnson, a buddy from the 281st Signal Pigeon Company days, and he told me the "old Line" strain was still winning races in the Portland club."

So the military were interested in "sprint" flights only, found their best birds came from a family with a mandatory performance testing standard of a minimum of two 500 mile races in the mountains of the west coast of North America’. -

[Guest]

Wiley,

 

I think from what I have read in the past Albert Marcellis started his family with birds related to the ones staf van reet started his with?? Very similar bred families from what I am led to believe.

[Wiley]

could be true darran,im not sure what stef van reet started off with mate,i have an original albert marcellis cock her direct of his wringer pigeon and on the pedigree all i see is houbens and janseens right back in the pedigree,not sure what stef van reets base birds was any idea?

[Guest]

I know for definate staf introduced the odd soontjen which is janssen into his family.

[Wiley]

rose's last post is correct fanciers jus create a gene pool of good birds thats how strains came about no family is pure

[Roland]

Bussechearst started with Delbars just after the war... But the origin of the Delbars is sceptical really!

[jimmy_bulger]

think the pictorial done a 3 page spread a couple of years ago on marcellis and shown the pics of his base pair1 red 1 mealy 1 sion 1 jannssen.

would be interesting if any of the giys have still got that issue cos they looked the real deal.

jimmy

[Wiley]

will be interesting to find out where and how the houbens started now possibly through the sions,

[Wiley]

thanks rose

[Wiley]

the houbens are long distance birds,now it doesnt suprise me the marcellis can come out of all distances

[Guest CS]

Barkers...

 

do anyone knows who got Pure Barkers?

[jimmy_bulger]

hi craig.try rose

[Mike Lycett]

L Tuplin & Son

 

See any Squills

[Roland]

I believe no pigeon ever produced anything any good until crossed.

And I also agree 100% with Rose ... Lookat the day and the velocities to see if they merit their perch'. unquote: I personally believe 500 + milers are two a penny and it has to be an inferior bird that can't do it.

Never had any birds EVER that haven't done or produced birds that fly 550 miles, on the day, depending... had only day birds in club this season, yes must have been stiffish races... But none will rear their own young this coming season, because though many flew 3 x 500 + milers in 4 weeks, and after a 400 nigh, others birds beat them! So their’ constitution and health is fine obviously... they just aren't going to set a trail ablaze... or even a foot path.

The main difference from sprinters to middle distance and real distance is sending them! Fit healthy and prepared for the distance it will entail. Different strokes for different courses obviously play a part… FULL STOP!

[mark]

surely its horses for coarses not all birds can fly 500miles plus like linford christe was a good 100m runner but bet he couldnt run a marathon,

[ribble]

d j harrison and son (brian) southport,race barker's if you look on the nfc site at section L results from the longest race he has excellent results as good as anyones i'd say.

[swilcox]

Sid and Val Miles, Peasdown St John Nr Bath, they have one of the best families of long distance birds to found in the world!!!!

[jimmy white]

surely its horses for coarses not all birds can fly 500miles plus like linford christe was a good 100m runner but bet he couldnt run a marathon,

 

i agree ith this post, linford christie found out the distance that suited him, then set himself up for it , same as any marathon man , found out his distance and set himself up for that,,,   i think it goes the same for the pigeons

[Guest CS]

Raymond Moleveld Top Jan Aarden Breeder De Lightenberg

 

What a nice pigeon, Stuart

[Guest youngzimmy]

[face=Verdana][/face]GURNAYS YOU SOFT LOT

[tony99]

jock reed

[jimmy white]

stenhousemuir ,, one if the greats  

[Fair Play]

A lot of the long distance birds in Scotland had McAlpine blood in them In fact it might be true to say that in D.Forsyth's loft they were all McAlpines but in the end it all boils down to preference as I don't think that there are many "pure" strains left most will have had crosses introduced to give a boost.You take your pick now go ahead and perfect them as we all want to go one better.