Guest Posted July 12, 2009 Report Posted July 12, 2009 I Hope so ,stuarty boy so do i harry yes thats the one stuart shes in stonking order but still need the wee man on your shoulder
mark Posted July 12, 2009 Report Posted July 12, 2009 At what distance mate,for me a national win has to be from at least 450 miles and beyond to have real creditability. to win a national at any distance is some achievement considering you are flying against top fanciers from all over the UK.
frank-123 Posted July 12, 2009 Report Posted July 12, 2009 just the one bred/raced by myself 590 miles 1121 ypm velocity sire bred by j& i alston ravenstruther off his bird called (the stirling cock when paired to a dtr of f.souness dunbar 2nd open winner) dam bred by myself off n.black & son of dromore birds the g/dam of my nat winner is a direct dtr of blacks famous (99) hen ,which is dam of his 1st open kings cup ,she is dam and g/dam of loads of other top national ticket winners inc 2nd open , 4th open ,6th open 7th open 2 x 8th open winners read the burnbank club page jimmy and davie stirling giving the birds up now who bred the stirling cock??? they may be selling the birds very soon
Guest Posted July 12, 2009 Report Posted July 12, 2009 Frank Souness Sorry Jim Stirling Burnbank. :B :B :B :B :B
Guest strapper Posted July 12, 2009 Report Posted July 12, 2009 i got none in my loft either....i dont want that national riff raff in my loft 8) 8) 8) ;D ;D ;D why dont we change the title..to who has national winners in their lofts and are winning good with their young?
Guest IB Posted July 12, 2009 Report Posted July 12, 2009 I don't own any National winners and if the bird is 1st Open in any National club, its a winner. I for one wouldn't detract in any way from any bird's 1st Open performance, you can only win in the race you're competing in.
redcock1 Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 I don't own any National winners and if the bird is 1st Open in any National club, its a winner. I for one wouldn't detract in any way from any bird's 1st Open performance, you can only win in the race you're competing in. how the hell can u tell me its a national win it a minority thats away next youll be telling me that the up north ncombine winner is the whole of england how can that be a national when they're english, a national to me is the whole of the country is england is a national, wales is a national, ireland, north and south and scotland, if it goes any further it will be a regional they will be winning ie semi national that they will be winning, if you want to go onto national winning it should be rpra member , national for the english national, shu for the scottish national, ihu for the irish national and whu for the welsh national.
Guest stb Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 how the hell can u tell me its a national win it a minority thats away next youll be telling me that the up north ncombine winner is the whole of england how can that be a national when they're english, a national to me is the whole of the country is england is a national, wales is a national, ireland, north and south and scotland, if it goes any further it will be a regional they will be winning ie semi national that they will be winning, if you want to go onto national winning it should be rpra member , national for the english national, shu for the scottish national, ihu for the irish national and whu for the welsh national. INFC in this race are ihu members rpra edc ,etc all different unions in one nat race.. NFC nehu nwhu rpra etc all fly in this race welsh nats whu rpra etc compete in these races. snrpc -shu rpra members compete. snfc-- shu only. all other national flying clubs in that particular country have members competing from all different unions. if it was only the members from the countries particular union that were allowed to compete then half the members in each country would be de- barred from competing in there appropriate nationals.
Guest numpty01 Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 do you live far from mike... numpty? met mike a few years ago he had one of my youngster`s in...nice bloke. yes mate he pops in couple times week as i do his place he is one of the best blokes you could meet he has had birds of me and i him we are clubmates ;D ;D ;D ;D
Guest IB Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 how the hell can u tell me its a national win it a minority thats away next youll be telling me that the up north ncombine winner is the whole of england how can that be a national when they're english, a national to me is the whole of the country is england is a national, wales is a national, ireland, north and south and scotland, if it goes any further it will be a regional they will be winning ie semi national that they will be winning, if you want to go onto national winning it should be rpra member , national for the english national, shu for the scottish national, ihu for the irish national and whu for the welsh national. You did not mention in your previous post any place other than Scotland, and whether we like it or not, two clubs now cover Scotland. They are therefore both National clubs, and if you win one, it must follow you've won a National race.
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 That is my opinion,to win any national is great but to win one from across the water is a real achievement of the highest order.For me national racing is about long distance and 250 miles is not long distance.As for the birdage you could win a race against 10000 birds in lanarkshire fed but it would never equal the credibility given to a win from over the water with a fraction of the birds competing,again my opinion. Interesting points here on the way our sport is going. Firstly I think it is ignorance to say that National racing has to be over 250 mile, like you Vincent long distance is my aim but to suggest that any races below this distance is niave, the skill involved in winning sprint races against the best in the country when you are talking about near 10,000 pigeons is far tougher I would suggest for the fancier at sprints than at long distance. As to what constitutes a National IB says as they are called National, they are National, how the hell can that be. It's a bit like the advert appearing in this weeks is it the Burton flying club, it's one in that area anyone organising a race and calling it a grand national. For me the value of 'National clubs' has been totally devalued. Each country should only have one National club how the chuff can you claim to have several Nationals. The Central Southern Classic Club got it right, they wanted to have classic races for their area (a large geographic area), they realised they were not a National but didn't call it this. But some plonkers in the MIdlands decided they could call their club a National, instead of calling it the Midland Classic Club or such like, they called it a National and then put boundaries on to restrict membership, i.e. it is not open to the Nation. Then you had petty politics people with some power/ resource deciding they weren't happy with the way the Nationals were being run in Wales and Scotland and decided to split, when what they should have been doing is working to get things change not to act like spoilt brats and throw the teddy out of the cot. Now I'm generalising and I know there may have been the situation where there was absolutley no alternative than to split. But I think there is a very important point here, we regularly see people wanting to break up the RPRA, why? It is a solid well built organisation, what’s wrong with it is that all us fanciers will not get off our *expletive removed* and go to regional meetings to get things changed, because we do have the capability to change things if we did. If we fragment now we really are doomed, it’s happening everywhere we are all splitting, fragmenting at all levels. Where have all the socialists gone, the people who will argue their corner until their blue in the face but when they lose the debate will support the winner all the way???? Is the problem now that all the money men in the sport are true blues? Oh and I still ain’t got no National winners, one day...............
dazza Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 1 and a blue hen who has raced from the channel 5 times, twice as a yearling and three times this year. As a yearling 1st Club 10th Fed 334m and then 4th Section 27th open MNFC Tours 444m. This year 62nd section 131st Open MNFC & 51st section 457th Open MNFC & 22nd section 252nd Open MNFC Tours again. A super hen 3 times her velocity has been between in the 11 and 12 hundred ypm. I rate her equally as good as the cock who won the national. Whatever the wind we have no advantage as we are quite central and one of the last drops.
Roland Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 Lot od truth there Albear. Me, I'm more intered in the 'Location' that these national winners fly to. Fine if you are say on the coast in the North East, or in Louth, Ollerton, a member of the East coast clubs, like Lowerstoft in the NRCC. Every week nigh, on basketing night, most discuss the wind / conditions forecasted for the next day etc. We then 9 times out of ten know who will be in the shake up in the Club(s). We certainly know which club or flyers that will be topping the FED. Likewise on national day ... OK the NRCC won't release if there is any east in the wind.... But they do actually, because they have to... but if strong they come back a bit at least ... Never yet seen a good flyer move to the West when moving .... unless into another fed where he will be farthest East as posiible. Love a little quiddy when 'Named' flyers have bought their location. Yes of course they have to be top of their game. Yes to beat the others in that location. But in reality the fact is, whoever wins that club usually wins the National.... And direspect to them at all. often said 'The best bird on the the day wasn't the winner' and this is vey true quite a lot of the time.
Guest Gareth Rankin Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 Interesting points here on the way our sport is going. Firstly I think it is ignorance to say that National racing has to be over 250 mile, like you Vincent long distance is my aim but to suggest that any races below this distance is niave, the skill involved in winning sprint races against the best in the country when you are talking about near 10,000 pigeons is far tougher I would suggest for the fancier at sprints than at long distance. As to what constitutes a National IB says as they are called National, they are National, how the hell can that be. It's a bit like the advert appearing in this weeks is it the Burton flying club, it's one in that area anyone organising a race and calling it a grand national. For me the value of 'National clubs' has been totally devalued. Each country should only have one National club how the chuff can you claim to have several Nationals. The Central Southern Classic Club got it right, they wanted to have classic races for their area (a large geographic area), they realised they were not a National but didn't call it this. But some plonkers in the MIdlands decided they could call their club a National, instead of calling it the Midland Classic Club or such like, they called it a National and then put boundaries on to restrict membership, i.e. it is not open to the Nation. Then you had petty politics people with some power/ resource deciding they weren't happy with the way the Nationals were being run in Wales and Scotland and decided to split, when what they should have been doing is working to get things change not to act like spoilt brats and throw the teddy out of the cot. Now I'm generalising and I know there may have been the situation where there was absolutley no alternative than to split. But I think there is a very important point here, we regularly see people wanting to break up the RPRA, why? It is a solid well built organisation, what’s wrong with it is that all us fanciers will not get off our *expletive removed* and go to regional meetings to get things changed, because we do have the capability to change things if we did. If we fragment now we really are doomed, it’s happening everywhere we are all splitting, fragmenting at all levels. Where have all the socialists gone, the people who will argue their corner until their blue in the face but when they lose the debate will support the winner all the way???? Is the problem now that all the money men in the sport are true blues? Oh and I still ain’t got no National winners, one day............... Summed up to perfection Albear. 8)
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 Lot od truth there Albear. Me, I'm more intered in the 'Location' that these national winners fly to. Fine if you are say on the coast in the North East, or in Louth, Ollerton, a member of the East coast clubs, like Lowerstoft in the NRCC. Every week nigh, on basketing night, most discuss the wind / conditions forecasted for the next day etc. We then 9 times out of ten know who will be in the shake up in the Club(s). We certainly know which club or flyers that will be topping the FED. Likewise on national day ... OK the NRCC won't release if there is any east in the wind.... But they do actually, because they have to... but if strong they come back a bit at least ... Never yet seen a good flyer move to the West when moving .... unless into another fed where he will be farthest East as posiible. Love a little quiddy when 'Named' flyers have bought their location. Yes of course they have to be top of their game. Yes to beat the others in that location. But in reality the fact is, whoever wins that club usually wins the National.... And direspect to them at all. often said 'The best bird on the the day wasn't the winner' and this is vey true quite a lot of the time. Roly do you mean I got it wrong when I decided to move down here, I'm not in a good location :'( :'( ;D
Guest numpty01 Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 the nat won over weekend by europa had 220birds in it that aint nat in my view but traing toss
paul10121968 Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 all ours are future national winners ;)
Roland Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 True Albear, but better than you were lol ;D But that covers the other reason, Family and wifes etc. Other than that.... All the good sites are been taken up by the Names lol.
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 the nat won over weekend by europa had 220birds in it that aint nat in my view but traing toss Yes dissapointing numbers Numpty............. but two things make this winner a champion. This bird flew one of the toughest routes in the world for me other than 600 mile in to Ireland and it had no drag, no help. Secondly the best pigeons are for me North roaders they can be turned south and will win, south roaders rarely turn North and win. I would be proud to own this National winner as I would the smaller Scottish National winner at 550 mile plus cause these birds are on their own no drag have to be super birds.
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 The Arras Cock. 1st WDA Arras, (now dead). De Perlina. 1st NationaL 39,000 Birds. Cheq Pied Hen. 1st National, approx. 8,000 birds (got stolen)
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 True Albear, but better than you were lol ;D But that covers the other reason, Family and wifes etc. Other than that.... All the good sites are been taken up by the Names lol. ;D ;D ;D Roly, you always bring me back to earth
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 Think the word national shouldnt be taken to seriously as there are many clubs that dont cover what the word is supposed to actually mean not sure but i think lot of these clubs already had this name before the RPRA looked into it but i dont think now if you wanted to start a club with the word national in the name you can unless it does cover everyone even had trouble when using it with out nomination club and that is open to BBC BICC and NFC and as clubs go they are about as open as you get Hi Rose, agree about the clubs you mention, but they all dilute national racing, some of these clubs are inaccessible for lots of fanciers. If we had one National controlling all the 'national' races then we would have some fantastic racing and the chance for example of winning Barcelona International. If there were marking stations in the regions it would make so much more sense than 300 +birds from the BICC and 400+ from the BBC, we might double that total.
Guest Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 Marking stations :-/ problem i heard many times with the BICC but does prove problems we dont have to prepay our entries for our birds which is a benefit for the members you dont send you dont pay but then you got the problem of not knowing how many birds you got at a marking station all well and good your transporter starting up north to find there is only a handful or no birds at all which has happened in the past also you got the time your driver is allowed to drive for unless you start looking at employing more drivers and putting up the price I think to make difference with the Barcelona International we need to more than double the birdage we need to put a 0 on the end of it they are up usually with 28,000 birds and for that particular race i think the majority of us are not having training races from the right racepoints for the way the birds come into this country Rose, yes it might be good for current members, and if it is to stay a closed shop that’s fine but for any club to carry the name British, should it be available to everyone in Britain? I read I think Clememts saying if you want to compete you'll get there no matter how far away you live. There are still many of us that do not have the resource to do this but I think those running the clubs are happy to keep the clubs as they are. After all wouldn't it make so much sense for the BBC and BICC to amalgamate? We would have one British club then. Language is a funny thing. National means one thing to me and it's not any small area calling itself National. We are in a culture today where if we don't like 'language' we say it's been misinterpreted, it's a bit like the argument over gays in the Church, the BIble is quite clear on this but there are factions that say the language wasn't meant that way when it was written, or things have changed God had softened his (its) view, it’s ok to have gays now. I’m not a believer but I did do A level Scripture and for me the writings are clear but now diluted to suit our modern culture. It’s a bit the same with pigeons, look at the savings, the better quality of transport and competition we could have if all these national clubs amalgamated in to one body and these races were administered by this body. Why does nobody ever want this. I’d be interested to know.
Guest numpty01 Posted July 13, 2009 Report Posted July 13, 2009 Yes dissapointing numbers Numpty............. but two things make this winner a champion. This bird flew one of the toughest routes in the world for me other than 600 mile in to Ireland and it had no drag, no help. Secondly the best pigeons are for me North roaders they can be turned south and will win, south roaders rarely turn North and win. I would be proud to own this National winner as I would the smaller Scottish National winner at 550 mile plus cause these birds are on their own no drag have to be super birds. has it been confirmed he won nat or is it provisional as there are others who think they are in the hunt and yes i agree good bird from bad race point the graveyard but gone are the days of thousands on the north and i cant see it ever getting back to its once glory
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