pigeonscout Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Here in the UK we hear YBS and think it is all caused by the same bacteria or virus. Nothing could be further from the truth as the young birds could be infected by a simple bacteria or a deadly virus. Some viruses have no lasting effects and others will set you back years. I do not know the seller and have no axe to grind and can see from the posted that this seller is well known and well liked but the longer this simple question (what virus?) goes unanswered the more suspicious these bargain priced young birds sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Great Michael, I'm not in the BICC! ;D ;D ;D And there nothing wrong whatsoever in being uncomfortable if my birds came into contact. Golly that is my first comittment in keeping - not only pigeons - but any animal / pet. That is my duty,mine and evryone else's first comittment. Yes we evaluate diffently, and most views, concerns differ of course. That in it's self nietjher makes one right or wrong. Just an awareness. But I can only speak as I see / or fear. Likewise many more. I was set back many seasons due to a bout of an ugly Pharahoid. Yes agreed my birds constition may not have been as good as they should have been because of lack of out crosses, and mating cousins etc. BUT since 2005 I've only had the odd swallow, and they certainly don't make a summer! Yes i stopped sending because some may have been carriers and not showing up. They infact - as some on here know - been eradicated. Sanitation has been collosal... many may think over the top. But believe you me, if Samonella, or any of it's side kicks take a hold, it will devastate you. Remember good constitution bird can look and handle superb, even win in the show pen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swilcox Posted December 2, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 I dont think the virus was every nailed down, as in most viruses they spread quick and once they moved on they are gone. The Government diagnosed the Virus as Circo Virus but i believe this is a mix of differnent viruses so i dont no what to make of that. What i do know is the Circo Virus is widley associated with YBS hence my earlier post. Due to its difficultness to identify the pigeons were not allowed out until the virus took its course. All pigeons were given a general screening every week for 60 days and once they were found to be clear and healthy the government allowed them out. Any birds found unclear in that time were removed. Whether or not any perminent damage was caused would have hopefully been highlighted by the training and race program out to 350km and such week pigeons fell by the wayside. But if you read what is being written you will see that if any of the birds contracted the virus they were removed so the chances are these birds that are left never even seen the virus. I spoke at length to Derek Nichols on this subject and he tells me illness is just part of one loft racing and that the pigeons that conqeur desease, mass tarining and the races are the strong ones and that he believe these pigeons are sound and no different to any others pigeons offered from a one loft race. I will add that the Dutch Open wrongly or rightly Choose to involve the Government as they wanted to establish the correct treatment as normal pigeon medicine didnt effect it, they have never hidden from the events that happen during the first few months. Of the 400 ybs that returned from the final race the first 200 were sold on internet, that the way the race was planned from the start. The pigeons that finish 200 to 400 were available for collection only for 3 weeks after the race. As in previous years only a handful were collected, and a small number was donated to Youth Projects, the remander were left in the loft. Most of these birds have now been snapped up in Holland and UK. I took it apon myself to offer these pigeons as i constantly here from PB members that pigeons are too expensive, i heard about them and believed that if i didnt offer them on here i wouldnt be true to my word, which is to support PB. I stand by my decision even though in hinsight i could have done with out the hassle but i believe a few pb members will recieve some high quality pigeons that have been bred by some of the best fanciers in holland for an attrative price, i havnt benifitted out of this finacially however hopefully someone will do well with these birds. This is my last post on this subject Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 I took it apon myself to offer these pigeons as i constantly here from PB members that pigeons are too expensive, i heard about them and believed that if i didnt offer them on here i wouldnt be true to my word, which is to support PB. I stand by my decision even though in hinsight i could have done with out the hassle but i believe a few pb members will recieve some high quality pigeons that have been bred by some of the best fanciers in holland for an attrative price, i havnt benifitted out of this finacially however hopefully someone will do well with these birds. This is my last post on this subject Stuart this is my first and last post on this topic You offered the birds in good faith and as you say to honour your word regarding supporting this site......... I take my hat off to you Sir ............. people have the choice, Take 'em or Leave 'em........ I wouldn't mind betting you wont make the same mistake again. Well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roland Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Stu, hopefully mine too. On here, several times, and to many others on this site, I have praised you as a better than a 'Ok' guy as a feather merchant. Yes have indeed touted - in regards of selling pigeons - Which I would never have any problem buying from you. Further that I thought, best to your ability, that you would only ever do the right thing for a buyer, and as such have never questioned your honesty. Yes indeed many on here can vouch for that. This doesn't change over night, nor by any singular fact / or piece of fiction. Hence I still believe that. I doubt we'd ever be a drinking mates, and our ways of life, and views are from apart. So I stand by this post of course. As for suing me I couldn't give a rat's *expletive removed* about that. Further this post is no way intending to have a bearing on that! One must do what they feel is right, likewise I / you live by or stand by things we have said, done, stated right or wrong. Twice now I have, sorry three times if not four I have entered into this topic. Hopefully, till I hear from the lawyers, it will be my last ... but who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fair Play Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 When is the first draft due to arrive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swilcox Posted December 2, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Roland i would never sue you old pal but some posts were removed that were just out and out personnels attacks and slander from another member. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLDYELLOW Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 well i think these birds offer value for money , and if you have the room why not i bets theres some top distance birds hid away in that lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chrisss Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Roland i would never sue you old pal but some posts were removed that were just out and out personnels attacks and slander from another member. i was wondering about the disjoined thread [i have been off the site for a while]what is the problem buy or do not buy it is not making rockets,no wonder a lot of guys refuse to sell birds on this site any more its like facing the gestapo,if there is any left after xmas give me a shout!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john@formula 1 lofts Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Brilliant value Stu well worth ago at that price see you at Doncaster mate John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fair Play Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 When is the first draft due to arrive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonscout Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 I dont think the virus was every nailed down, as in most viruses they spread quick and once they moved on they are gone. The Government diagnosed the Virus as Circo Virus but i believe this is a mix of differnent viruses so i dont no what to make of that. What i do know is the Circo Virus is widley associated with YBS hence my earlier post. A vet wrote (It’s called Circo-virus, and it attacks the pigeon’s immune system, with basically the same symptoms as AIDS. So that means that pigeons are dying of all sorts of other diseases, because of a lack of immunity. There is no cure or vaccine yet.) Hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonscout Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 I dont think the virus was every nailed down, as in most viruses they spread quick and once they moved on they are gone. The Government diagnosed the Virus as Circo Virus but i believe this is a mix of differnent viruses so i dont no what to make of that. What i do know is the Circo Virus is widley associated with YBS hence my earlier post. A vet wrote (It’s called Circo-virus, and it attacks the pigeon’s immune system, with basically the same symptoms as AIDS. So that means that pigeons are dying of all sorts of other diseases, because of a lack of immunity. There is no cure or vaccine yet.) Hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stevie-b Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 why r there so many little hitlers on here stuart wilcox from what ive read has never ever tried to mislead anyone when selling any pigeons on here a genuine guy trying to help out our fancy gets treated on here by the part time polticians that is why our great sport is in decline why dont these people join a debating club and leave genuine pigeon fanciers alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 why r there so many little hitlers on here stuart wilcox from what ive read has never ever tried to mislead anyone when selling any pigeons on here a genuine guy trying to help out our fancy gets treated on here by the part time polticians that is why our great sport is in decline why dont these people join a debating club and leave genuine pigeon fanciers alone. Spot on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fair Play Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 We on this island are very lucky with regards to viruses with the channel as the buffer.It is a credit to the fanciers on the Continent that they manage to keep flying at all with their borders all attached to each other the spread of the virus can go from place to place within days maybe even hours so to be able to combat these things they have to be on the ball and maybe that's why the Government agencies act so quickly without all the knee jerk actions - only an observation but would you allow your birds to catch pox,para,salmonella no, in most cases we vaccinate or treat and what do we say how are birds to develop an immunity if they are never exposed. Think about kids measles,chickenpox vaccinate then what do we do send them to play with the "infected" to develop an immunity. May be wrong but prove it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonscout Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 I for one only ask the question as to what had made the young birds sick as I was interested in buying some and I was told it was a young bird type virus contacted. I ask for the name of the virus and It turns out that the virus was Circo virus. This is not a young bird virus as it effects both young and old birds. I do not apologize for asking these questions as I think it is the right of every buyer. Please read up on this virus and then make you own mind up http://www.pigeoncote.com/vet/circo/circo.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 i was wondering about the disjoined thread [i have been off the site for a while]what is the problem buy or do not buy it is not making rockets,no wonder a lot of guys refuse to sell birds on this site any more its like facing the gestapo,if there is any left after xmas give me a shout!!!!! actually that's not true the site tends to get people who failed to sell on other sites or realise they are better off on this site. However if you don't want to sell don't, simple as that. As a buyer of any product anyone will ask questions before buying. I thought this had all settled down, once the facts were out. So why are people like yourself popping out of the woodwork now. Let me put it simple, I think it was a lack of judgement on Stuart's part not to explain the background to these birds. After some questioning and not before the facts came out. So don't criticise people because they were wary of birds from a loft shut down temporarily by the Dutch government because of a virus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chrisss Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 actually that's not true the site tends to get people who failed to sell on other sites or realise they are better off on this site. However if you don't want to sell don't, simple as that. As a buyer of any product anyone will ask questions before buying. I thought this had all settled down, once the facts were out. So why are people like yourself popping out of the woodwork now. Let me put it simple, I think it was a lack of judgement on Stuart's part not to explain the background to these birds. After some questioning and not before the facts came out. So don't criticise people because they were wary of birds from a loft shut down temporarily by the Dutch government because of a virus. and if you do not want to buy then do not,how has this gone [as always] from a guy selling birds to the sadly normal habit of everyone having a pop at each other again?,my views are my views ,no popping out of the woodwork needed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 and if you do not want to buy then do not,how has this gone [as always] from a guy selling birds to the sadly normal habit of everyone having a pop at each other again?,my views are my views ,no popping out of the woodwork needed Yes you're right about your views but don't blame this site when the seller cocks up by not explaining some very important background information people keep popping up criticising it when they wouldn't have the opportunity on other sites. And this is not a selling site I don't believe the webmaster set it up with the intention of being one. And I repeat my view people come to this site to sell not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shadow Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 do not let them get you down stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack walker Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 HI STUART thanks for bringing the pigeons to doncaster they were first class cheers jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted December 7, 2008 Report Share Posted December 7, 2008 HI STUART THE PIGEONS YOU BROUGHT OVER FROM THE DUTCH ONE LOFT RACE FOR ME ARE FIRST CLASS THANKS FOR BRING THEM TO DONCASTER THANKS AGAIN SIMMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swilcox Posted December 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2008 It seems everyone who had the birds so far are over the moon with them, thanks guys for your feedback and support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fair Play Posted December 12, 2008 Report Share Posted December 12, 2008 I received my two birds and they are in great condition feather and body ,clear eyes and throat, feet clean,white wattles and firm droppings I would have to operate to find anything else and that is after a fair bit of travelling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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