thanks for the replies and votes, seems im still none the wiser now, I have even considered, not loft flying them, due to hawks, there is a mid week club localish, they only go 60 miles on a wed, would this be any good, ? race sat, race wed, rest of week not much? my birds are coming well, and are really keen, just seem no urgency to trap, maybe the hawks have had that effect on them? they seem to want to fly round for a minute, then sit on trap and have a look round first, then in, and straight to there hen/box!! and im 3/4 mins behind winner first 3 races, hope tommorow they decide to trap faster, 150 miles north east wind!!! get the peanuts out tonight