Novice

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/48102030#.T_eqkfU3kqg Just another variable which could affect racing this weekend.

A big yes from me. If he is on form it will be no problem to him and he may never hit this peak again.

And I thought I had mellowed with age.

The problem being you are not our race controller.

I have no doubt that it was underhanded.

Being honest Charlie it was always going to happen with the coast lads there in mumbers to regain their double overfly. Strangely I never noticed Rikki there. Maybe he is Ayrshire's answer to Bigda.

Quality

Absolutely we need to think progressively. Protein rich feeds on the transporter are outdated. Let's give the birds the best possible chance of returning home.

Brian, I'll go with whatever the members vote for but may be inclined to choose my races. I feel that duplication races are not good for birdages and ultimately the fed balance. Shorter season capacity loaded transporter and reduced food supply to percy is what I strive for. Gareth do I detect a touch of cynicism in tour comment?

The feed the birds are given before liberation is so very important especially when they are in the basket for several days. Who the .*expletive removed* is Beattie? I think all organisations should decide what feed they will be using during transportation at the AGM. Often the good work done by a progressive fancier can be undone in the basket. We have a great deal to learn from the continentals on this front. This post is not a criticism of anyone.

While on the subject of this race I was wondering what type of feed the birds are given while in the basket. A high energy mix to supply the fuel for the return journey or a standard "best all round mix" as most federations use.

John-I am a stranger to international travel but I think the tunnel runs from dover to Calais you then have a 4 hour 15 minute drive to Carentan. Not sure if this will help for the future or eliminate the possibility all together.

Derek what I was getting at was that if we used the tunnel with the AV transporter Thursday basketing would have been time enough. No matter lets just have a decent race for a change.

come on now trot along there.

Interesting we could have basketed Thursday no problem. Let's just hope for good returns irrespective of the logistics.

I was of the opinion that Lanarkshire and Ayrshire were using the Almond Valley transporter for this race and this could have used the tunnel route meaning a day less in the basket for the birds. Can anyone confirm which transporter we are using?

Brian--- I have flown pigeons into Ayrshire since 1968. As far as I am concerned one big mistake was not discussing race programs properly at the AGM. That was because there was so much going on at that meeting with the influx of clubs. That was a mistake to bypass something as important as a race program. I am not blaming anyone but with hindsight it should have been discussed properly. My opinion for what it is worth is that the race program needs to be more flexible especially for the first few old bird races. For example decide a route at the AGM but if we think that we would achieve better returns racing from the opposite side of the country during the first 4 races then we do that. From race 4 after the birds are race fit we stick to the agreed program. On Monday night I believe we can only vote for either the status quo or the proposed amendment. For my money any program which proposes 2 Hawicks and 2 visits to Otterburn is a non starter. Ok big Harvey is a good doo man but as far as that other guy is concerned I would have my doubts. Oh by the way- does your dad still have the chequer hen rung on the left leg.

Yes Brian I live in Ayrshire and have the credentials to substantiate anything I say. I am definately not out of order. Had you competed in "Ayrshire Federation" and not Ballochmyle for more than 6 months you would understand exactly what I am talking about. I appreciate that you always introduce longer distance winning lines direct from winning fanciers but that puts you in the minority. A young bird race program which normally starts at 30 -40 miles and ends with a final race of 122 miles with a jump of 4 miles from race 7 to race 8. Is that helping improve the quality in loft? I doubt that. Some federations have their first race at the same distance as our final. Our last Federation race was cancelled because of lack of interest----we are doing something very wrong.

Malcolm Bros were canny doo men no doubt of that. Day birds from real hard nationals in this area are few and far between on the shift but I can remamber two on the shift in 1989 one in Irvine and the other in Beith timing about 22:30. Perhaps those days will return. I hope so.

It's unfair to compare the fanciers of yesterday with those of today. These were guys I respected and could not lace their boots.

I doubt if you understand the situation so would be well advised to refrain from comment.

I knew both and others like Alex Spier, Alex Nesbit and Big Johnny Barr All were good in their day and Matt only passed recently but had not flown for several years. Pigeons which would have flown through a brick wall to get home. Forgive me ranting but I am less than convinced about the change of route having sent pigeons down the west this year which have never been down there before. Maybe I am just missing having a race today.

Please correct me if I am wrong but you are blaming the route which is something you will never prove. What you and many others (quoting your words) need to do is have a look in the mirror. There has not been a decent fancier in Ayrshire since Jimmy Paterson passed on. Ayrshire fanciers are only too kean to quote geography as a reason for lack of performance and sit there in their comfort zone. The lofts are populated by sprint pigeons and many fanciers who feel their ego has been massaged if they top the fed from 38 miles. Topped the fed at 38 miles then put to stock. No wonder the young will not face a hard day.

Everyone lost more pigeons than normal this year irrespective of route or loft location. The Ayrshire losses were increased by liberating pigeon in a temperature of 5 degrees into a North Easterly wind at Carlisle. However the man responsible and who had no birds in the convoy has blamed the route. He would have us race twice from Otterburn--nothing short of lunacy. What Ayrshire really need is to get on a route and stick on it irrespective of the fanciers who live on the coast and use their vote to gain an advantage. To reduce losses and also help the fed balance we need to think about fewer races and bigger jumps during the Percy killing season of August. Do you really think that sending the youngsters down the east into a westerly wind with all the potential for clashing will help---get real. Year on year the losses will escalate and changing route will not help. We need to get off our *expletive removed* and address the main problem by both legal and illegal means. Yes I am speaking of the winged menace which is really just entering the killing season now.

This is the most honest post I have read on any pigeon site for some time. Well said KB