Guest Owen Posted September 28, 2009 Report Posted September 28, 2009 spin cycle I think you are right. We definately need the have a, "Clamour". So perhaps we ought to try to keep this subject going. My concern is that the bulk of the Fancy will go back to sleep after a while. I would like to have a proper investigation on how we loose as many pigeons as we do each year. After a bad race there is plenty of interest in the subject, but every year the same, a couple of weeks later the majority loose interest. It could be that things have gone too far already and nothing will reverse the slide towards obscurity. I think that it would be a shame to see the racing pigeon die out. It has taken such a long time to develop it to it's present day standard. I can't help feeling sorry for the people involved with the cage birds. There seems to be very few left now. A friend was, until recently, a very keen Border Canary Man. His wife told me the other day that he still has a few birds but they are all old now. And as they die of old age they will not be replaced. I think it would be criminal to see our Sport die in much the same way. In regard to the job of raising money. I really don't think it would be very hard to raise the funds to fight our corner. The British Homing World is far too cheap and a price raise would be a good way to start. Then there is the money raised a Blackpool. Why give it away when we need it. If people want to raise money for charity, let them do it by exploiting their own resources, not ours. Single loft races could be another vehicle to add to the fund. My problem is that I would be concerned as to how it would be spent. And who would be the one to look after it. That is why I think we need a professional to look after things.
vanlink Posted September 28, 2009 Author Report Posted September 28, 2009 I like what Owen is saying, he has passion and he is coming up with some positive suggestions. United we stand divided we fall. I think we have no chance of ever getting our hands on any of the Blackpool fund, which is a shame because despite the thousands handed out to charity every year they are still viewed as diseased flying rats. Blackpool so I am aware owes a lot to us the pigeon fanciers who descend upon them in the winter to spend our hard earned cash. How does Blackpool perceive our pigeons? Rightly or wrongly we now spend more than ever on our pigeons. We have had quite a large amount of disposable cash to spend although the current climate may alter that. Even so we are certainly far richer than we were when the sport was at its height. But times have certainly changed; we all know that, the sports dying blah blah blah. The RPRA do nothing blah blah blah. Well lets help them. Lets give them the motivation, the kick up the bum, the tools and ultimately the money to do the job. Most of us are pretty convinced the sport needs dragging into a modern era and most of us know that you need professionals to do it. Those professionals cost money. So we have to decide whether we are ALL willing to put our hands in our pockets and collectively pay the equivalent price of one or two bags of corn a year to help this to happen. There is an alternative that I see happening to be honest. I see the future under the current system going like this: Feds will become unviable and gradually they will fold, members will be forced to pack up or join the nationals, classics and super clubs. As numbers continue to fall the RPRA will try to squeeze money out of who is left until either it becomes unviable itself or a big national club finally decides to break away from the bureaucracy of what is left and go it alone. At this point there may, if the committee of that said national club is dynamic enough, be a revival or it may of course continue with the same apathy. One thing is for sure at least I know that I would have tried to save the sport I love.
vanlink Posted October 3, 2009 Author Report Posted October 3, 2009 Been away so not had chance to keep this going. I think that the poll is a reasonable reflection. What would you say is a fair price to pay? I would be happy to pay a tenner a year to contribute towards this fund. Multiply 10 by the number of RPRA members and i beleive that they would have quite an amount to make some real progress.
Roland Posted October 3, 2009 Report Posted October 3, 2009 Good idea, maybe. Members would not even consider it. Yes pur and make soothing sounds.... But if ever it came to a vote they would simple say 'I would, but the others won''t, and never get even as far as being put up to vote on. Further the RPRA would put feelers out. The responce from memebrs feed back would mean thet thay would never even bother to try. Sad but true. indeed the only time you ever see member up and at it, and even telling their representives how to vote is if it is going to cost them a £1 or or so. £10 :o would see them purring that it's a good idea, bur won't vote for it as it will never get through. omitting that they will make sure it won't get through. JMO
Guest Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 my opinion is that members would only contribute if they were getting something out of it how would you feel about setting up a series of international races or such with enhanced entry fees say 75% to the cost of running it and prize money and 25% goes to the fund or whatever split you think would be appropriate dave
Turk Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Whilst on the subject of the BHW Blackpool show, and having given some scrutiny to the recently presented RPRA accounts in the Homing World, I do question why a charge for the best part of £17,000 is in effect being levied against the whole membership for the Blackpool show. It would seem to me that in these financially and economically taxing times, and when the RPRA is showing a very substantial loss and thus wishing to increase membership fees by almost 100%, the cost of organising the show should be taken from the show proceeds before distribution to Charity, and not from the membership whether they like it or not. I cannot think of a worse point in time to be asking for such a large increase, when there are clearly other options open to investigation. Let’s hope there is a councillor with a little financial savvy, who will query these accounts and not just accept them as read.
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Whilst on the subject of the BHW Blackpool show, and having given some scrutiny to the recently presented RPRA accounts in the Homing World, I do question why a charge for the best part of £17,000 is in effect being levied against the whole membership for the Blackpool show. It would seem to me that in these financially and economically taxing times, and when the RPRA is showing a very substantial loss and thus wishing to increase membership fees by almost 100%, the cost of organising the show should be taken from the show proceeds before distribution to Charity, and not from the membership whether they like it or not. I cannot think of a worse point in time to be asking for such a large increase, when there are clearly other options open to investigation. Let’s hope there is a councillor with a little financial savvy, who will query these accounts and not just accept them as read. I agree with you, if a club needs funds its first port of call is organise a sale or shows etc before asking members to dip directly into their pockets. I see no difference if the RPRA need funds then raise them as members don't have bottomless pockets!
stan p Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 the all setup whents altering from top to bottom befor you throu enye more money at it or you are wasting your time how many lofts will be chaingen there names because of increas in unions
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 the all setup whents altering from top to bottom befor you throu enye more money at it or you are wasting your time how many lofts will be chaingen there names because of increas in unions I think thats 1 thing many havn't picked up on! I know of at least 1 that will be changeing from Mr & Mrs to singular so as not to have to pay 2 fees! Its the RPRA that will lose!
gorsy bank lofts Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Surely there are the professionals we need somewhere within out sport that can be formed into a committee that will run side by side with all unions,the problem with the rpra is costs and wages where you would proberbly see 70% of all funds go. i think we need something to happen before there are any grass root fanciers left. atb lyndon
Turk Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 The BHW carried no less than a six- page coverage of the RPRA Annual General Meeting at Coventry on February 27th, and yet despite all this reporting, the state of the RPRA’s finances merited just five lines of comment from the general manager. The report states that several queries were raised (no mention what those queries were of course), and the accounts were passed. Perhaps even more enlightening was the paragraph that warranted a massive in depth analysis running to a whole eight lines, confirming that the 2007 profit of £71,674 has been turned into a loss of nearly £23,000. That is a disparity of around £94,000 in just twelve months, and yet it would appear that the only offering on the horizon from the RPRA, is the possibility of increasing the subscription, given the statement that expenditure exceeds income. (How hugely perceptive a statement was that?) Could expenditure, such as the £16,974 itemised as Blackpool Expenses, but is infact Entertainment of Foreign Pigeon Dignitaries be an example of expenditure that is too high? Any other business organisation producing such an abysmal set of accounts, might firstly have offered some form of apology to their shareholders (that’s us the membership); secondly looked long and hard at their finance director’s competence and tenure, and thirdly be on a cost cutting rampage. Did we hear any of this? ~ Of course not. Do we hear that a budget is being compiled for 2009? ~ Of course not. Do we see any mention at all by the RPRA management as to how they intend to resolve this position, other than by increasing subscriptions? ~ Of course not. I do wonder if the majority of Councillors understand that turning a healthy profit into a loss in a twelve month period, warrants a major overhaul of what would appear, in my opinion, to be quite a snug club, where nobody seems to want to rock the boat. :-/
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 If questioned they will refer you to region etc! They will always have a reason for making losses but surely the membership should be able to question directly as has been said, its our money! I have sugested this before but it will never happen, that an open forum be held at somewhere like Blackpool for members to ask questions directly to the Unions! You may also recall I asked the BHW to have a questions to the Union page so members could get answers to general questions with regards to problems we experience to help the sport move forward. After a management meeting it wasn't decided it was not neccesary!
Turk Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 If questioned they will refer you to region etc! They will always have a reason for making losses but surely the membership should be able to question directly as has been said, its our money! I have sugested this before but it will never happen, that an open forum be held at somewhere like Blackpool for members to ask questions directly to the Unions! You may also recall I asked the BHW to have a questions to the Union page so members could get answers to general questions with regards to problems we experience to help the sport move forward. After a management meeting it wasn't decided it was not neccesary! The whole thing as a smell of the hazel blears about it and we know what happened there :-/
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 The whole thing as a smell of the hazel blears about it and we know what happened there :-/ but in government there are opposition parties who will stand up and question, argue with government until something is done! What do we have? A council of fosils who won't rock the boat incase they miss out on a jolly or two!
Turk Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 but in government there are opposition parties who will stand up and question, argue with government until something is done! What do we have? A council of fosils who won't rock the boat incase they miss out on a jolly or two! democracy democracy democracy ;D surly questions can be asked in our owned BHW ;D like the government run BBC ;D a brain washer of the masses ;D then if your not singing the right song it will not be published ;D in this day and age they should be no jolly's ,everything should be done via video conference saving thousands in perks for the few :-/
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Managed to find my sugestions to the BHW, owned by the RPRA to remind members what we are up against! Good morning Mr Richards Can I make a suggestion for the BHW. I belong to a few forums and there often appears to be concerns from members all over the country about the lack of action or response to problems by the RPRA. You already have your “view from the Reddings†slot but I think it would be a good idea to have a questions page where members can e-mail questions and both the question and answer from the RPRA are printed. Surely one page an issue could be given over to this which in turn would build bridges between the membership and the Association as well as enabling the Association to actually here from the grass roots membership and give a reply on what is being done or can be done etc! Reply Thank you for your suggestion, I will certainly look into the possibility of such a page and will put forward your suggestions to the BHW Management Committee when they meet next month. Good morning Mr Richards Has the meeting been held and what was the outcome please? Reply We had our meeting on Wednesday and I put your suggestions to the BHW Management Committee, but after quite a lengthy discussion they decided against the questions and answer page in the BHW. They stated that if members have any issues at all these can currently be discussed with their Region Secretary. Steve Richards editor@britishhomingworld.co.uk What chance have we got!
Turk Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Managed to find my sugestions to the BHW, owned by the RPRA to remind members what we are up against! Good morning Mr Richards Can I make a suggestion for the BHW. I belong to a few forums and there often appears to be concerns from members all over the country about the lack of action or response to problems by the RPRA. You already have your “view from the Reddings†slot but I think it would be a good idea to have a questions page where members can e-mail questions and both the question and answer from the RPRA are printed. Surely one page an issue could be given over to this which in turn would build bridges between the membership and the Association as well as enabling the Association to actually here from the grass roots membership and give a reply on what is being done or can be done etc! Reply Thank you for your suggestion, I will certainly look into the possibility of such a page and will put forward your suggestions to the BHW Management Committee when they meet next month. Good morning Mr Richards Has the meeting been held and what was the outcome please? Reply We had our meeting on Wednesday and I put your suggestions to the BHW Management Committee, but after quite a lengthy discussion they decided against the questions and answer page in the BHW. They stated that if members have any issues at all these can currently be discussed with their Region Secretary. Steve Richards editor@britishhomingworld.co.uk What chance have we got! NO CHANCE :-/
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 We had a letter from our region sec a few weeks ago to say we hadn't paid our RPRA fees! I rang her and pointed out we had resigned from the RPRA club we flew in before there AGM! Her reply was that we hadn't resigned directly with the Union as well! I asked her to find out which rule requires a member to resign from both club and union, suprise suprise, 2 months latter and still waiting for an answer! Whats the point of asking the regions, they don't know the rules themselves!
Guest spin cycle Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 i saw vanlinks letter (weldone). also well spotted 'turk' that the blackpool show costs £17k...and then gives money to charity (dizzy). the jobs vanlink describes could be amalgamated a bit IMO and that £17k would go along way. also if we are to keep donating to charity then some funds,it could be argued, should be 'ploughed back' to 'invest' making sure there are fanciers in the future to keep the show going. its depressing that the Q&A was rejected but we must keep talking about these ideas..... as with a lot of things if they are said enough eventually they'll budge.
showman Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 A thought....just a thought ! As a group of concerned fanciers......decide on a single question which can be put to the RPRA. When the 'current' question has been decided upon....each person, on a pre-determined date, can go to the website of the RPRA......there is a 'Contact us' on the home page......we all then send this same current question ! This would be an on-going campaign, with different questions decided upon every week or 2 weeks...whatever. The general consensus on PB is the fancy needs to stick together, and maybe if this idea was to gain momentum......you never know....answers maybe forthcoming ! Sncerely Paul
pjc Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 A thought....just a thought ! As a group of concerned fanciers......decide on a single question which can be put to the RPRA. When the 'current' question has been decided upon....each person, on a pre-determined date, can go to the website of the RPRA......there is a 'Contact us' on the home page......we all then send this same current question ! This would be an on-going campaign, with different questions decided upon every week or 2 weeks...whatever. The general consensus on PB is the fancy needs to stick together, and maybe if this idea was to gain momentum......you never know....answers maybe forthcoming ! Sncerely Paul They may just refer you back to your Region!
showman Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Maybe they would...................but at least there would be a pro-active campaign going ahead which would be for the good of the fancy. Paul
stan p Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 them at the top have to wont the change for it to happen because they will make it to hard for it happen from the bottem up they change any thing they want when they want not bothering what the membership wonts ihey no we need full time pr person they no we wont some of the blackpool money coming back in to the sport they hear but do not listen they will when it is to late and blame ever body but them selfs we need a person to be owere figerhead ow cares about the sport not some body that is not botherd then we mite start to get things going
showman Posted October 4, 2009 Report Posted October 4, 2009 Q. What, in monetary terms, did the RPRA ,in 2009, allocate for the promotion of Pigeon Racing in the United Kingdom ?
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