High proportion dead in shell

[pigeonman007]

All of my that have laid fertile eggs seem to be having problems with dead in shell. Egg is usually ok upto about 12days but then starts to turn bad. A couple got upto chipping but didnt hatch. Out of 6pairs 5 have had 1 dead in shell egg each, the othher pair both eggs dead in shell.  The birds are not getting any disturbances at night that would bring them off the eggs, lights dim down over half hr so if they did happen to be off the eggs they have a good while to get back on them.

Not sure what I am doing wrong...

[Wiley]

seems like you have paratyphoid problems im afraid

[Guest chrisss]

sorry mate but from what i have read [and been told] it sounds like para to me,have any of the older birds showing any of the normal signs?

[pigeonman007]

Are there any visual symptoms that the parents would be showing?

[Wiley]

paratyphoid can be a good hidder many pigeons would be carrying and showing no symptoms at all

[Guest]

seems like you have paratyphoid problems im afraid

 

yes thats one of the main symptoms of parathypoid

also swelling of wing joints,crippling,

one eyed blindness and twisted necks in extreem cases

[pigeonscout]

was this also your post http://forum.pigeonbasics.com/m-1232816474/s-6/#num6

[jimmy white]

paratyphoid can be a good hidder many pigeons would be carrying and showing no symptoms at all

 

yes, this can be very true indeed [theres a good thread on paratyphoid on the health threads]

however, i feel we cant jump to conclusions , without the birds being properly tested,,,,,,,, other probs of this happenning can be,,[1] if youve lights in the loft, then turn them off suddenly without a dimmer ,, birds may not be on their eggs,

[2] mice, you may not see them,, but look for signs , they will cause the birds to come off eggs at night,

[3] too many pigeons in the loft [im not saying you have any of these probs, merely pointing these things out]  this can cause much unrest and stress , fighting etc,, and in this cold weather wouldnt take long for eggs to chill

[4] any other disturbances at night , which can be caused by many things

but better safe than sorry ,, and get them tested for paratyphoid, which in itself is a very unpredictable test, which really needs to be done repeatedly , to actualy find out if theres traces of it,,   hpe all turns out well

[pigeonman007]

was this also your post http://forum.pigeonbasics.com/m-1232816474/s-6/#num6

 

Yes, thats me. Was advised by a mate to get some parastop just to be on the safe side.

 

Seem to have got over the clear eggs prob now, I trimmed the offending birds and 2nd round of eggs are now fertile

 

 

 

[pigeonman007]

 

yes, this can be very true indeed [theres a good thread on paratyphoid on the health threads]

however, i feel we cant jump to conclusions , without the birds being properly tested,,,,,,,, other probs of this happenning can be,,[1] if youve lights in the loft, then turn them off suddenly without a dimmer ,, birds may not be on their eggs, Have the lights on a dimmer over 30min

[2] mice, you may not see them,, but look for signs , they will cause the birds to come off eggs at night, Have been checking for weeks for mice, even have a couple of 'humane' traps set up in the loft just incase but no sign of them, no droppings. I will block my vent up at night just incase they are getting in though

[3] too many pigeons in the loft [im not saying you have any of these probs, merely pointing these things out]  this can cause much unrest and stress , fighting etc,, and in this cold weather wouldnt take long for eggs to chill The section is 6 x 5 with 8pairs, but 3 of the pairs are shut in their boxes and let out singularly when the other boxes are closed up

[4] any other disturbances at night , which can be caused by many things

but better safe than sorry ,, and get them tested for paratyphoid, which in itself is a very unpredictable test, which really needs to be done repeatedly , to actualy find out if theres traces of it,,   hpe all turns out well

Only possible disturbance I can think of is next door have a new pup and he has been whigning a lot at night, can hear this from outside the loft, would that be enough to bring them off maybe?

 

 

[jimmy white]

Only possible disturbance I can think of is next door have a new pup and he has been whigning a lot at night, can hear this from outside the loft, would that be enough to bring them off maybe?

 

 

seems youve covered most possibilities,,   if this whining sound of this new pup,  is new and a " different"  sound  to the birds , could well be  poss that this would upset them enough for them to rise from their eggs at night , then go back on them ,  but in this cold, would be  easy enough chilled, very quickly

[Guest]

 

Yes, thats me. Was advised by a mate to get some parastop just to be on the safe side.

 

Seem to have got over the clear eggs prob now, I trimmed the offending birds and 2nd round of eggs are now fertile    what do you use in nest and what bowles do you use.

 

 

 

 

[pigeonman007]

 

seems youve covered most possibilities,,   if this whining sound of this new pup,  is new and a " different"  sound  to the birds , could well be  poss that this would upset them enough for them to rise from their eggs at night , then go back on them ,  but in this cold, would be  easy enough chilled, very quickly

Theyve had him a good few weeks now, he whines during the day as well and they dont move off the eggs then. A poultry web site I had a read of this evening suggests it may be a vitamin d deficiency particularly if they are dieing a few days before hatching which a few have.  

 

[pigeonman007]

 

 

I have clay nestbowls which are on plastic grids. nest material is a small amount of shavings and whatever straw they carry to the bowl. Most made their own nests with the straw, but those that havent I put a good handfull in the bowl and flattened it down for them so the eggs arent touching the clay

[Guest]

i thought this was the classic sign of samonela

[Guest]

if i was you i would get them tested then you will now dont treat them for anything test first    

[greenlands]

Pigeonman007 said,Only possible disturbance I can think of is next door have a new pup and he has been whigning a lot at night, can hear this from outside the loft, would that be enough to bring them off maybe?

If you think that could be a problem put a radio in the loft and leave it on all the time.

[Wiley]

personally dont think the pup could take the birds of the eggs, i new a very successful LNRC fancier who at one time lived next to a railway, the trains would pass daily the birds didnt even flutter an eyelid, in my personal opinion couldnt be the pup i maybe wrong.

[REDCHEQHEN]

personally dont think the pup could take the birds of the eggs, i new a very successful LNRC fancier who at one time lived next to a railway, the trains would pass daily the birds didnt even flutter an eyelid, in my personal opinion couldnt be the pup i maybe wrong.

 

you couldn't get any closer than mine - and it doesn't bother them at all - they don't budge an inch - so I doubt that its noise - as these trains pass every 15 minutes - more often at peak times - and we have several run through the night as well (I sleep at the front of the house (evil) )

[jimmy white]

good job you stay in the back bedroom ;D ;D ;D just a tad close to those trains ;D ;D ;D

i think we are saying these "can"  be the classic signs of salmonella/paratyphoid , but we are trying to rule out any other possibilities , most have been ruled out apart from the noise of  this  new puppy,, in my opinion , pigeons will get used to most noises if heard regular and pose  no threat to them,  but this being a new noise ,right next to the loft , could leave a possiblity of birds comming off their eggs in the dark , even for a short time in winter b4 they find their way back on to the eggs , they could well be chilled ,, only a possibility,,, advice was to have them checked out for paratyphoid

[bobtail]

;D ;D ;D ;D ;Dthis is the best one yet a puppy giving the pigeons paratyphiod etc.

[jimmy white]

certainly think paratyphod no joke,, im quite sure pigeonman 007 is hoping and praying he doesnt have this in his birds,,

[stevebelbin]

It could be something simple, like if this is your first year in racing and your excited about seeing the new offspring, you may be disturbing them too much by checking the eggs etc. Only you will know if thats the case and only you will know if theres a difference in your birds health etc! Also the hens diet when they were paired can have an effect on the YBs hatching out.

[pigeonman007]

Hi Steve

Yes, first year in racing. I usually check the egg around 5 days for fertility, and again at about 10/14days to make sure all is ok, then they are left. I scrape out the boxes each day but they dont come off the eggs when I am doing that.

The hens were on Natural 4 seasons corn mix which was diluted by equal parts barley

[Guest shadow]

sounds like salmonella get them tested