Hawk attack

[Ted]

Could anyone please tell my why a hawk will attack my pigeons after flying over feral pigeons flying over the farm it passed on the way to mine?  Curious to why!

[REDCHEQHEN]

More meat on a racing pigeon

 

[Guest ljb107]

and racers are probably easier to catch than a feral because ferals are wised up

[Guest]

If you walk past a table of food and see a steak and a beefburger side by side which one would you go for?  

[Guest]

If you walk past a table of food and see a steak and a beefburger side by side which one would you go for?  

:-/ beefburger ;D ;D ;D :'( :'(

 

 

[Guest]

:-/ beefburger ;D ;D ;D :'( :'(

 

 

Aye Aye, one made out of steak.       ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

 

 

[Guest Owen]

I think that all predators are born with very developed powers of observation. They would pick up on the fact that feral pigeons are very confident about their environment. The racing pigeons on the other hand would display and uncertainty and nerviousness that would speak volumns to the predator. Predators always take the easiest option because they know that most of their attacks are failures.

A friend was having a hidding with the falcon and had lost quite a few birds from a small team. Other Fanciers were loosing birds all around. He decided to give the birds open hole so that they could take their chances and become streetwise. In a short space of time they did. The falcons were still there but the the killing stopped. An unexpected benefit was that his birds got to be very fit and he was winning races.

[green monster]

the hawk knows yours are worth more money

[Ted]

lol green!

 

Owen, when you say open hole, were they open 24-7 so they could come and go as they pleased?

[DAVIDL]

and racers are probably easier to catch than a feral because ferals are wised up

 

 

how can a pigeon "wise up"  to hawk attacks.....?

[pigeondan]

 

 

how can a pigeon "wise up"  to hawk attacks.....?

 

By seeing others being attacked and learning that, they may just realise that they are dangerous. Feral pigeons survive on this instinct where as some race pigeons may have lost this instinct

[Guest IB]

 

 

how can a pigeon "wise up"  to hawk attacks.....?

 

I've posted on this one before. My pigeons take their cue from the wild birds around here, which behave in predictable ways when there is a winged predator about, they take to the air and get above it, and if they still feel threatened, they clear the area for 10/15" and come back when the threat is gone.

 

Racing pigeons are not that far removed in years from their wild ancestor, the rock dove, maybes 200 years tops? The wild instinct is still there, takes thousands of years to breed that out, that is if it is possible, take the domestic dog and cat as good examples, and that's after thousands? of years of  domestication.

 

  

[Guest IB]

Have posted on this one before. I reckon two reasons:-

 

(1) ferals are descended from rock dove, which lived cheek-by-jowl with peregrines on cliff faces for eons. They know how to avoid being taken, they have daily practice at it. and

(2) ferals are a less safe because of what they feed on and carry, and therefore poor quality meat. Racing pigeons are in the main safe for hawks thanks to fanciers 'overclean' practices and grain-reared therefore 'prime quality beef'  

 

ferals are just not worth the trouble ..

 

  

[DAVIDL]

 

 

however "wised up" they become its a sad fact of life that they will never outfly a hawk.....also if a pigeon is sat on a roof or sat anywhere, a hawks attack is way too fast for a pigeon to react and fly away.... :-/

[blaz]

 

 

how can a pigeon "wise up"  to hawk attacks.....?

 

how does any prey animal wise up . if you walk along a path with 6 other bodies a lion jumps out and eats 1 . you walk along the path the next day will you not be looking out for the lion. lol

[weecunny]

does that only work in eastlothian lollol

[DAVIDL]

 

how does any prey animal wise up . if you walk along a path with 6 other bodies a lion jumps out and eats 1 . you walk along the path the next day will you not be looking out for the lion. lol

 

 

you are compairing a humans line of thought with a pigeons, totaly different....so a pigeon sees another pigeon killed by a hawk and it knows how to stop it happening to him ?????   yeah... :-/

 

[Guest IB]

 

however "wised up" they become its a sad fact of life that they will never outfly a hawk.....also if a pigeon is sat on a roof or sat anywhere, a hawks attack is way too fast for a pigeon to react and fly away.... :-/

 

The first part of your post is a common misunderstanding, on level flight, absolutely nothing can outfly a racing pigeon. The second part refers to a stealth attack? like a sparrowhawk? In my opinion you have a part to play in preventing that by making sure (1) the bird is not sat anywhere it shouldn't be and (2) there's nowhere around the loft that a sparrowhawk can hide, allowing it to make a stealth attack on your birds. The last bit is entirely up to the bird, it is either streetwise and tuned in to what is going on around it (wild birds kick up one racket when a predator is on the go) - or it is dead meat.

[DAVIDL]

 

1) how can you, or any other fancier ever guarentee a pigeon will not be sat where it shouldnt be... :-/

2)how can you, or any other fancier ever guarentee there is nowhere around the loft that a sparrowhawk can hide... :-/

3)i beg to differ that nothing can outfly a pigeon, a peregrine falcon cant ?  :-/

 

i dont think a pigeon would get the chance to become streetwise as its something that has to be gained through experience and one wrong turn and its dead.....very few second chances for pigeons...

[les]

yesterday a friend of mine witnessed 3 pigeons flying in a strait line ,he watched a perry take of and catch them up with ease and take 1 out .

[DAVIDL]

yesterday a friend of mine witnessed 3 pigeons flying in a strait line ,he watched a perry take of and catch them up with ease and take 1 out .

 

 

agree les, easily outfly a racing pigeon.... >

 

[Big Davie]

 

The first part of your post is a common misunderstanding, on level flight, absolutely nothing can outfly a racing pigeon. The second part refers to a stealth attack? like a sparrowhawk? In my opinion you have a part to play in preventing that by making sure (1) the bird is not sat anywhere it shouldn't be and (2) there's nowhere around the loft that a sparrowhawk can hide, allowing it to make a stealth attack on your birds. The last bit is entirely up to the bird, it is either streetwise and tuned in to what is going on around it (wild birds kick up one racket when a predator is on the go) - or it is dead meat.

IB have you ever seen a peregrine chasing a pigeon in level flight, i have on a number of occasions and i can tell you they are on top of them in seconds.

 

 

[Guest Owen]

Well I can assure you that pigeons have the capacity to learn. I have seen a peregrine take a young pigeon out of a group. And the amazing thing was that the pigeons did not falter in the flight. They carried on as if nothing had happened. No adult pigeon would have done that. They would have learned, partly by instinct and partly by experience. Most Fanciers will have experienced Hawk attacks at their lofts. And after the pigeons have seen the hawk attack they will become so frightened that they will not want to leave the loft. Again they have learned.

The other thing that comes to mind is the fact that pigeons need practice before they are properly confident at landing at a loft. And flying around the area where they live. Young birds are especially clumsy as we all know, and after they become familiar with their suroundings, with practice they become very competant at landing and taking off. I think that feral pigeons are no differant, because they know all about hawks and are totally familiar with their suroundings. This means that they can exploit their home territory to their advantage and become very difficult to catch. I know that my widowhood cocks seem to prefer to fly over some trees that are about half a mile away. They will repeatedly fly over the trees every time they are out at exercise. I think that they know that if there is a peregrine attack they are safer if they can dive into the trees. Racing Pigeons become vulnerable by flying over unfamiliar territory.

All preditors are very good at observation of their potential prey. It is a matter of life and death to them to know which individual to pick out. I think that they can pick out the fact that a bird is not in a familiar place or that it is tired or ill. So if I am right, the racing pigeons will be targeted more often than feral pigeons. The unfair thing is, that as the racing pigeon is an unwild creature and should not form part of a preditors diet, the wild birds will pay the price. The result is that the ratio of preditor to prey is distorted in faviour of the preditor. If the RSPB want to reestablish the balance they must stop the supply of other than wild food to these creatures.

[keanerthanclean]

i think every1 should 4 get the hawk n just hope nothings ever gonna change u crnt touch em they 2 pretected  

[DAVIDL]

Well I can assure you that pigeons have the capacity to learn. I have seen a peregrine take a young pigeon out of a group. And the amazing thing was that the pigeons did not falter in the flight. They carried on as if nothing had happened. No adult pigeon would have done that. They would have learned, partly by instinct and partly by experience. Most Fanciers will have experienced Hawk attacks at their lofts. And after the pigeons have seen the hawk attack they will become so frightened that they will not want to leave the loft. Again they have learned.

The other thing that comes to mind is the fact that pigeons need practice before they are properly confident at landing at a loft. And flying around the area where they live. Young birds are especially clumsy as we all know, and after they become familiar with their suroundings, with practice they become very competant at landing and taking off. I think that feral pigeons are no differant, because they know all about hawks and are totally familiar with their suroundings. This means that they can exploit their home territory to their advantage and become very difficult to catch. I know that my widowhood cocks seem to prefer to fly over some trees that are about half a mile away. They will repeatedly fly over the trees every time they are out at exercise. I think that they know that if there is a peregrine attack they are safer if they can dive into the trees. Racing Pigeons become vulnerable by flying over unfamiliar territory.

All preditors are very good at observation of their potential prey. It is a matter of life and death to them to know which individual to pick out. I think that they can pick out the fact that a bird is not in a familiar place or that it is tired or ill. So if I am right, the racing pigeons will be targeted more often than feral pigeons. The unfair thing is, that as the racing pigeon is an unwild creature and should not form part of a preditors diet, the wild birds will pay the price. The result is that the ratio of preditor to prey is distorted in faviour of the preditor. If the RSPB want to reestablish the balance they must stop the supply of other than wild food to these creatures.

 

 

the one it took out of the group didnt get the chance to learn though did it...? :-/