Roland Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 until people who are infinitely more expert than we are affirm that repeat vaccination is a waste of time no one is in a position to do anything other than make assumptions which are often founded on thin if any facts. all we have to do is look at situation that has developed regarding the tripple mmr vaccine. we should leave well alone until better informed and better advised in my opinion. I agree with the whole shebuckum that you state / say. that doesn't for one moment lead me to believe that it WASN'T for the good of pigeons that this law was brought in. And it is a far far way off, as far as I and many others believe, including vets / Med scientist etc. In Belgium - where supposedly this ailment was rife originally - I believe that once is survice. Our DAFRA body, love them or not, have a duty to many other parties besides us, and obviously their' 'Stock' whatever it maybe, so they aren't apt to taken any chances.... Mostly like the Chicken / Turkey, poultry trade etc. These concerns also raise 'Livings' for some, and also serve a comodity to the public. This entails mega bucks obviously, and they as sure as hell wouldn't take a chance real or imaginary. Indeed in real terms they don't and NEEDN'T give a fickled rats *expletive removed* for us and our sport. But if ever a out break comes again no one can point the finger at us, NOR DAFRA, as they will be SEEN to be doing their' part and nothing could be laid at their door... That could even in some way mean compensation etc. Mind I personally also believe that when ever a 'Big Concern' gets hit... tax payers have to bail them out, so in any case WE pay. But DAFRA will always nigh be seen to be clear...
Guest IB Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 until people who are infinitely more expert than we are affirm that repeat vaccination is a waste of time no one is in a position to do anything other than make assumptions which are often founded on thin if any facts. all we have to do is look at situation that has developed regarding the tripple mmr vaccine. we should leave well alone until better informed and better advised in my opinion. The point is that it is those ‘people who are infinitely more expert than we are’ who raised the issue in the first place. A 2001 Report by Westminster’s Veterinary Products Committee (VPC) shows that there is widespread concern on the subject: Executive Summary (1) ‘in both the public domain and in the scientific community about possible health risks related to the routine vaccination of cats and dogs’ … and VPC also suggests that annual vaccination may not be necessary (2) ‘there is evidence of a longer duration of immunity following vaccination than the one year which is typically recommended on the product literature’. This is the Report that gave rise to Westminster commissioning further Research in 2006, and until its findings are known, I agree with you that it is ‘wait & see’ and status quo until then. (The Veterinary Products Committee (VPC) is an independent scientific committee established under Section 4 of the Medicines Act to give advice on the safety, quality and efficacy of veterinary medicines to the UK licensing authority (Health and Agriculture Ministers) and to promote the collection of information relating to suspected adverse reactions for the purpose of enabling such advice to be given.) http://www.noah.co.uk/papers/vpc-catdogvetsurv.pdf
HOMER49 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 Hi Some of the posts infer that you do not need to vaccinate for PMV Well I have had pigeons for 48 years and can assure you that vaccination IS A MUST DO 2003 bred a cracking team of y/bs 47 off them They were not vaccinated when it struck Never raced any of them and by Dec 2003 had 7 left and 2 more had to be put down Knowing what I know now should have destroyed them all when PMV was confirmed So until some of you people out there breath in the stench and mop up the slime that comes with PMV you have no right to imply that you don't need to vaccinate Cheers Homer 49
Roland Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 Hi Some of the posts infer that you do not need to vaccinate for PMV Well I have had pigeons for 48 years and can assure you that vaccination IS A MUST DO 2003 bred a cracking team of y/bs 47 off them They were not vaccinated when it struck Never raced any of them and by Dec 2003 had 7 left and 2 more had to be put down Knowing what I know now should have destroyed them all when PMV was confirmed So until some of you people out there breath in the stench and mop up the slime that comes with PMV you have no right to imply that you don't need to vaccinate Cheers Homer 49 Again I understand where your coming from. had it the irst season every I started. Peeved to say the least. Most went on and flew as normal. A couple were disposed off. I can't help but say that the 'Sight' of seeing them thus is terrible. But how will they ever build up a immunity until allowed. having said that, Polio is still rife here (Is the most sucessful vacinne of all fortunately) ... hardly ever seen till some thought it was no longer around. So they stopped vaccinating.... you beter believe it is still around. BUT it is like the Newcastle desiese is it not! Why is not 3 or 4 jabs say first year not enough? I believe it is personally, but our biggest fear is surely NOT letting any 'Body' be able to point the finger at our fancy if, and when another out break happens.
The Navigator Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 I know plenty who do not bother, it's ripe in the pigeon world and we all know it.
duffer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 As stated before if vaccinations work why are you bothered about other birds,surly your birds are immune.To vaccinate you are injecting a mild form of the disease into your bird so it is more likely that it is your birds that are infecting the unvaccinated birds.Vaccination was brought in on political grounds as some european countries were refusing to buy uk poultry. One local fanciers birds caught it when it first started and when he reported it no one was even bothered to reply,i think he lost two birds and the rest were ok.Next year he bred me a team of youngsters and they were fine in fact one of my best ever birds i have raced was one of them,so would i vaccinate ? no way and the last season i flew i bred eighteen ybs flew through to yb national and finished with seventeen.
duffer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 how long ago was what?,last season i flew or my mates birds catching it.
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 no just wondered when you flew without injecting them
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 cause you state no way to vaccinate i wonder why and resons why not
duffer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 My own opinion is that when it first started it should have been left to run its course and that in time the birds would have built up natural immunity,i have seen birds get over it and be ok but this was never allowed to happen.Vaccination was forced upon us for the sake of the poultry trade and as i have stated if it works why are fanciers birds still contracting it.If they are unvaccinated birds than the fancier has no right to complain except that his birds may not have caught it if they had not been forced to come in contact with carriers.
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 accepted but if as you say no to injection are you not jeperdising all other birds around youers or youers around them dont get me wrong i know loads dont but i do not that i agree with it at all its i have seen it full force its not nice so if i can give some chance to them i willl but should we every year im not so sure
duffer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 how can i be putting any other birds at risk there vaccinated its mine that are at risk because they are not vaccinated but are in contact with carriers thanks to mass vaccination.
Guest bigda Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 you say you had it can you explain what you did to rid it
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 yep killed lot not one left at that time as i beleave infertile and some will carry it and it will show itself again so vac since
Guest bigda Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 well you seen birds recover from it then
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 yes but ignorance is bliss thats 15 years ago bigd would i cull now i dont honestly know as i still beleave carriers are ones that get better
duffer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 Well i dont think there is a miracle cure good food a little eletrolyte and rest,then its upto the bird itself some will cope better than others but thats nature better to get rid of the weak early.
Guest bigda Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 no i did not. there are only two scenarios here duffer, if you catch this you have to treat the bird with antibiotics, so this leaves you with treating them anyhow, it takes 14 week and hand feeding. if you don't do this the bird will die in one week so its better to jag so as to stop wasting your time hand feeding the sick birds so to say your not and you don't is only a mater of time till some thing comes along and ruins your entire season
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 and watching them is heartrendering all youer work hopes gone
duffer Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 Wrong,you dont have to treat them with any thing,when i first saw this my mate only had to put two birds down the rest got over it on there own,no hand feeding.this was when it first started maybe these days pigeons are weaker with all this treatment
Guest bigda Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 duffer i no now you have never seen this illness you must be mixing this up with some other ill nes as i can assure you mate this aint no joke tell me if your birds head is upside down where the f is it going to eat by its self
ChrisMaidment08 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Posted October 12, 2008 he has not seen it mate or he would not say its as it is duffer the birds dont eat they dont know *expletive removed* from elbow if they have it
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