avian vets

[Guest lenwadebob]

Anyone know of a good Avian vet in Norfolk (for future reference)

[OLDYELLOW]

what your saying is very true  old yellow but how many vets in this country are as tuned in as these lads

 

mine is i suppose if my vets are trusted by defra and used for goverment testing they must be of the highest caliber , they've kept my birds right for years ok you have to observe your birds in order to keep on top of them but id rather spend my money on having a negative test than break down my birds immune system treating when not nessasary

[slatey]

libby harrison at retford poultry top avian vet knows what she is talking about

 

there is not a vet in the uk i would trust with pigeon and the one above never again

i went to libby with my obs she said they had e/coli treat with (cant remeber name of hand)

i cured them myself i put them in the bin

 

never been to garry spavin but did go to his mentor ray ingram top man

[blackdog]

 

there is not a vet in the uk i would trust with pigeon and the one above never again

i went to libby with my obs she said they had e/coli treat with (cant remeber name of hand)

i cured them myself i put them in the bin

 

never been to garry spavin but did go to his mentor ray ingram top man

 

all the top men around here were going to ray ingram when he was testing at the time, same now with garry spavin, top men in the federation go to him  

 

 

[Guest IB]

Back to the subject of avian vets: a simple phone call should answer these questions.

 

Avian vets are few and far between, there are hundreds of 'vets' in UK, but avian vets are a small specialiast branch, and that can be seen from the small number of them that write for / advertise in BHW (and not all of them do). So stands to reason, not every vet is able to treat a bird (or a horse for that matter) so few people can claim to have an avian vet 'Local'. My first visit was to a vet practicing less than 1/2 mile from my home, only to be told he knew nothing about birds, but he put me in touch with one who did.

 

On subject of taking a number of birds to the vet: David Parsons said in his dvd that being in the poultry business, he didn't expect farmers to turn up at the surgery with a lorry load of chickens, he visited them. The only place I've heard that happens with pigeons is Belgium, because the vet is part of the racing scene there. For that to happen here, would I think either need federations to 'retain' the services of an avian vet, (I think the NFC has Frank Harper?) or reach agreement with your own vet.   I think the last option would be very costly, and probably apply to something like a racing stud i.e. a business.

 

 

[holmsidelofts]

Theres no real need to have individual birds tested unless you have a bird that is ill, What is more important is to take samples from around the loft to get an overall picture of what you count is like. If one birds got worms for instance all the birds will have them.

Also the only problem with have the droppings tested is you will find out what you got but you wont know if the treatment you have given them is successful unless you restest them, as from experience treatments dont always work first time. so i would always retest them a week later to see what results i had. Like owen We cannot say enough about owning your own microscope and learning to test yourself. Its not rocket science and anyone can do it. 95% of the time you take your droppings to the vet to be tested they are not tested by the vet but by the nurses who have really no interested or i expect not much knowledge on what they are looking at.

With your own microscope you can test the droppings as often as you want so you can see if theres an increase in anything before it comes to a point where the birds are ill and off form. It tells you a lot about your own management and how your birds react to stress and the way they are managed.

learn the art you wont regret it.

 

Jas

Hi Paul just had a pm from the lad I was talikng about,see below.

 

"Hiya mate, if memory serves me correctly i think he charged about £3 per bird for crop and vent swabs, the results he gives you there and then. I left droppings with him and he asks you to ring him a few days later and i think he charged about £2 per bird.

 

For 6 YBs he charged me in total about £25 i think, which was so reasonable I gave him £30, which is why I cant remember the exact charges. any problems give me a ring ."

 

The only thing I've removed is his name and tel.number.

Lindsay

 

 

 

[Roland]

i see many people on here recommending that they take there birds along to get them tested by an avain vet

how much would it cost for a test for cocci,canker,worms and paratyphoid ?

would you be able to take a few birds  along to get them tested or do they price per bird they test?

 

 

 

 

Don't think for a minute that Dropping will show any Phar .... may be wrong but cerrtainly till comparatively recently it is a different test altogether. A bacteria Swab etc.

Will cost a mite more. BUT you HAVE to ask them parcifically for it to be done.

 

[Roland]

there are now quite a few. One only needs to ask a few renouned flyers who they us.

I bet I can name at least a dozen in no time at all... with the odd phone call or Email.

[Tony C]

I think it about time the RPRA helped us thereby helping themselves in finding a good avian vet.  They could come to some sort of agreement with a practise where free advertising could be run in the Homing World perhaps even a retainer paid.  We the fancier would get a trusted vet with reduced costs for testing and the RPRA could form a database as to where and what the biggest problems are.

[Beanz]

Sorry Tony costs money not much chance of that, now if they want to put officials in the top hotels in Blackpool thats ok

 

 

 

                                                Paul

[mark proctor]

Theres no real need to have individual birds tested unless you have a bird that is ill, What is more important is to take samples from around the loft to get an overall picture of what you count is like. If one birds got worms for instance all the birds will have them.

Also the only problem with have the droppings tested is you will find out what you got but you wont know if the treatment you have given them is successful unless you restest them, as from experience treatments dont always work first time. so i would always retest them a week later to see what results i had. Like owen We cannot say enough about owning your own microscope and learning to test yourself. Its not rocket science and anyone can do it. 95% of the time you take your droppings to the vet to be tested they are not tested by the vet but by the nurses who have really no interested or i expect not much knowledge on what they are looking at.

With your own microscope you can test the droppings as often as you want so you can see if theres an increase in anything before it comes to a point where the birds are ill and off form. It tells you a lot about your own management and how your birds react to stress and the way they are managed.

learn the art you wont regret it.

 

Jas

 

 

JAS I AGREE WITH WHAT YOUR SAYING ABOUT TEST THEM YOUR SELF BUT WHAT IF THEY HAVE GOT THIS AND THAT WRONG WITH THEM..AND THEY NEEDED TREATING WITH ANTIBIOTICS,,,WERE WOULD WE GET THEM FROM COS I NO AS A FACT ALOT OF PRODUCTS WE BUY FROM OUR LOCAL PIGEON SHOPS AND OF THE NET HALF OF THEM DONT WORK THEN WEVE WAISTED OUR TIMES BUYING THEM WHEN WE COULD OF USED ANTIS FROM THE OF ..JOB DONE M8....IVE LEARNT ALOT THIS YEAR,,MORE THAN I HAVE IN 12 YEARS OF KEEPING RACING PIGEONS...THERES ALOT OF CRAP ON THE SHELVES THAT DONT WORK...PLUS EVERY ONE ONE SAYING DONT USE ANTIS WHILE THERE IN FULL MOULT..BULL sh**...ITS THE BEST MINE HAVE EVER MOULTED THREW WITH USEING ANTIS TO GET RID OF SOME THING...WHICH HAS WORKED A TREAT....CHEERS...MARK..

 

 

 

[Tony C]

Sorry Tony costs money not much chance of that, now if they want to put officials in the top hotels in Blackpool thats ok

 

 

 

                                                Paul

 

Of course Paul how silly of me ;D ;D ;D

[OLDYELLOW]

JAS I AGREE WITH WHAT YOUR SAYING ABOUT TEST THEM YOUR SELF BUT WHAT IF THEY HAVE GOT THIS AND THAT WRONG WITH THEM..AND THEY NEEDED TREATING WITH ANTIBIOTICS,,,WERE WOULD WE GET THEM FROM COS I NO AS A FACT ALOT OF PRODUCTS WE BUY FROM OUR LOCAL PIGEON SHOPS AND OF THE NET HALF OF THEM DONT WORK THEN WEVE WAISTED OUR TIMES BUYING THEM WHEN WE COULD OF USED ANTIS FROM THE OF ..JOB DONE M8....IVE LEARNT ALOT THIS YEAR,,MORE THAN I HAVE IN 12 YEARS OF KEEPING RACING PIGEONS...THERES ALOT OF CRAP ON THE SHELVES THAT DONT WORK...PLUS EVERY ONE ONE SAYING DONT USE ANTIS WHILE THERE IN FULL MOULT..BULL sh**...ITS THE BEST MINE HAVE EVER MOULTED THREW WITH USEING ANTIS TO GET RID OF SOME THING...WHICH HAS WORKED A TREAT....CHEERS...MARK..

 

 

 

you say half of over counter medications dont work , the reason for this is one the birds are been treated blindly so could be inefective and two most over the counter medications are half strength so to get good effective treatment you would need to see a good avian vet

[Roland]

I think, personally, that 'Testing / Micro etc for ones self has been our biggest downfall. Too many with very little knowledge think they are whiz kids on the block. Unfortunately far more don't realise they aren’t! A little knowledge is dangerous as they say. Hence too many birds regularly, daily by the score EVERYWHERE all other our countries are not being treated properly. This causes the spread far and wide.

Take years of study. Years of being taught by the best! Then tested as to the advancement regularly. Many exams, that has to be passed etc. Realistically GREAT equipment etc. etc., indeed the finest used. Even then many fail or don't make the grade. Something’s now are  - indeed one hell of a lot doesn't show up in droppings, Bacteria swabs and needs blood examples etc. Then many more are needed to be taken to a Avian Vet for proper diagnosis.... Yes the back room Wally with his Woolworth’s 7/6 p micro knows better.... Yeah I should cocoa. Not say the odd few aren't able to decipher the minor illnesses / ailment etc.... but these are few I think. Further what ailments can be seen is even fewer.

 

[holmsidelofts]

 

you say half of over counter medications dont work , the reason for this is one the bigs are been treated blindly so could be inefective and two most over the counter medications are half strength so to get good effective treatment you would need to see a good avian vet

 

Im not saying over the counter products dont work even products supplied by vets dont always work first time. an example is baycox for cocci, its the best product available for cocci treatment but dont always clear cocci fully the first time around. I and many others have had the issues. If you dont retest them you cant guarantee that it has worked. You can never do without a good avian vet. you need these to be able to get  treatment, I have an excellent relationship with 2 very good avian vets and over the years they have come to trust my ability in identifying common diseases, but you need them for suff like bacterial culturing which you cant do at home. I believe you become a better fancier if you can understand pigeon health thats why i recommend everyone gets a microscope and learn how to use it , but you can never do away with a good vet.

[holmsidelofts]

I think, personally, that 'Testing / Micro etc for ones self has been our biggest downfall. Too many with very little knowledge think they are whiz kids on the block. Unfortunately far more don't realise they aren’t! A little knowledge is dangerous as they say. Hence too many birds regularly, daily by the score EVERYWHERE all other our countries are not being treated properly. This causes the spread far and wide.

Take years of study. Years of being taught by the best! Then tested as to the advancement regularly. Many exams, that has to be passed etc. Realistically GREAT equipment etc. etc., indeed the finest used. Even then many fail or don't make the grade. Something’s now are  - indeed one hell of a lot doesn't show up in droppings, Bacteria swabs and needs blood examples etc. Then many more are needed to be taken to a Avian Vet for proper diagnosis.... Yes the back room Wally with his Woolworth’s 7/6 p micro knows better.... Yeah I should cocoa. Not say the odd few aren't able to decipher the minor illnesses / ailment etc.... but these are few I think. Further what ailments can be seen is even fewer.

 

 

Thats why you need to go a course with a qualified vet like i and other have done and get proper training, £40 is all it cost for a days course with one of the top avian vets in the country, And as for a woolworths microsocope we dont, we have lab spec microscopes and know how to use them, just because you cant use one correctly use one doesnt mean others cant or shouldnt.

you can identify the following if you know how:

 

hairworm, round worm, cocci, canker, yeast infections, thrush, bacteria like ecoli, respiratory bacteria, hexamita just to name a few. ok you cant identify what bacteria it is without growing a culture but it allows you to see an increase in bacteria early before its to late, thats when you avian vet comes into play to tackle that and identify it for you.

 

Cocci is good example, if you have a dry loft you shouldnt get a problem with it, but you get an increase in it through stress and bad management microscope use can help you look else where, ie you own management etc if you are have constant problem with cocci.

But its up to everyone if they want to learn and you cant force any one, But to me its one of the best things i have ever done and i continue to study pigeon health as i have a huge interest in it. but its my choice.

 

 

Jas.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest strapper]

as some might know ;)ive been interested in the health of my birds for a long time,the money ive spent over the years on test for this and that is a pretty lot...sometimes you have to use a vet...i know my limitations.

the money i will save will pay for the microscope and items needed.

i consider myself above a novice in the knowledge i know, but theres always someone better around the corner.

 

funny how in school i wanted to be a vet(didnt know anything about the birds then)but went into the building trade when i left...so im reliving my schoolboy dreams..or should i say fantasies  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

[Bugsy]

Few years ago a friend of mine who was a relative novice started to test his own droppings, I was very sceptical at the time but we agreed to test him. Over a two year period I had my droppings tested 6 times by the vet and each time I gave my mate a similar sample, the tests done by both produced the same results and my mate was self taught by reading books on the subject. My mate could identify if there was worms, cocci or canker, the only issue for him was diagnosing the level of trouble in terms of high or low count but I would be sure if he went on the same course as Jas then he would have developed that skill as well.

         Jas, I will be round next year with the dropping samples and make sure the biscuit barrel is full !!!!!!!

 

John B.

[Fair Play]

Type in "Avian vets directory" there are a few on there

[pj1001]

We have used Northern Hygiene Laboratories fror our dropping and swab tests for over 10 years now and generally I would say that they provide a very good service.

 

They are DEFRA certified and carry out tests for the food industry, the water industry as well as a number of other specialised test.

 

They a have staff specifically employed  for pigeon related testing and charge approx £25-£30 for a full set of tests for cocci , canker, worms, salmonella etc based on dropping and swabs

 

 

I have included their address below

 

Northern Hygiene Laboratories

Thorpe House

Driffield,  North Humberside,  YO25 9DJ

England

 

Phone: 01377241945

Fax: 01377241910

[dwh]

quite agree with you but does'nt pigeons carry cocci all the time  its only when the count is high you ave a problem!

sorry old yellow to disagree with on some over counter meds if the bottle says 10% either way its 10%

[mark proctor]

 

you say half of over counter medications dont work , the reason for this is one the bigs are been treated blindly so could be inefective and two most over the counter medications are half strength so to get good effective treatment you would need to see a good avian vet

 

thats what i was trying to explain mark....got to see a good vet if we need the right stuff ( antis)...this year asyou no my young birds had a bad case of resportery..i tried every product i xcould get my hands on...i wont go there as it will take me all day to right them down,,anyway i send droppings of to a vet and swabs the results came back respo....a weeks cause of antis and there perfect now...and thats after spending at least £200 of crap from differebnt shops all over the country...anyway stop moaning..lol...how are you?

[holmsidelofts]

Few years ago a friend of mine who was a relative novice started to test his own droppings, I was very sceptical at the time but we agreed to test him. Over a two year period I had my droppings tested 6 times by the vet and each time I gave my mate a similar sample, the tests done by both produced the same results and my mate was self taught by reading books on the subject. My mate could identify if there was worms, cocci or canker, the only issue for him was diagnosing the level of trouble in terms of high or low count but I would be sure if he went on the same course as Jas then he would have developed that skill as well.

         Jas, I will be round next year with the dropping samples and make sure the biscuit barrel is full !!!!!!!

 

John B.

 

I look forward to it mate but i make a lousy cupper.

 

Jas.

 

[Guest Owen]

Over the years I have had a lot to do with Vets. Some of my experiences were very bad indeed. I have been known to get very angry at some of the incompetence I have had to put up with.

Years ago I decided to learn for myself. First it was courses to do with the sheep, and I went on from there. At one time I ran a lambing and calving service for the local farmers. And you can take it from me that the farmers who used me did'nt do it because they wanted to give me their money. They did it because the Vets were often unreliable and I cared to get things right.

Since I have had the pigeons I have carried on in the same vein. I have learned to do these things because I want to give my own birds the best of care. The fact that I've been able to help other people has been their good luck. And long may it continue.

And Roland you are miles away from the truth. Wake up man.

[Roland]

Holmsidelofts I hope you are not drawing a whim out the air when you spout because ‘I’  don't know how to use one, for that is taking a line to draw a universe for sure  :-/ Or do you if ‘Some’ can't use it properly it doesn’t mean others can’t. I'd agree with that.

Firstly you state that one should go on a course, Quote ' ............. That’s why you need to go a course with a qualified vet like i and other have done and get proper training, £40 is all it cost for a days course with one of the top avian vets in the country, ...'

This I take it then that you agree too many don't and should therefore by that very admission you verify my sentiments entirely.

But you know the '.... hairworm, round worm, cocci, canker, yeast infections, thrush, bacteria like ecoli, respiratory bacteria, hexamita just to name a few.' that you quote are nigh commonsense sydromes, where most know without a £350 Micro job.

However I take your point on board that Micro’s are in themselves helpful in controlling these. Even if most have clear tell - tale signs.

Was conflabing with a University Honoury Doc that deals with avian and such ailments etc. They have the 'Dogs Ears' when it comes to equipment, yet they are limited.

MANY diseases look similar. Some are secondary to the first symptom that shows up, but not the parasite one that masks it's self very well.

So on that point I agree somewhat with you, that if one does invest in a Micro etc. it is foolhardy not to take a course and learn as much as you can. Indeed the pluses will no doubt out weigh the downers. Then again one must always be ready fot the Avian vet at times to help out.

Fot the real nastiest - like the Salmonella’s strains take a time for even them to pin point.

No Micro will help there and that’s for sure.