owen i dont agree with the part where you say a bird bought for stock should of shined as a racer ive found that in a nest of 2 hens sometimes one races very well and the others no good the one who races doesnt leave anything behind of any worth but the bad racer breeds good birds an old saying ive heard a lot is that when raceing/training all your y/bs you generally lose your best breeders and retain your best racers obviously some are duel, and both breed and race well you will also find that birds are bred off good birds solely for stock sometimes brother to sister then crossed off them to produce racers this i know to be fact, for some very good long distance fanciers