pjc

Rab, i've got some hatching and due to hatch you are welcome to. My wife is coming to Edinburgh on 15th June so could meet you enroute or we will be by Avimore the following weekend. Phil

lib epsom 8.10, clocked 11.14.21 vel 1511.098

congrats! Phil

South West Wales Fed at Epsom Lib 8.10 in strong South East wind.

good luck, you will have a tail wind though if you get a liberation.

its a bit early in the season to be upto 200m, the winds are still on the cold side! Phil

you still looking for your hat webmaster?

I have been rattleing cages David, don't worry this one won't be dropped! Unfortunatly as a sport Amtrak are currently the only nationwide couriers of Pigeons, Interlink used to but stopped a few years ago so effectively they have the manopoly and fanciers over a barrel! Phil

This was the e-mail response from Amtrak:- Good Afternoon Mr Crawford We apologise for the situation you have had regarding this delivery, however, I'm sure that the driver had no deliberate intention of hitting any kind of object, due to what may have been unforeseen circumstances regarding the accident, in which our driver was involved in. Unfortunately, as the birds were alive when you received them we are unable to send out a claims form as they were not physically injured during the accident and they were not deceased upon arrival at your home address. You may however wish to speak to our Credit Control as ************* have an account with Amtrak so you may be able to have your delivery charge re-imbursed. May I apologise once again on behalf of Amtrak. Regards Ann Claims Advisor I would like to know what experience they have to assess the birds would not have been stressed or suffered internal injury's caused by the accident? Phil

I am not prepared to let this go. I am starting to gather evidence, we have kept the boxes etc. The sender is also disgusted with them and is also now on the case as they have a very large account with Amtrak. They seem to have no duty of care and what the say goes, if they don't feel you have a claim they won't even send out a claim form! I will await further responses today and as much as I dislike them may even consider involving the RSPB and RSPCA to take up the case. Phil

It should be built into the union rules regarding advetising and selling birds as is sellers details etc. Anybody advertising should be stating details as per rules anyway!

Spot on Les! I can recall a few years ago a very well known fancier was having a clearence sale, he had a couple of pages in the BHW with hundreds of results. Some birds haveing many 1st's, 2nd's etc and then alot with 2nd, 3rd beaten by loft mates. There were no details of the races, birdage, clubs etc. A very good friend of his questioned him about all his claims knowing he hadn't won what was claimed to be told they were positions back to the loft! Funny enough every bird sold very quickly! Always ask questions of the vendor before parting with money and if you don't get honest answers then keep your money in your pockets! Phil

I know they issue collection notes but I can't remember having any delivery notes for last few delivery's!

you realy don't want to know!

Our stall traps are fitted in flights, the birds spend most of the day in there getting the benefit of a sputnik but also below the stalls we have the opening which is the same size as our baskets so we just put the basket in the opening and drive the birds in for training. This way we can basket 100 yb's in a couple of minutes. Phil

prob is a lot of couriers use the electronic sig pads and don't issue del notes.

Stall trap every time as you don't upset the young birds by catching them each time. I know ETS will do away with all these in time! Phil

I will see if I can print there conditions from web site as I don't think they gave him a delivery note.

David you be careful, you will be totaly hooked soon! Pigeonnovice, have a look on notice board and read "pigeon in my kitchen" and you'll see Davids story and all the work he has done for a long lost pigeon. Phil

it depends what type of grit and what type of grit pots, some absorbs moisture and open pots can be soiled so I prefer to give it fresh daily to prevent wastage. Phil

thats the problem, there is no way of measuring stress caused, if the birds won't eat its clearly through stress and trauma. But Amtraks stance is they were alive when delivered!

I am going to seek advice because they must surely be expected to offer a reasonable level of care with livestock! The boxes had clearly been in an accident and the new boxes are not as strong as they old ones! Phil

there response has been pathetic and alll they sugest is that we contact the sender and we may get the carriage refunded! 1 dead already and another 4 I can't surviving but because they were alive when delivered its not there problem and they are not interested! Phil

how old are the young birds and how long have they been going out? Do they have a flutter up onto the loft or just walk around? What and how are you feeding them? Phil

I have just come back from my partners, he was expecting a delivery of young birds yesterday so I wanted to have a look. They were collected from the vendor on tues as arranged, yesterday lunchtime he received a call from Amtrak to say they had the birds at the depot and the driver had hit a tree could we collect? The depot is a 3 hr round trip from here so they were told no, they would need to deliver. The birds turned up at 4pm in the Amtrak new flimsy boxes very battered and torn! The boxes were opened and the birds were all still alive, but this morning 1 has died and others are not looking happy, to me they are stressed and traumatised! Has anybody had similar problem with injury caused by Amtrak and been succesful in making a claim against them? Phil