pjc Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 There has been a lot of discussion surrounding clubs and feds imposing time penalty's for people using ETS. The following should clarify the issue to show no time penalty may be imposed! ETS OVERWHELMINGLY APPROVED BY RPRA MEMBERS AT AGM - NO TIME PENALTIES- ONLY 3 PADS PER LOFT Friday 29th February saw the 114th annual general meeting of the RPRA. The top table for the RPRA at the AGM changed. It is congratulations to Les Blacklock from the Cumbria Region as he was voted in as President. Pat Mitchell remains as vice president along with Brian Mead and John Edwards. Congratulations to them all. As far as voting on the propositions was concerned this time last year members voted not to accept ETS for racing but at the following Council meeting Councillors had to address the Disability Discrimination Act and ETS was introduced under rule 142. The voting this year then would be a test to see if the membership endorsed the actions of Council and they have done overwhelmingly. Several of the propositions were passed unanimously by all regions and so I hope now that we can draw a line under all the debate and get on racing our pigeons. There were several propositions to introduce time penalties for those users of ETS and these were all defeated. Council went further to make the case clear at their evening meeting – Rule 189 clearly states that results are based on actual flying time and so time penalties for anyone using any clock are in contravention of RPRA rules. There were some other key rule changes. One proposition that fell was that of the number of pads allowable at the loft. The current rule is 3 pads per loft and this will stand for 2008. The joining together of say 2 antennae pads by a cable to make a 6 antennae ‘pad’ is not acceptable; this is deemed as 3 pads. The rules passed at this AGM will be published in full as soon as possible for all to see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIGEON_MAN Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 There has been a lot of discussion surrounding clubs and feds imposing time penalty's for people using ETS. The following should clarify the issue to show no time penalty may be imposed! ETS OVERWHELMINGLY APPROVED BY RPRA MEMBERS AT AGM - NO TIME PENALTIES- ONLY 3 PADS PER LOFT Friday 29th February saw the 114th annual general meeting of the RPRA. The top table for the RPRA at the AGM changed. It is congratulations to Les Blacklock from the Cumbria Region as he was voted in as President. Pat Mitchell remains as vice president along with Brian Mead and John Edwards. Congratulations to them all. As far as voting on the propositions was concerned this time last year members voted not to accept ETS for racing but at the following Council meeting Councillors had to address the Disability Discrimination Act and ETS was introduced under rule 142. The voting this year then would be a test to see if the membership endorsed the actions of Council and they have done overwhelmingly. Several of the propositions were passed unanimously by all regions and so I hope now that we can draw a line under all the debate and get on racing our pigeons. There were several propositions to introduce time penalties for those users of ETS and these were all defeated. Council went further to make the case clear at their evening meeting – Rule 189 clearly states that results are based on actual flying time and so time penalties for anyone using any clock are in contravention of RPRA rules. There were some other key rule changes. One proposition that fell was that of the number of pads allowable at the loft. The current rule is 3 pads per loft and this will stand for 2008. The joining together of say 2 antennae pads by a cable to make a 6 antennae ‘pad’ is not acceptable; this is deemed as 3 pads. The rules passed at this AGM will be published in full as soon as possible for all to see. Could never understand how by joining x amount of the UNIKON pads together it could be classed as one,definatly a stab in the back for them with the new ruling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjc Posted March 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 it was always 3 sensor/antenna's but as normal people try to bend the rules, i.e joining them! I was at Doncaster last year and Unikon agent was happy to sell an unsuspecting fancier as many pads as he wanted with no mention of the 3 ruleing, in fact I beleive he bought 6! Another poor fancier ripped off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIGEON_MAN Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 it was always 3 sensor/antenna's but as normal people try to bend the rules, i.e joining them! I was at Doncaster last year and Unikon agent was happy to sell an unsuspecting fancier as many pads as he wanted with no mention of the 3 ruleing, in fact I beleive he bought 6! Another poor fancier ripped off! Up until this meeting the ruling did not effect the Unikon system you could have as many pads as you wanted because they said by joining them together counted as 1 so the 3 pad ruling didn,t apply to Unikon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest karl adams Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 was the ets introduced for disablity Discrimination Act if so how come any 1 can use it should it be for Disabed people onley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edthekid Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i agree...still very confused whats the point of the disability act?....im not against it...but should be clear why ..when ...what.....my club have made it crystal if this comes to my club look for a new sec..and clock setter..? hows that for discrimination...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsberg Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 was the ets introduced for disablity Discrimination Act if so how come any 1 can use it should it be for Disabed people onley my thoughts on this is that the disability discrimination act works both ways if only disabled fanciers can use it then you are discriminating against the able bodied fanciers who want to use it, me i will stick to my t3 until such time as my club decide to use ets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylorsloft Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 U DONT HAVE TO WAIT FOR YOUR CLUB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsberg Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i know but there are 14 members in the club who dont want to use ets so i dont want to upset the apple cart so to speak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wba_paddy Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 the old man is 80% blind and thats on a good day.for many years now when he clocked in he always took between 20 to 25 seconds to clock in. so if he had a pigeon go into his loft 5 seconds before any one else and some who flew to a supertrap had 5 pigeons go in 5 seconds latter he would finish 6th.now he is as fast as every one else.the e.t.s has been a long time coming.its about personal choice if you wont it get it if not dont. because if your pigeons are fast enough it does not matter what you fly on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rembrant2coo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Still dont understand why you are allowed to use 3 pads and only 1 clock it does seem to be giving ets rather an advantage The bird is timed in when it hits the pad if i got it correct so basically i would presume it is equivalant to a clock so how come im only allowed to have only 1 clock set to time in on under RPRA rules if the rules for clocks and ets were put on the same level i would have 1 pad and any birds that were racing to a different loft that didnt have the pad would have to be taken over and put across the pad which would make it the same as me having to take my clock from one loft to another to time in rose is correct in what she says if you use three pads why can,t you use three clocks one for each loft that you have instead of carrying from loft to loft each time you time,rpra rules you have one clock set per race ,what your saying is that you have three pads set for one race ,do you think thats fair , to me it looks like you have a big advantage in my book and your able to spread them out when they are all connected up and your talking about discrimination as far as i could see your being greedy and people who are like that want more,more ,and more , that is not an equal playing field at all ,everybody should be made equal but i,m afraid that will never happen in our sport there is allways someone looking to get one over the rest, another rule is that all pads must be sealed inside the loft , how many abide with that rule i wonder and break the rules or does your secy check each and everyone to see that its adhered to it would be very interesting just to find out , (oh to be a fly on the wall) HAVE GOOD RACING IN 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE FIFER Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 you have 3 pads but only 1 clock, its the clock that you set not the pads, and with ets RPRA rules you are limited to your number of bird entry but with a conventional clock you can have stall traps with as many entries as you want, also you can take your clock from loft to loft you can carry it with you but with ets your 3 pads are fixed and you cant move them, so who really has the advantage if you are flying to more than 1 loft or compartments, ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest valiant Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 you have 3 pads but only 1 clock, its the clock that you set not the pads, and with ets RPRA rules you are limited to your number of bird entry but with a conventional clock you can have stall traps with as many entries as you want, also you can take your clock from loft to loft you can carry it with you but with ets your 3 pads are fixed and you cant move them, so who really has the advantage if you are flying to more than 1 loft or compartments, ??? well said fifer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest karl adams Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 if i park my car on a Disabed car parking space and i have no card to say i am Disabed i would be fined or clampt if you are Disabed you get a card to prove you are Disabed and you would have to show it as proof to get any disablity benifits so if ets is for the Disabed should they not have to show there disablity card to allow them to use it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spin cycle Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i agree...still very confused whats the point of the disability act?....im not against it...but should be clear why ..when ...what.....my club have made it crystal if this comes to my club look for a new sec..and clock setter..? hows that for discrimination...lol ets is a 'club killer' for this very reason. clubs with under 25 members should be allowed to opt out . likewise progressive clubs should be able to opt out of membership rules to enable them to get lottery grants . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE FIFER Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 if i park my car on a Disabed car parking space and i have no card to say i am Disabed i would be fined or clampt if you are Disabed you get a card to prove you are Disabed and you would have to show it as proof to get any disablity benifits so if ets is for the Disabed should they not have to show there disablity card to allow them to use it its passed for use by all members, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest karl adams Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i think proof of disablity should be shown to use ets if its been set out as Disability Discrimination Act Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i think proof of disablity should be shown to use ets if its been set out as Disability Discrimination Act Where was it ever written or said that ETS was for disabled only ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edthekid Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 looks like is here to stay................yo con like it or yo con lump it as they say in dudley......................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest karl adams Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i will look into the Disability Discrimination Act and laws as to see what it means Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlsberg Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 i think proof of disablity should be shown to use ets if its been set out as Disability Discrimination Act like i said before discrimination works both ways if you dont want to use it then dont , i wont be using it till my club wants to use it ,that way nobody is pressured into using it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ch pied Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 the , DDA was used to bring ets in the back door , the money men had barrister's lined up to take the rpra to the cleanner's . i still want a loft vote , if its voted in that it , if its voted out , i will box mine and stick it in the cupboard , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 ]the , DDA was used to bring ets in the back door [/color], the money men had barrister's lined up to take the rpra to the cleanner's . i still want a loft vote , if its voted in that it , if its voted out , i will box mine and stick it in the cupboard , That's the way it happened in england , not up here in Scotland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjc Posted March 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Just accept it! No club can be forced to use it, it is up to them and as it says in the rules if a member turns up with ETS and the club doesn't have the equiptment then ETS doesn't have to be accepted! It is now down to clubs to decide if they want it or not so surely they can make a democratic descision as to wether they want it or not! Whats wrong with that? Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest spin cycle Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Just accept it! No club can be forced to use it, it is up to them and as it says in the rules if a member turns up with ETS and the club doesn't have the equiptment then ETS doesn't have to be accepted! It is now down to clubs to decide if they want it or not so surely they can make a democratic descision as to wether they want it or not! Whats wrong with that? Phil nothing but i'm not sure thats the case.some ets come with a free club unit to the first purchaser,so clubs will have the equip. also the phrase'and willing to do so' was deleted by council at agm.why do this unless there is to be compulsion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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