Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 who could i call ghostbusters ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabuteo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 One of these days you will poison a bird/raptor and it will belong to a wildlife officer or a normal copper and then you will really come undone so you are trying to tar us pigeon fanciers as the same as these people who done this ,how would it be of an eagle owl took one of your precious birds when you were flying it how would you behave shrugg your shoulders and say thats nature ????? In a word, "yes". This is what we were trying to say a few posts back. We also run the risk of one of our birds being taken whilst out flying. be it a wild perigrine stooping a hawk or a spar taking someones Kestral. This is the nature of the sport. Luckily we can insure our birds and recover some of the costs, but not all of it, but then we are paying an extra premium over the price of the bird, if it be a £400 hawk or falcon or a specialised species of hawk falcon at £5,000. It can all end in a crumpled heap of feathers. We are not the enemy, as already stated...............we follow a similar path with the welfare and husbandry we prectice on a daily basis. The jibes should be directed towards the |Government 7 the agencies supplying the twisted fact, then maybe you would get a legalised controlled cull or live capture to remove the species imediatlly harmfull to your sport/practice. But it comes back to songbirds in and around the garden & man taking ove r the countryside, the animals don't know any different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabuteo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 who could i call like your own birds, captive bred raptors have ring numbers, if you get a hold of one. failing that, contact the police wildlife liason officer or nearest RSPCA or any raptor flier that you may of heard of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 In a word, "yes". This is what we were trying to say a few posts back. We also run the risk of one of our birds being taken whilst out flying. be it a wild perigrine stooping a hawk or a spar taking someones Kestral. This is the nature of the sport. Luckily we can insure our birds and recover some of the costs, but not all of it, but then we are paying an extra premium over the price of the bird, if it be a £400 hawk or falcon or a specialised species of hawk falcon at £5,000. It can all end in a crumpled heap of feathers. We are not the enemy, as already stated...............we follow a similar path with the welfare and husbandry we prectice on a daily basis. The jibes should be directed towards the |Government 7 the agencies supplying the twisted fact, then maybe you would get a legalised controlled cull or live capture to remove the species imediatlly harmfull to your sport/practice. But it comes back to songbirds in and around the garden & man taking ove r the countryside, the animals don't know any different. and some pigeons worth more than that get killed and nothing can be claimed back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammy Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 ghostbusters ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptor Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 what i am saying as a pigeon fancier i dont and if you know of who they are name and shame them, then Fair comment......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IB Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 I also don't understand where you are picking up that this thread is about harming birds of prey. It started out as a catalogue of attacks with pictures of the outcomes. It developed into methods to deter attacks on pigeon lofts. Its full of stuff about deterrants - shiny CDs on front of lofts, playing eagle owl call CDs for one hour prior to letting the pigeons out, firing rockets to deter peregrine attacks - even pigeon race transporters have tried this, and the latest we have is flashing lights, red / yellow road warning lights in the garden ... etc. We've also been told about Oriental flying rollers that no hawk can catch, no matter how hard or often they try so they hunt elsewhere etc etc. What advice have you falconers to offer on deterrants - (a) for lofts targetted by sparrowhwaks, ( by pigeon transporters targetted by peregrines at liberation.. And a question that you can maybe help with; what is a sparrowhawks' and a peregrines' hearing & sense of smell like? Can the peregrine smell a pigeon transporter at X miles or is it hearing or seeing the pigeons or just seeing the vehicle and recognising it in some way for what it is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptor Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 and some pigeons worth more than that get killed and nothing can be claimed back But you know that when you release them surely? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 But you know that when you release them surely? does that make it all right for them to be ripped to bits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SakerSam Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 and some pigeons worth more than that get killed and nothing can be claimed back Tammy help us to udersand something; you say and we know that some of your birds are worth thousands. Do you not insure your birds like we do? All my birds are insured for £1500 of vets fees etc. a year, plus the value of the bird through death. As I said previously, my birds have been 'attacked' and here is a short clip of one such time so I guess some of you will enjoy it. I was cacking myself but I had to except that if the worse happened, then as much as I would be deeply hurt and devastated, I would know that it was a chance 'we' took. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptor Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 I also don't understand where you are picking up that this thread is about harming birds of prey. It started out as a catalogue of attacks with pictures of the outcomes. It developed into methods to deter attacks on pigeon lofts. Its full of stuff about deterrants - shiny CDs on front of lofts, playing eagle owl call CDs for one hour prior to letting the pigeons out, firing rockets to deter peregrine attacks - even pigeon race transporters have tried this, and the latest we have is flashing lights, red / yellow road warning lights in the garden ... etc. We've also been told about Oriental flying rollers that no hawk can catch, no matter how hard or often they try so they hunt elsewhere etc etc. What advice have you falconers to offer on deterrants - (a) for lofts targetted by sparrowhwaks, ( by pigeon transporters targetted by peregrines at liberation.. And a question that you can maybe help with; what is a sparrowhawks' and a peregrines' hearing & sense of smell like? Can the peregrine smell a pigeon transporter at X miles or is it hearing or seeing the pigeons or just seeing the vehicle and recognising it in some way for what it is? Birds of prey hyave no sense of smell................... hearing is not used by hawks and falcons in the main..........mainly by owls.................. Hawks and falcons use their eyesight which is very acute to see quarry.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptor Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 does that make it all right for them to be ripped to bits Simply.....NO........ but as you know it happens.............. so what I am saying again is once released into the air they are and always will be under threat if they pass over a falcons hunting ground........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabuteo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 all stand together you say well pigeon fancier have been standing alone for the past 15/20 years on this issue of birds of prey ,whats up is the heat now on you guys who keep these birds and now yous want US pigeon fanciers support yous The US Pigeon scene was at the front of the spotlight not so long back. The Birmmingham Roller men were caught with parts of poisened raptors, shot etc and it went to Federal Court, leaving them open to prosecution of a sentence and many many thousands of dollars of a fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TAMMY_1 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Tammy help us to udersand something; you say and we know that some of your birds are worth thousands. Do you not insure your birds like we do? All my birds are insured for £1500 of vets fees etc. a year, plus the value of the bird through death. As I said previously, my birds have been 'attacked' and here is a short clip of one such time so I guess some of you will enjoy it. I was cacking myself but I had to except that if the worse happened, then as much as I would be deeply hurt and devastated, I would know that it was a chance 'we' took. have never heard of any place that will insure racing pigeons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SakerSam Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 You could get kites of raptors which attach to poles and only need very little breeze. They are of various raptors and look quite realistic. your birds may in the begining be a litle spooked. Failing that, can you not build enclosures that are fully enclosed? I also don't understand where you are picking up that this thread is about harming birds of prey. It started out as a catalogue of attacks with pictures of the outcomes. It developed into methods to deter attacks on pigeon lofts. Its full of stuff about deterrants - shiny CDs on front of lofts, playing eagle owl call CDs for one hour prior to letting the pigeons out, firing rockets to deter peregrine attacks - even pigeon race transporters have tried this, and the latest we have is flashing lights, red / yellow road warning lights in the garden ... etc. We've also been told about Oriental flying rollers that no hawk can catch, no matter how hard or often they try so they hunt elsewhere etc etc. What advice have you falconers to offer on deterrants - (a) for lofts targetted by sparrowhwaks, ( by pigeon transporters targetted by peregrines at liberation.. And a question that you can maybe help with; what is a sparrowhawks' and a peregrines' hearing & sense of smell like? Can the peregrine smell a pigeon transporter at X miles or is it hearing or seeing the pigeons or just seeing the vehicle and recognising it in some way for what it is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammy Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 The US Pigeon scene was at the front of the spotlight not so long back. The Birmmingham Roller men were caught with parts of poisened raptors, shot etc and it went to Federal Court, leaving them open to prosecution of a sentence and many many thousands of dollars of a fine. in case yi dont know this happens to be britain not america Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SakerSam Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Would they be classed as exotics or is that just parrots, finches etc.? I'm suprised there isn't any insurance for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabuteo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 and some pigeons worth more than that get killed and nothing can be claimed back Well surely the pigeon organisation as a group can get something set up in event of this happening? I'm just asking a question? Probably like your pigeons, the raptors can go up to medium 5 figured sums, depending on bloodlines etc. Another example. Someone just week back was flying their goss hawk, when it was brought down accidentally be a shotgun. The guy was gutted as this was a very good bloodline & future breeded/donor. The shooter was spoken to & the falconer had to walk away......with no recompense. As i said earlier, we are in the same boat. Maybe not as often as you guys, but its the government/DEFRA and these money grabbing agencies that are filling the Govt's departments with all their false numbers. The sporting association that i am a member of, activly fight for a reintroduction of controlled culls for the game estates up here in scotland, but it has to be in a controlled mannerism or we end up with a case like the Golden Eagle that was poisened in the Scottish Borders in August. you said earlier about all raptors being killed, would you honestly like to see something as beautifull killed, for what reason, as it harms nothing other that the blue hare or feeding on already dead live stock & is an icon to the UK. I can accept the raptors that target your birds, as being controlled, but not every bird of prey. Otherwise you are condoning mass killing & why then as people, do we get our backs up about what the Nazi's done to the Jews in WW2. It is still eradication be it birds or the ultimate predator, MAN! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 You could get kites of raptors which attach to poles and only need very little breeze. They are of various raptors and look quite realistic. your birds may in the begining be a litle spooked. Failing that, can you not build enclosures that are fully enclosed? And how are you supposed to train racing pigeons in "enclosures"? Do you seriously think none of these methods have been tried ie plastic owls,kites etc?,you know damn well they don't work for more than a week tops! And why on earth a raptor enthusiast would want to join a pigeon forum is beyond me unless their intention was to antagonise people Have you nothing better to do? Sure no one on here is remotely interested in you and your murdering pets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabuteo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 in case yi dont know this happens to be britain not america Yeah, but you mentioned something about the US scene. Sorry if i picked you up incorrectly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammy Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Yeah, but you mentioned something about the US scene. Sorry if i picked you up incorrectly. well you did pick me up incorrectly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parabuteo Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 I also don't understand where you are picking up that this thread is about harming birds of prey. It started out as a catalogue of attacks with pictures of the outcomes. It developed into methods to deter attacks on pigeon lofts. Its full of stuff about deterrants - shiny CDs on front of lofts, playing eagle owl call CDs for one hour prior to letting the pigeons out, firing rockets to deter peregrine attacks - even pigeon race transporters have tried this, and the latest we have is flashing lights, red / yellow road warning lights in the garden ... etc. We've also been told about Oriental flying rollers that no hawk can catch, no matter how hard or often they try so they hunt elsewhere etc etc. What advice have you falconers to offer on deterrants - (a) for lofts targetted by sparrowhwaks, ( by pigeon transporters targetted by peregrines at liberation.. And a question that you can maybe help with; what is a sparrowhawks' and a peregrines' hearing & sense of smell like? Can the peregrine smell a pigeon transporter at X miles or is it hearing or seeing the pigeons or just seeing the vehicle and recognising it in some way for what it is? Where we picked up on the killing, was a couple of members stupidly commented on the forum, in a post about what poison to use, where to put it on the decoy bird etc 7 this is what was flagged by the RSPB. You will now probably have BIG BrOTHER watching this forum now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank-123 Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 sorry to hear you are unhappy chrisss i think it is good they have taken the trouble to join our site maybe we may learn something from these guys parabuteo what is your thoughts on wild eagle owl's should they be captured and not be allowed there freedom in the uk? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chrisss Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 And how are you supposed to train racing pigeons in "enclosures"? Do you seriously think none of these methods have been tried ie plastic owls,kites etc?,you know damn well they don't work for more than a week tops! And why on earth a raptor enthusiast would want to join a pigeon forum is beyond me unless their intention was to antagonise people Have you nothing better to do? Sure no one on here is remotely interested in you and your murdering pets madam you are a godess [and more important 100% right :D ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammy Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Where we picked up on the killing, was a couple of members stupidly commented on the forum, in a post about what poison to use, where to put it on the decoy bird etc 7 this is what was flagged by the RSPB. You will now probably have BIG BrOTHER watching this forum now. you seem to quote the rspb you have done it a few times me thinks you are one yir self Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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