Should it be P.O.B.

[Guest Owen]

jimmy_bulger

you are right of course. Perhaps we need a fund to be used in the event of one of our mates getting caught up with the law. I think it is time we took the gloves off and took some positive action.

I know that there are some who will think that it does not apply to them because the peregrine is not taking their birds. If the birds are sent to races they will pass over areas that have peregrines hunting in them. Where I live is an example. I had a bird returning from Metz last Saturday, he had a matter of a few hundred yards to reach my loft and a peregrine dived at him. Luckily, he was approaching a group of trees and used them as a means of escape. Can you imagine how I would have felt if I had seen him taken after completing a journey like that.

The latest problem we have here are the falcons hunting in family groups. They are teaching the young to hunt. When they cut a young pigeon out from a bunch, it has no chance against a group of them. The parents keep it up, by flying under it and the youngsters take turns at trying to catch it. Worse still when they do catch it they will kill it and drop it to the ground. Often biting the head off and letting it fall separately. Sometimes they play pass the pacel with the dead pigeon. They drop it for another to catch and they will do it over and over again. While this game is going on they scream making a heck of a noise. And when they have had enough they drop the body and go off after another victim.

The one positive thing we can do is to identify where they take their catches to pluck and eat them. Now that is where they are vulnerable. And for the RSBP spies the sites they choose are normally well away from their nest site and are often changed. Best of all, these sites are quite easy to identify, because they have feathers everywhere and heads and legs are scattered all over the area. It is a sickening sight if you like any sort of bird, not just pigeons.  

[jimmy_bulger]

i for one can speak from experiance as to the bop prob.

i live on the main road in the town centre of kirkby and i have not had my stock birds out since july 2008 because i was getting hit every day.

i had a visitor here on wednesday a member off this site he came to see the stock birds and set up and he handled the only 12 birds i have left including the survivors of raptor attacks.

am sure he is of the same oppinion as the majority of us ie:summit needs doing now not later.

and fk the do gooders

[BLACK W F]

Roland there has been some really good constructive posts and many have merit  but to be relistic  jimmy bulger has hit the nail on the head  lets walk first then we can move forward as already  just my thoughts cheers Alan

[Roland]

 

Yep BW/F

Thanks Merlin, Owen and all.

I must say, and I don't wish to belittle any and all the other elements that have been brought out in regards of your’ views. The many other things this sport needs, or has a lack of.

Yet I sometime feel that we are in danger losing sight of our first, and what I regard, main objective. That is the threat, the real threat to our fancy, namely the B.O.P. We must walk before we run surely.

If this very real threat isn't controlled, slowed up, then everything else may well become irrelevant in any case.

I agree

[jimmy_bulger]

if we look after us first ( the pigeon fancier ) then we be in a better position to help all those worhty causes that the pigeon fanciers have helped for the last 30 years plus.

jmo

[jimmy_bulger]

and by the way i thought this thread would be open to everyone visitors included to gain more support.

[Guest TAMMY_1]

Roland,

you have my suport in your attempts to do something/anything.

Cocker,

you are a damn fool and it is time you decided where you stand on these issues. I see people like you opposing the efforts of the Trade Unions to maintain standards for out workers. I also see people ignoring the fact the people laid down their lives to protect our independence and giving away our heritage when it is not their's to give.

I hope I don't have to listen to the likes of you trying to water down the carnage these overprotected carnivors are enjoying at our expense.

I don't know if Roland will succeed, but he should be given all the suport possible. It is more like Roland we want at the top end of our sport. The ones we have now are weaklings as I see it.

 

fully agree, Roland deserves all the support from every member on here, so that should be over 5,000 if all give their support and that is a good start.good luck Roland

[Cocker]

Roland,

you have my suport in your attempts to do something/anything.

Cocker,

you are a damn fool and it is time you decided where you stand on these issues. I see people like you opposing the efforts of the Trade Unions to maintain standards for out workers. I also see people ignoring the fact the people laid down their lives to protect our independence and giving away our heritage when it is not their's to give.

I hope I don't have to listen to the likes of you trying to water down the carnage these overprotected carnivors are enjoying at our expense.

I don't know if Roland will succeed, but he should be given all the suport possible. It is more like Roland we want at the top end of our sport. The ones we have now are weaklings as I see it.

 

Hi Owen,

              I really do think you should engage your brain before opening your mouth. You choose to do a character assasination job on me  and yet we've never met.

You choose to describe me as a damn fool because I happen to have a different point of view from Roland, and probably many more of our esteemed members. I ask you, is this a good foundation with which to debate what is obviously a very emotive subject ?

Also owen, I'm at a complete loss to understand what the trade union movement has to do with anything. I've no doubt after reading your rant that this will come as a surprise to you. I was an active trade union member for most of my working life, indeed I also worked in an official capacity for a number of years, and although I'm now retired, I still keep in touch with some colleagues who are still active, both politically in the socialist movement, and in the trade union movement. So it would seem to me Owen that you are most certainly not the master of your subject when it comes to attacking me as an individual. As I have already stated, I am no expert, I wouldn't know one species of Hawk/Falcon from another, and yes I do fully understand the anger when any of us loose a bird in this manner, but my take on things is quite simply different from others. If you think that gives you the right to dish out personal abuse, then I would respectfully suggest that you draw back from the issue and allow someone with a more measured outlook to be your spokesperson. The aggressive bovver-boy attitude will achieve nothing .

 

From each according to his ability,

To each according to his needs

 

    ( Karl Marx )

 

All the very best,

 

Cocker.  

[Bilco]

Do not mention birds when writing to the Press about the RSPB, refer only to Avian Pit Bulls, or Avian Wolves. Meat eaters. Carnivores. Make the point that these birds exist only to kill and eat other birds. Let's change the public perception of this money making political society.

[Guest Owen]

I am very glad of the lesson that Cocker has attempted to dish out. Yes I am a boy, a rather old one these days, and yes I am bovvered by the attitude of those who should be trying to help us deal with a serious problem. The fact is that our birds are being eaten alive but also we are seeing the demise of many song birds that I think we have the right to enjoy. My need, in common with most pigeon fanciers, is to be able to keep and race my pigeons without them being targeted by birds of prey. We had 5 peregrines hunting over here the other day. They were teaching their young to hunt. And they deliberately targeted young pigeons to practice on. The female flew under the pigeon to keep it up there and the male helped the young ones to catch it. After they caught it they played pass the parcel for a while and disgarded it. The head was cut off and then the body was allowed to fall to the ground. Then off they went to chase another to have some more sport.

My point about the Trade Union was simply that there are working people out there trying to earn a wage and want to just go to work and do a good job. They certainly would not be interested in conflict and disorder. However, there are some who would have us believe that this should be something to debate and discuss. Meanwhile the situation is geting worse for those caught up in all this. They have, in common with pigeon fanciers, an urgent need of positive action to arrive at practical solutions. The time for us to discuss and debate is long over. The BOP are still there and are getting more plentyful as each year passes. We really must stick together and bring this thing to a point where meaningful discussions can take place.

I have replied to you Coker and I take my guidance from a better place the Karl Marks. For me the discussion ends here. I will try to use my energies to deal with the real problem. Those flying meat eating carnivors that have been imposed on us.    

[BLACK W F]

AS USUAL JIMMY BULGER HITS THE NAIL ON THE HEAD WE NEED TO HELP OUR SELVES BEFORE THERE IS NOTHING LEFT    WELL SAID JIMMY    BUT WHAT WOULD YOU EXPECT FROM AN EVERTON SUPPORTER

[Roland]

Do not mention birds when writing to the Press about the RSPB, refer only to Avian Pit Bulls, or Avian Wolves. Meat eaters. Carnivores. Make the point that these birds exist only to kill and eat other birds. Let's change the public perception of this money making political society.

 

Yes we do need to adopt an approach possible in that vien Bilco. First off, the Hirachy for want of a better word has to be put into place.

Have some good names already at hand. Waiting on others, and of course tomorrow to see if any others put up, or recommend va emailing me.

[Roland]

I see that Cocker is, or certainly is trying to antagonise. That is my opinion. He certainly isn't of our ilk; otherwise he wouldn’t dribble utter codswallop on here and then expect us to answer. I wouldn’t in the least be surprise if he weren’t a 'Eater of pigeon Flesh' keeper.

I have no truck with him, for I say as it is, it is as it appears.

This isn't a topic to take lightly, neither one to boo hoo our resolve, and certainly not under this heading is there room to smirk and say 'Your pigeons are getting eaten, so what! Get use to it'!

That for me was more than enough to wash my hands of his limited mentality.

Being hostile   :-/ :-/  No, just speaking realism and facts so 'Cocker' get use to that.

Cocker the term has two meanings not least and one to cock is 'Taking the Pee' as if he didn't know.

So I find both his remarks, him being even on here offensive to all and every pigeon lover and affront. Full stop.

Further it would be nice if the 'Mods' kept this particular topic clean from such interference and from one trying to sabotage this very thread. No more, no less, but to thrown in a spanner and lead it off subject and destroyed under a load of idiotic stupidity.

[Guest Owen]

Amen to that Roland.

[Guest]

Roland, ignore your critics, the message has been sent and the ball put in motion.  My honest opinion for what its worth is to focus on what we're good at and that's highlighting the plight of the pigeon, we can sub focus on the plight of other birds as a secondary cause.  We have the knowledge and ability to educate people on a subject matter we are expert at even if its a combined expertise.   Jimmy is spot on with regards to singing from the same song sheet and that we are our own enemy.   On that note Roland your aware as I am and several others that things are actually moving forward this time, perhaps forums aren't the best place to discuss things unitl we've put something tangible in front of people, perhaps then people might take us seriously.  

 

Finally, whilst we are forming this action group it might be wise not to discuss it on open forum because this is a fight, and its a fact that our enemies are reading this forum so why given them any insight into what our plans are.  Discretion and Stealth should be the way forward.

[weecunny]

think theres more to fix in the pigeon game than the hawks

[Roland]

Jargre, I see where you are coming from and agree.... However getting this up and running, getting certain Members / persons to put up and take action, to join us means that they need to know, and be able to discuss, bandy about a few ideas.

After say Tuesday, there will be certain things that have been put int place abd effect. Yes, then this topic can die off a bit. Just realistically report any and everything that they need to know.... the need to know of course will NOT be of any interest to the B.O.P. brigade and contingment / lap dogs and followers.

Yes such things as Fund - Raising and what not. then mostly what HAS been put into effect.

I hope that members can bear with this for a short while longer.

This is the most crucial part of the whole exercise. Yet I believe, feel, that this is by far the furthest any such as this has ever gotten. Again I believe that all those that have seen / heard would agree, and this time It mustn't fail.

[Guest numpty01]

com in place tresuer in place rpra and bhw in place agreements to man stalls in place 22 offers funds in place  i think that was quite far forward but i hope roland you succeed i spent time today discussing this matter with well known person with lots big names and money peaple and some of things he said were true about our problem and makeing the public sit up and take notice even with pr company involved and beleave me he knows and he made same comment as member on here take care smal matters then the big  :-/ :-/ :-/ :-/

[weecunny]

tracker wi u it be doomed

[Guest]

Jargre, I see where you are coming from and agree.... However getting this up and running, getting certain Members / persons to put up and take action, to join us means that they need to know, and be able to discuss, bandy about a few ideas.

After say Tuesday, there will be certain things that have been put int place abd effect. Yes, then this topic can die off a bit. Just realistically report any and everything that they need to know.... the need to know of course will NOT be of any interest to the B.O.P. brigade and contingment / lap dogs and followers.

Yes such things as Fund - Raising and what not. then mostly what HAS been put into effect.

I hope that members can bear with this for a short while longer.

This is the most crucial part of the whole exercise. Yet I believe, feel, that this is by far the furthest any such as this has ever gotten. Again I believe that all those that have seen / heard would agree, and this time It mustn't fail.

 

p.m sent.