crossing different families

[Guest Silverwings]

reading some of the posts on this forum ,it seems that some members cross breed with their birds and others line/inbreed their birds would be interesting to hear of any crosses that have worked out well ? and also the ones that failed ...ray

[Wiley]

the thing is crosses are very successful if you bring in a good cross, has to be the right line alot of research has to be done, if the two put together right its like a boiling pot full of soup, and the ingredients make it all tasty. I do crosses apon crosses to make my own gene pool.my lefebre dhaenens have crossed well with Frank Tasker birds,marcellis birds, Kirkland birds, Curtis wall and lunt birds, and many others cant even think at moment

[Ronnie]

I have three stock cocks i have bought in this year and also some nice hens and i am going to line breed them .I am aiming to make three strain's from three cocks i have bought hopefully they will produce the good's.The reason for three strains is so i can create my own cross as well when its needed.Obviously the real decider will be performance's of the offspring.On paper the cock's look the part(Ones sire won two netherlands national's as did the grandsire plus numerous other prize's).But thats on paper .I am looking at two years before i will really be able to tell if i am going the right way.

[Guest]

Hi Ronnie,

 

Crosses that have worked really well for me are;

Nachtegaele x Busschaert

Janssen x Mueleman

Busschaert x Wildemeersch

 

Crosses I know are working well for friends are;

Soontjen x Vandenabeele

Soontjen x Wildemeersch

Soontjen x Busschaert

Soontjen x Van Reet

 

Crosses that have not worked for me are infinite!!

[velo99]

 

  Silver,

Wrap your brain around this one. Before crossing any strains, consider WHY you are crossing. Is there something lacking in your birds? This should be done with a certain amount of caution. Remember you get good and bad traits when you introduce an unknown quantity into your loft.

The only reason I could think of is building a better bird, or a lack of specific traits in the strain you`re breeding now.

If it ain`t broke dont fix it.

 

jmho

[jimmy white]

i would recommend  crosses , , sometimes trial and error , sometimes hit it off , but feel the hybrid vigour is a must,,

[Guest]

Totally agree Jimmy, I think you have hit the nail on the head!

Crosses provide hybrid vigour!

[Roland]

They are all just Pigeons ... some have a better reason, more content and wish to be home, so the INSTINC more noticable. Line breeding and Incest are two completely different ways, but both need a Cross to gain results.  Yes some clesely bred work wonders, but one has just to see the Breeder Records of the so called 'Greats' to realise that it is very often the cross that does the Flying! More vigour. So simply if one wants a Father / Daughter etc. to keep the genes in the loft so to speak, fine, as many as you like... then cross then out, it's their young that will do the honours mostly.

[Ronnie]

They are all just Pigeons ... some have a better reason, more content and wish to be home, so the INSTINC more noticable. Line breeding and Incest are two completely different ways, but both need a Cross to gain results.  Yes some clesely bred work wonders, but one has just to see the Breeder Records of the so called 'Greats' to realise that it is very often the cross that does the Flying! More vigour. So simply if one wants a Father / Daughter etc. to keep the genes in the loft so to speak, fine, as many as you like... then cross then out, it's their young that will do the honours mostly.

 

what then Roland do you start the process all over again with outcross champion being the dominant male?

I'm aiming to create my own family of birds by line breeding and wondered if you start again or just carry on with the new outcrossed breed.

Lol i'm confusing myself

[Guest Silverwings]

  Silver,

Wrap your brain around this one. Before crossing any strains, consider WHY you are crossing. Is there something lacking in your birds? This should be done with a certain amount of caution. Remember you get good and bad traits when you introduce an unknown quantity into your loft.

The only reason I could think of is building a better bird, or a lack of specific traits in the strain you`re breeding now.

If it ain`t broke dont fix it.

 

jmho

hellob vello99 valid points in your reply as for my own birds they have no lack of vitality ,and i can't see anything about them that needs fixing ( see photographs in members photo's) but i firmly beleive that when i stop trying to improve upon what i already have, the interest for me in racing pigeons will have died ? as for crosses i find the first offspring from any new pairing tends to feature either one or the other parent to the extreme ? the 2nd and 3rd nest allways seem to be a better blend of the two! how this works out i am at a loss to explain ? some of the best  crossed birds i have seen have been from meulemens cocks onto  janssen hens .......... all good stuff

 

 

[Guest slugmonkey]

My formula is Grand Parent to grand child children, of this back to original bird, children of this back to grandparent, all the while these are raced with non performers culled. these inbreds are then bred out to birds bred the same from another family these birds are then bred back to cocks side of family

[mark]

there is not such a thing as a pure pigeon somewhere along the line it has been crossed. you only have to look at the great george busschaert, he used to swop birds with other people. so the bird could be called a busschaert but it could have delbar in there catttrese and any other strain that was around then. only my opinion though.

[DOVEScot]

I think am on to a winner here :D :D :D

[Guest]

mavs tip for tomorrow lol ;D

[maverick]

i wish that one is a least running

[Guest Greig the doo Drysdale]

my pigeons are from an old guy who gave up they are all mixed breeds apart from the few I have bought in so when I start winning more races what breed do I call them? Drysdale doos or what?

[westy]

i have croseed

putman x red fox janseen=work well as obs

putman x kirkpatrick =well as obs

 

but the full breeds on der own worked well as ybs but not aswell as obs

[mark]

the thing is crosses are very successful if you bring in a good cross, has to be the right line alot of research has to be done, if the two put together right its like a boiling pot full of soup, and the ingredients make it all tasty. I do crosses apon crosses to make my own gene pool.my lefebre dhaenens have crossed well with Frank Tasker birds,marcellis birds, Kirkland birds, Curtis wall and lunt birds, and many others cant even think at moment

 

so you fly the heinz strain wiley 57 different varieties. : : :

[Guest Greig the doo Drysdale]

 

so you fly the heinz strain wiley 57 different varieties. : : :

 

Thats what mine are aswell

[Ed Bourque]

I think the way mother nature intended, is the birds need to be outcrossed,

same thing as a cross just long distance, from new blood

[jimmy white]

the hybrid vigour  

[thunderboult]

i've had 3 yb winner's this year off meulemans cock paired with a de klak/van loon hen(full sister to kulpa bros 2nd open nfc 2004) also had a lot of good birds from busschaerts crossed with jansens+jan ardens

[Guest slugmonkey]

Get your 6 birds    

rotate hens ( 4-6 from each cock )

race them hard look at results - one hen or cock better, breed top achivers

do the same thing again next year again compare results

breed 2nd generation back to original hen or cock

breed 1/2 siblings that are proven winners together

then add NEW PROVEN PIGEON ( not brother or grandson or such crap )

race the children hard again and breed back to original parents

 

P.S. name them after your mothers maiden name !!!!

[Roland]

Get a couple of  pairs, best moree allows and as near the tree as you can. A few others as rearers.

x MOTHERS AND SONS ETC. ETC. AND DON'T race the youngsters.

Do the same with another pair same time. Cross the youngsters.... same each year, Blood kept to breed, crosses to race.

[jimmyxl]

pair winners to winners  does not matter what there are called there must have the winning gene in them  frank sinarter could sing but his brother could not shout coal so only pair the winners together