IS IT FAIR?

[Guest spin cycle]

is it fair to send a team of birds to a race thinking that most of them will not survive.....to my mind its not... but as a relative newcomer to the sport am i just being naive.

[newbold]

if you dont think they will come dont send them as it will cost you more monie in end ,

if you get them reported

[grizzal]

As  mentioned before it will[ cost u] to have them brought back.

And really every bird sent should be sent knowing  they have a chance of winning.

[Guest]

I would not send any bird to a race who was not up to the job, as to do that is very bad managment in my opinion......amanda

[fletch]

We would never send a bird who we did not think could win the race let alone have a chance or ability/fitness to return,

If the birds cant return on there own it will cost alot more to get them back in a courriour.

So it is not fair to send birds to a race that could not return on its own.

Also your choice of word survive is proberbly ment to be return..

[gangster]

im trying 2 read between the lines here....are you implying that either they aint good enough/fit enough or ill..???...if you think they aint good enough they should be gone dont waste your hard earned.......if not fit enough then you need 2 work em ie flagem when out or more trainers.....if ill my own opinion is they are never the same so it would be bye bye time im afraid.....

[Guest]

is it fair to send a team of birds to a race thinking that most of them will not survive.....to my mind its not... but as a relative newcomer to the sport am i just being naive.

 

Well a simple question but one that could be interpreted many ways. I'll take the  way which says there's nowt wrong with the birds but you just don't think they're not good enough. On that line I would say you follow the principal that is regularly stated let the basket be the decider. Unless you test them you'll never find out? As a new starter you won't be sure of you're judgement?  If however you have found in a short time your judgement is right then you can dispose of them.

 

[Guest spin cycle]

i got the 'inspiration' for this thread reading BHW this week. for the purpose of the excersize we can assume the birds are well thought of and have enjoyed the best management....yet still the race 'will be a test that most....will not survive'. i don't want to go into greater depth or trip anybody up. just debate to what extreme we should go to test our birds...whilst still careing for their welfare.

[Guest kev d]

i dont know what you mean by survive . but if there fit and healthy and well trained up

once there in that race basket thats it no turning back . there is loads of things that can go

wrong . hawks, wires, shooting, people getting them in and cutting there rings off , it happened

to me this year one of my nfc birds on a training toss came back after six weeks with no ring on .

[Tony C]

When I read this I Immediately thought of a one loft race (in USA) I read about somewhere else where the final race will be held from 450 miles.  No doubt some young birds will make it but £ to a pinch of salt many wont. I wouldn’t enter a pigeon in such a race if someone else paid my entrance fee.

[mark]

As  mentioned before it will[ cost u] to have them brought back.

And really every bird sent should be sent knowing  they have a chance of winning.

 

and how many people just send hoping they will come.?

[Guest]

some great posts on this rose/albear agree with all they say but i suspect you care very much for your birds and dont want to loose them now i dont mean this to sound wrong but if a fancier does not expect to loose 20/30% of there birds in a year then maybe they shouldnt be racing them and just kep them at home for your enjoyment its got nothing to do with bieng fair!

[thunderboult]

i noticed a few replys that said a bird should'nt be sent if it's not got a chance of winning, i don't think this is the case with birds being built up for the long races, so long as they're fit enough for the job in hand i think that's ok .  also if your just getting started or trying a new strain/family you need to know what their capabilities are so sometimes you may lose them going further than they're capable of.  

[Guest REDFOXKRAUTHS]

if douwt leave them at home even if they lock fit and the weathers tough i would rather save a few back than risk the lot, its not fair on u or the birds

[lawrie]

how do you know a bird can or cant win the race?

[peterpau]

Well I think that is one hell of a question. When I put my birds down the road I reassure myself that I have covered everything, cos I know I have. At BBC Lamballe I said to the flyer next to me in the que, when ever I take mine for marking every body else's birds look better than mine. Tiz how I feel, in reality my bird and his finnished in top 60 his flew against the wind and mine was one of the longest flyers, so we both did well. I never have faith when I basket, but that is me, the birds do relatively well for me. I should be proud of what they have done, but I'm not one for boasting. I'm no national winner but my birds still have to fly 270 mile as young birds and 750 when old eneough. Give 'em a chance they might surprise you.

[bird man of meath]

my father inlaw who had pigeons all his life seen this and was saying u  just know at the start it hard but just watching them u can tell if a bird is right 4 the job. u send hopeing they will not only come back but win it. it like horses 4 corse  but some time thing go wrong and theres nothing u can do .some pigeons are sprinters/middle/longdistance but some just are alrounders no mather what they just get home even if they have 2 walk he says.

[Simeon Turner]

There are times when we ALL send bird(s) knowing full well that it doesn't have much of a chance of winning the race, ~I am not talking about unhealthy birds, but birds that are being prepared for other races later in the season, such as a distance race, I personally would be worried if one of my water birds won from 70 miles, as I would be wondering if it had peaked too soon  

 

I would nevee send an unhealthy bird and anyone that does should be banned - any wonder we have so many losses  ??)

[Guest spin cycle]

i noticed a few replys that said a bird should'nt be sent if it's not got a chance of winning, i don't think this is the case with birds being built up for the long races, so long as they're fit enough for the job in hand i think that's ok .  also if your just getting started or trying a new strain/family you need to know what their capabilities are so sometimes you may lose them going further than they're capable of.  

 

i agree with this...for me  sections of the team are going for different reasons 1/ to win, 2/ to get ready for longer races...i've noticed those birds allways a few mins behind at 125 miles are often 1st back at 300 miles 3/ to go over the ground..as i don't race ybs much my yearlings spend much of their first season 'catching up'. i suppose what i'm really asking is if it can be right to deliberatly test ( ok ybs ) to the extent that you expect 50% + not to survive ?

[jimmy white]

is it fair to send a team of birds to a race thinking that most of them will not survive.....to my mind its not... but as a relative newcomer to the sport am i just being naive.

 

if your going to race pigeons, the sad bit is they wont all survive,  unfortunately.  you should really be   sending them with confidence in the fact that you have gotten them race fit , to the best of your ability,, to lose as less as possible , and hopefully win,,  

[Guest cloudview]

no 1  only fit birds win races

no2 sending knowing that most wont make it is bordering on cruelty

how would any thing including ourselves ,like been taken off the sofa

taken even 10 miles and told to make your ownway home or else

food for thought      try and think pigeon

[Guest IB]

I do not think anyone in their right mind would send birds to a race where the majority were not going to survive.

 

I can understand something unforeseen happening after the strings were cut leading to that, but surely not known before it?

 

However having said that did remark on a curious advert a couple of years ago for a one loft race racing down the Scottish West Coast 'daring' folk to participate. Er no thanks.

 

 

[Guest]

I do not think anyone in their right mind would send birds to a race where the majority were not going to survive.

 

I can understand something unforeseen happening after the strings were cut leading to that, but surely not known before it?

 

However having said that did remark on a curious advert a couple of years ago for a one loft race racing down the Scottish West Coast 'daring' folk to participate. Er no thanks.

 

 

Well I have to say when you enter a bird for Rome or Barcelona to Scotland you know the majority are unlikely to return. Not sure how your definition of survive compares to my term 'unlikely to return'.

[Guest slugmonkey]

Taking yb's to 450 miles and expecting or having less than 50% return is not good, I don't know of any futuritys here that fly 450, there are a couple that fly 400 miles but most of the birds that fly these races come home the thing is most of these are 4 or 5 race series and by the time it gets to the 400 mile station all of the bad birds are lost already so you will notice that most of these longer races get good returns !

I honestly belive on the average day that most YB's are capabable of flying 400 although I dont belive all fanciers are capable of getting birds home from 400 on the day  

[Guest IB]

 

Well I have to say when you enter a bird for Rome or Barcelona to Scotland you know the majority are unlikely to return. Not sure how your definition of survive compares to my term 'unlikely to return'.

 

To me survive = 'live through the event'. I take your point about marathon racing into Scotland, would not attempt it myself, but people like Clockman have, and successfully, so better placed than me to comment