AVIAN FLU

[perk]

just seen on sky news ,a swan found dead near lyon being tested for bird flu, results expected this afternoon

[Guest]

not looking good.

[Guest]

Are most people on here keeping their birds in as a precaution? Ive been letting mine out every morning for the last 2 weeks!

[T_T]

As I understand it, pigeons are not classed as fowl and more than enough evidence has been given and shown, stating that pigeons can't carry or catch the disease.  I understand from the readings I've done that pigeons have been injected with the flu virus and showed no ill effect.  I only hope the powers that be are right.

[perk]

french swan all clear of bird flu

[Guest]

Thats what Ive been told and read aswell T_T, which is why I cant see why the dutch have been told to keep theirs in. Another thing I cant understand is why they show pigeons on the new whilst talking about bird flu!! Thats good new Perk.

[T_T]

I've been letting my pigeons out on a regular basis.  Maybe I'm being a bit short sited but if we can't trust our own vetinary bodies, then who can we trust.?  I intend to carry on as normal.

[Webmaster]

Peter Bryant's Update see: http://www.pigeonbasics.com/news/news264.html

[slatey]

Ihear the dutch government have told fanciers birds to be kept in lofts from 20th February due to the cases in Germany not sure for how long though

 

until 01-04-06 i think

 

 

[Guest]

As I understand it, pigeons are not classed as fowl and more than enough evidence has been given and shown, stating that pigeons can't carry or catch the disease.  I understand from the readings I've done that pigeons have been injected with the flu virus and showed no ill effect.  I only hope the powers that be are right.

 

 

Thats what Ive been told and read aswell T_T, which is why I cant see why the dutch have been told to keep theirs in. Another thing I cant understand is why they show pigeons on the new whilst talking about bird flu!!

 

 

I think most of the fancy are just as confused as you both are. If you refer back to post 460 dated 26th November 2005, there is an awful lot there straight from our pigeon vets; go straight to their conclusion and you'll see where the confusion arose:

 

pigeons are resistant to low pathogenic strains of avian flu. Thats what most of the experiments show; but they CAN be infected with some strains of H5N1, and this is the one that is causing chaos in Asia & Europe.  If you look back a few posts, you'll see that H5N1 has been found in wild pigeons in around 4 countries, the nearest being Turkey, and culls of domestic pigeons have taken place there, one of which was shown on British TV in January, posted here and TV item was also witnessed by 2 others, including webmaster.

[PIGEON_MAN]

french swan all clear of bird flu

 

SEEMS TO BE SOME CONFUSION HERE 6.30 NEWS TONIGHT SAID DUCK IN FRANCH WAS CONFIRMED AS HAVING BIRD FLU.

[Guest]

 

SEEMS TO BE SOME CONFUSION HERE 6.30 NEWS TONIGHT SAID DUCK IN FRANCH WAS CONFIRMED AS HAVING BIRD FLU.

 

 

Heard ITN Channel 3 News item slightly differently - thought it said 'suspected case' and waiting on Weybridge lab results to confirm whether 'deadly strain'. Bloody item was a ten second strap and not repeated with other 'main stories tonight'.

 

Nothing on OIE Website, so can't comment further.

[Guest]

Starting to get angry now that there is still no clear understanding on avian flu and pigeons, given that its now (possibly) on our bloody doorstep. Saw the BHW item published in the letters page last week and got this email off to them on Sunday night. Yet another avian flu item not published. Bloody seething at Peter Bryant as he's on the same email 'vet round robin' that we are AND the vets specifically requested that it be published for the general information of the fancy. They didn't go to all that trouble for their work to gather dust on someone's f*ing shelf.

 

 

Sir,

 

 

While the FCI risk assessment on the transmission of avian influenza by racing pigeons (BHW 10th February) is excellent highlighting pigeons’ special housing and racing arrangements, and could form the basis of an excellent document for official negotiation with national governments, it falls short on scientific credibility. Why? Because the FCI knowledge of avian flu in pigeons isn’t up to date. Peter Bryant is an addressee on the avian flu email round-robin - up to date information collated by some of the world’s leading pigeon vets. Perhaps this information could be communicated to the FCI and also published (in the BHW) as the pigeon vets requested, as this information is intended for all fanciers.

 

In addition to the Hong Kong case (which FCI dismissed) FCI seems unaware that H5N1 has also been found in pigeons in Thailand, Indonesia and Turkey. ITN Channel 3 and 4 evening news on Wednesday 11th January, reporting on the bird flu problems in Turkey, carried footage of live pigeons being removed from a back garden loft and thrown into a large 'bin'. A 'tank-like' machine then shot disinfectant spray into the loft.

 

The FCI risk assessment cites references dating back to 1996, and only two of these are on the H5N1 virus - and FCI dismisses their findings. Since 2003, different arguably more virulent strains of H5N1 virus have presented real challenges. Yet FCI dismisses the unpublished work of David Swayne despite the fact that he worked on H5N1 isolated from dead pigeons in Thailand in 2004 and induced limited infection in pigeons with it in his laboratory. Had FCI really been interested in his work, it could have emailed him, as I did, and he would have provided the data.

 

It seems the FCI only included work which was likely to support its case; hardly a proper risk assessment then as it doesn’t take account of all known information on the subject. Therefore what we have is really a very biased and incomplete scientific assessment rendering the document worthless for its intended purpose … world governments would laugh at us.

 

For information, this is what David Swayne said about avian flu and pigeons:-

 

“It is unlikely that banning pigeons will have any impact on avian flu ecology and will not reduce the risk of infections of poultry or humans. The primary species that have natural infections with avian flu viruses are wild ducks and shorebird (turnstones, gulls, etc.). Columbiformes and passerines are not reservoirs and they are rarely incidental hosts following spill-over of the viruses from infected domestic poultry.

 

Some rebuttal to misinterpretation of my earlier statements.

 

1) My comments in the paragraph above refer to global ecology of Low Pathogenic Avian Influenza (LPAI) viruses, and are not specific to the Asian H5N1 High Pathogenic Avian Influenza (HPAI) virus. This is historically correct - pigeons are resistant to LPAI viruses and have not been involved in the ecology on a world wide basis.

 

2) The banning of racing pigeons in a location that does not have the Asian H5N1, would have no impact of the broad ecology of AI viruses since they are not the natural hosts of wild bird LPAI viruses. This would be predominately some species of wild ducks and shorebirds. This does not mean that pigeons are not susceptible to some AI virus; i.e. Dr. Kaleta's comment on H7 infections. However, surveys of pigeons have shown either no natural infections or rare infections (except with Asian H5N1 HPAI virus where die-offs of pigeons and infections have been identified).

 

3) My research data in pigeons as cited in paragraph 3 above shows that pigeons can be susceptible to the more recent Asian H5N1 HPAI viruses. This was not the case with the 1997 Hong Kong H5N1 HPAI virus where the virus did not grow in pigeons after intranasal inoculation. This would indicate, in geographic areas with new Asian H5N1 HPAI viruses circulating in wild birds or poultry, restricting the flying of pigeons would be prudent for pigeon health and to prevent addition of a new vector of the virus in the specific region. But a world wide ban on flying pigeons is not supported by scientific information on ecology of LPAI viruses.

 

 

Thanks for bringing these misinterpretations to my attention and I would hope you would disseminate my response to other pigeon veterinarians and fanciers.”

 

 

Regards

David E. Swayne, DVM, PhD

Laboratory Director

 

 

The Pigeon Vets Conclusion concerning Avian Influenza and pigeons

 

“If you read all the recent articles, I think there is one conclusion that is important.

 

Although the pigeons are very resistant to LPAI, there is a chance that they can become infected with HPAI, H5N1. This is confirmed by recent research. This means that we have to be careful in this matter concerning any AI outbreak.

 

Pigeons don’t play a very important role in the transmission of the AI, but not important doesn’t mean that they don’t play a role at all!

 

We don’t have to exaggerate the role of the pigeon in this matter at all, but don’t minimise it either!

 

I would like to conclude with the words of my friend Dr. Gordon Chalmers from Canada, which are almost the same as those from Dr. Paul Miller from USA, and also my opinion concerning this very hot item:

 

As pigeon fanciers and pigeon veterinarians, we have to be aware that there are some evidences that pigeons can be infected by the presently active Highly Pathogenic Avian Influenza H5N1.

 

This means that we have to be careful in the local areas in times of infection with that strain!

 

This means that quarantine could be very useful when a country or region is infected to protect against exposure from wild birds that could carry the virus.”

 

 

 

 

Yours,

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PIGEON_MAN]

SEEMS THAT THE CONFLICTING REPORTS ARE STILL HAPPENING,NEWS AT 21.00 SAYS THAT THEY ARE STILL TRYING TO ESTABLISH WEATHER OR NOT THE DUCK FOUND DEAD IN FRANCH AS INFACT GOT BIRD FLU OR NOT.

[perk]

sky news this morning (as reported at time ) said swan being tested for bird flu, results expected in the afternoon ,then they said the swan did not die of bird flu. i,ve just come back from our club, members have said duck being reported to have possable flu on itn & bbc in lyon (can,t they get the facts right for once ) this is scare mongering again (sorry about spelling pickled again) same as bruno about time powers to be understand pigeons are not contract this flu

[Guest]

there so many reports flying about its unbeliveble

[Guest ian snaith]

news at ten said bird flu found in lyon france checking for h5n1 in dead birds .............

[Guest]

There's a bit more on BBC News24 this morning, devoting a bit more time to it and includes interviews with Prof Pennington, virologist, and the President of British Veterinary Association.

 

It's a duck and the news is that the French Government believe that it is almost certainly H5N1.

 

If positive, this will be the 7th EU Country to have an H5N1 outbreak in a just a few weeks. Would expect our UK reference lab (Weybridge) to announce its findings this weekend.

[Guest]

... this is scare mongering again ... same as bruno about time powers to be understand pigeons are not contract this flu

 

Irrespective of whether you believe the evidence posted here that pigeons can get H5N1 my advice is to err on the safe side and behave as if they can. That way, you can't go wrong AND you don't endanger everyone else's birds within 10km of you.

 

 

I hope this advice is seen as what it is ... common sense ... rather than dimissed as scaremongering.

 

[aarden]

just heard that bird flu has reached france

[Guest jason]

I don't know a right lot about avian flu but it can be safely said, there will be no channel races so the damage is already done, on the sticky; avian flu thread , they mention scare mongering but as i've said the damage is already done. :'(

[Guest]

i think we can safley say 99% of chanel racing will be off

[Pompey Mick]

Do we want Channel racing now that avian flu is in the heart of Europe. I would rather keep my birds this side of the Channel thank you. The RPRA should now impose a ban on Channel racing so that we can produce new race programmes to get the best out of what racing we have. The Maltese fanciers have been told by their governing body to confine their birds to their lofts and they were racing from Italy two weeks ago, The situation can change that quickly.

[mark]

the way things are going it might be worth cutting down on breeding young birds this year. living down south the only distance racing you will get is to fly the north road until things change concerning bird flu,

[Guest]

have thought about throwing the eggs that i have and leaving it for this yr