Do pigeons need grit?

[Roland]

Yes use to take molehills home regularly, and spring water, like I previously posted.

I only water day old water that has been left  covered over night to stop creepy crawlies and muck falling in, BUT it has the Containers' lid supported only an inch or two above. to allow the air to take out the floura and  Chora etc.

[drewskitou]

Its hard not to want to feed grit! Lots of fanciers swear by it. Is it natural for them to use/want it?

[timbarra]

sammy, you dead right ,but most on here do not wanna learn anything..

[drewskitou]

I hear ya, I'm learning.....just like to hear what everybody thinks

[Guest]

As is usual, it is quite possible that we are again talking about two different things here.  

 

Are we saying (1) pigeons don't need grit at all?

 

OR

 

Are we saying (2) fanciers don't need to feed additional grit?

 

 

If Sammy and Timbarra are saying (1) then fossil record proves you wrong as the first animals with gizzards were dinosaurs and fossils of these have been found with grit the size of boulders in their gizzards. Nature didn't give birds teeth to chew, it didn't give birds more than one stomach like a cow to ruminate food between them, it gave birds a crop to soak-soften, and a muscular gizzard lined with keratin (the same hard stuff that makes their beak and claws) to withstand the sharp grit & stones that they eat to help grind the food to a pulp so that it can be more easily digested..

 

And as Roland has pointed out, if you don't give pigeons grit, (and even if you do) they'll root about the garden or path or loft floor for their own. The fact that they do this proves they need it, and the only use for it can be for digestion.

 

So (1) is definately wrong, while (2) is probably correct cos they'll find their own supply .. only thing you need to be sure of is that that supply is safe ... and you obviously cannot guarantee the quality of this supply, whereas you can do both with the bought-in stuff.

[Tony C]

Came across this at http://people.eku.edu/ritchisong/RITCHISO//birddigestion.html

 

 

The avian stomach is divided into 2 parts:

 

Proventriculus -  also called the glandular stomach; receives food from the esophagus & secretes mucus, HCl, and

             pepsinogen. Pepsinogen is converted into pepsin (a proteolytic, or protein-digesting, enzyme) by the HCl.

Ventriculus (or gizzard):

the avian equivalent of teeth

very muscular (but less so in birds that eat meat, insects, nectar, and other 'soft' foods)

used primarily to grind & break-up food (such as seeds)

may, in seed-eating birds, contain grit (small stones ingested by the birds to help grind the food)

lined with a tough, abrasive keratin-like layer of koilin, known as the cutica gastrica. Grinding action may, particularly in seed-eating birds, be assisted by grit and stones deliberately ingested.

 

[Guest slugmonkey]

Thought I would bring this one back

[Guest speckled]

;D ;D lol some ones multi tasking ;D ;D ;D ;D or could it be from that readers digest manual lol pmsl ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D speck

[Tony C]

More into Reed Warblers digest  ;D

[Roland]

So deffinately no need for me to grit.... plenty in the garden...

[timbarra]

well i dont feed grit but do as you like, its your money.

[THE FIFER]

all birds have grit bags, if u get a chicken with jiblets u will see the grit bag, its light coloured outside with liver looking colour inside and very tough, when u klean a chicken this bag is full of styones and grit, so its there by nature birds eat grit.

[Guest speckled]

:-/ timbarra, why dont ya feed grit what makes ya birds grind there food down  lol dont tell me ya give them a tooth pick in the bath lol ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Speck :X

[jimmy white]

So deffinately no need for me to grit.... plenty in the garden...

 

i get the impression roland and timbarra are on two differant wave lengths,, roland is saying the birds will find their own grit, so in saying that ,however they get it ,they need it,, but timbarra is saying birds dont need grit at all , which in my opinion is wrong ,,,,i think tony,s  post says it all  

[timbarra]

Pigeons dont need grit, why ? well ask yourself this why do they need it?

do they need it to grind their food down , they are pigeons not windmills. you give your pigeons grit because the next guy gives it and over the years you have been lead to believe they need it . without thinking for yourseleves and doing something different, you just follow the masses and yes lemmings are the same ...

do you people not hink before you do anything because bloke A or B does it. minerals are what pigeons need, stop giving your pigeons grit and see if they look different, NO they dont . find out for yourselves... just see what are you affraid of ? being wrong? well guys pigeon fanciers always wana be right , they are never wrong!!! thats how narrow minded pigeon fanciers in this country are becoming , not all of them but most. because they lack the conviction to think appart from the group and cant admit they are wrong.. well get on with it , live in the dark ages... keep and treat your pigeons as fanciers did in the 1920s ....

 

 

:-/

[Tony C]

You shouldn't be telling people they're wrong! you should be telling Mother nature

[Guest]

Why stop at grit, Timbarra? Why give them a loft, they can live perfectly well outside, might have bovver catching them on race days tho   Why give them food, they can find that outside too. Why minerals [but not grit???] available from food. Why vitamins, also available from food. etc

 

And why put down folks that don't agree with your point of view? Especially when your own point of view on grit has been shown here to be wrong.   what are you affraid of ? being wrong?

[Guest Paulo]

Why stop at grit, Timbarra? Why give them a loft, they can live perfectly well outside, might have bovver catching them on race days tho   Why give them food, they can find that outside too. Why minerals [but not grit???] available from food. Why vitamins, also available from food. etc

 

And why put down folks that don't agree with your point of view? Especially when your own point of view on grit has been shown here to be wrong.   what are you affraid of ? being wrong?

 

quality

[Wiley]

For an animal to use food as fuel, it must digest the food - break it down small enough to be absorbed into the bloodstream - and get rid of the waste products. A bird's gut looks much like your own, but there are some differences. Many seed and grain-eating birds have a crop connected to the esophagus. The expandable crop allows birds to quickly gather and store a large amount of food, then retreat to safety to digest it. bird has two stomachs (we have one) to digest its food in record time. In four hours, a Spur-winged Goose can digest the same meal that it takes a rabbit 24 hours to digest. In the upper stomach, the proventriculus, food is broken down with digestive enzymes.The lower stomach, the ventriculus, or gizzard, is a tough, muscular organ which crushes and grinds up the food, just like our teeth do for us. Remember a bird has no teeth, so it swallows food whole. Birds that eat plants and seeds have more powerful gizzards than meat and fish eaters. Many birds swallow grit or gravel to help the gizzard break down food.

 

 

 

 

[timbarra]

look I do not mean to upset people , if so  i apologise but come on guys all I am saying is stop feeding grit and see, also it is basically a stone , how many long distance runners do you see eating peebles before a race, its wieght your hadicapping your birds before they start, minerals and elementls are more important than vitamins. the list of importance is as follows.

1. elementals and minerals

2. electrolites and vitamins

but this must be acompanied by good clean water and solid diet,

with good hygiene levels, pigeons only eat grit because they are after the salt in it.. wash some grit and do this 6 or 7 times then let it dry , your pigeons wont touch it, if you disagree give me a reason to disagree , not oh i have always fed grit so they must need it. they dont they want the salt !!!

 

so regular electrolites when rearing and minerals will supply enough sodium chloride and without the expense and hadicapping of your birds by using grit,  and thinking that they need it to grind up the corn is silly, if an old man loses he's teeth does he have to eat apot of grit a day to help him digest his food , because he has no teeth. guys  i think your not thinking but are stuck in thought that because its been fed for a hundred years its gotta be right.

:-/ :-/

[Wiley]

look I do not mean to upset people , if so  i apologise but come on guys all I am saying is stop feeding grit and see, also it is basically a stone , how many long distance runners do you see eating peebles before a race, its wieght your hadicapping your birds before they start, minerals and elementls are more important than vitamins. the list of importance is as follows.

1. elementals and minerals

2. electrolites and vitamins

but this must be acompanied by good clean water and solid diet,

with good hygiene levels, pigeons only eat grit because they are after the salt in it.. wash some grit and do this 6 or 7 times then let it dry , your pigeons wont touch it, if you disagree give me a reason to disagree , not oh i have always fed grit so they must need it. they dont they want the salt !!!

 

so regular electrolites when rearing and minerals will supply enough sodium chloride and without the expense and hadicapping of your birds by using grit,  and thinking that they need it to grind up the corn is silly, if an old man loses he's teeth does he have to eat apot of grit a day to help him digest his food , because he has no teeth. guys  i think your not thinking but are stuck in thought that because its been fed for a hundred years its gotta be right.

:-/ :-/

 

sorry timbarra, i think your doing what so many people seem to do with pigeons, and that is comparing them to the human race, were two different species, with different digestive systems and many different differences!

 

 

[timbarra]

wiley wiley wiley, yes your right we 2 different species , thats why pigeons are happy to get along with life and us humans are slowly destroying the planet we live on...!!! who stupid, well people may just be that mate :-/

[Roland]

Why stop at grit, Timbarra? Why give them a loft, they can live perfectly well outside, might have bovver catching them on race days tho   Why give them food, they can find that outside too. Why minerals [but not grit???] available from food. Why vitamins, also available from food. etc

 

Actually Bruno that is the very point, and if I could fly them to the tree like I would!

A big avairy with just nest boxes to shelter in in winter is fine in fact.

Knew of a greayt National winner that liturally flew to Nest boxes on posts in a circle as I posted be before! Healthy conditioned birds have all the other needs naturally like Motivation for instance. And as they thrive on company and pecking orders ther natually provide their own healthy and natual mpotivation.

It is for OUR peace of mind, our management and our benefit that they are systemised surely! Indeed I'd say that 90% thing that many do and buy is FOR their own benefit and is utterly gabbage fo the birds.

Best flyers I've known, and the top fly in our fed is pretty much just fresh water and clean feed... yes he does provide a different mixture throughout the week.... but then he knows where and what they will be doing!

 

 

[timbarra]

;D ;D ;Dyes i agree roland good sound food and plain water with a little supplement of calcium or vitamin every 3 - 4 weeks if needed, my mixture is energy plus and has added pellet in small amount which helps but thats it mate, you hit nail on the head, and some people on here use to much additives.  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

[Guest]

I've tried a variety of grits over the years,seem to throw more away than they actually eat,think I only give it them to make me feel better.They much prefer the breeze blocks in the averies ;D ;D ;D ;D