first of all vic, i admire your wit,, pmsl scottish strain -flying scotsman ;D ;D ,,and the milk ;D ;D ;D,,, but as your post suggests it is an interesting subject,,,but keep chipping the baskets though ;D wood chips not any other kind [im sure my 24 stone mate , hope he doesnt see this puts another kind of chips in the baskets] [he hides his chips , hes an eataholic ;D] over the last 15-20 years yb losses have steadily got worse , my opinion first is were now breeding birds with less constitution, mollycoddling them, medicating them willy nilly,,,but maybe this is just one pointer to the horrendous slaughter of the innocents each year now, it does make you wonder at times,whats going through the air , with this modern technology ,its a pity the scientists [im just an amatuer one ;D] could not get together WITH the pigeon fliers and go into many different things , the losses were still gong up b4 the ets [Every one Trying Something] but proof , is the word,, and we have none