dont worry dave as long as there droppings are fine and there not fat like pigs,,i scared mine when i first started up cos i was like you wanted to see them fly,,big mistake ,,i lost 15 out ot the 30 i had,,must of hit another batch,,maybe trainners,,they will go when there ready m8 trust me,,if you keep scaring them they will land down the street were you carnt reach them,,i no ive been there,,,my m8 paired up the same time as me,,is are going for 1/2 hour,,mine havent even took up yet,,different pigeons,,area,,and fancier,,,and food some times....atb ..mark...