roller x tippler

[tipplerboy]

has any one done this ,do they fly higher and longer and still roll?

[bewted]

no,,,not as much,as your taking out the rolling bit by adding the tippler and vice versa !!!

 

 

cross breeds seldom achieve,if ever,the same as purebreeds !!

 

rollers are bred to roll,,,tipplers are bred to tipple,,,each has there own trait in life !!!

[bewted]

thats just the basic answer with out going into all the main details of why,where,when,how,if,buts etcetc

[tippler1]

thay dont roll thay ride there tails

[Guest mikkey]

tipplers dont tipple it was bred out of them years ago......they are long flying birds the top ones will fly over 20 hours

[Roland]

Forget the mix...  done it  -, like every one else in the 50's Can't sell the youngster, or give them away!  i mean JUST what does one hope to achieve etc. Just a sorry waste...!

Why! Just why would any one want to buy  misfits that don't do one or the other, and certainly nothing like either and more CERTAIN nothing as good, let alone better than what the 'Strain intended. We have all been there and 'Done it'... waste of time, But I feel you ill have to try for yourselk etc.  ... to no avail!

I

[tipplerboy]

ok i just askin as im new to pigeons

[lofty]

Although I agree with whats been said already

There are times when crosses are needed

For instance If I wanted to improve a strain of West of England Tumblers that had been kept for showing and lost some flying ability then I would be looking to Rollers and Tipplers to improve stamina and tumbling ability.

Unfortunately once you mix breeds the genetic makeup/ traits become unstable and you will end up with a mix of allsorts -the only thing to do then is fly them and select birds that have what you are looking for to breed from.

Eventually you will end up with a family of birds that look simillar and fly in a particular style

That is how all breeds come about -adding the characteristics wanted and then nurturing them in future generations.

But as has been mentioned, before for every bird that has what your looking for there will be many more that won't.

At the moment I have a WEFT paired up to a Paki Highflyer -if the resultant young show good flying ability then I will paired them back to WEFTS (some characteristics I want are present in both birds already IE pearl eye, feathered legs etc. But I will keep very good records For if I need to 'unravel' things in future.

Horseman pouters are another good example.- Norwich Croppers  crossed with Homers etc and bred back to croppers to produce the Horseman. This  improves the flying and homing ability of the Croppers but preserves, even enhances the 'Theivng' traits!

Lofty

 

[Leroy]

Although I agree with whats been said already

There are times when crosses are needed

For instance If I wanted to improve a strain of West of England Tumblers that had been kept for showing and lost some flying ability then I would be looking to Rollers and Tipplers to improve stamina and tumbling ability.

Unfortunately once you mix breeds the genetic makeup/ traits become unstable and you will end up with a mix of allsorts -the only thing to do then is fly them and select birds that have what you are looking for to breed from.

Eventually you will end up with a family of birds that look simillar and fly in a particular style

That is how all breeds come about -adding the characteristics wanted and then nurturing them in future generations.

But as has been mentioned, before for every bird that has what your looking for there will be many more that won't.

At the moment I have a WEFT paired up to a Paki Highflyer -if the resultant young show good flying ability then I will paired them back to WEFTS (some characteristics I want are present in both birds already IE pearl eye, feathered legs etc. But I will keep very good records For if I need to 'unravel' things in future.

Horseman pouters are another good example.- Norwich Croppers  crossed with Homers etc and bred back to croppers to produce the Horseman. This  improves the flying and homing ability of the Croppers but preserves, even enhances the 'Theivng' traits!

Lofty

 

what lofty says has me thinking about how many generations it would take for the WEFTs to be as pure as  possible again after the initial cross???

 

i read an article years ago on dog breeding, where a boxer breeder in anticipation of a ban on docking dogs tails tried to cross his boxers to a corgi - because apparently corgis have a geneticly bobbed tail. after the initial litter he selected only those dogs with a bob tail and crossed them back to boxers. It only took 6 generations i think before he could register the crossed pups as pure boxers. Cant remember if the bob tail experiment was succesful, but thought it amazing that it only took 6 generations for the breed to become pure again. Any thouhts on pigeons?

 

Lee

[DOVEScot]

 

what lofty says has me thinking about how many generations it would take for the WEFTs to be as pure as  possible again after the initial cross???

 

i read an article years ago on dog breeding, where a boxer breeder in anticipation of a ban on docking dogs tails tried to cross his boxers to a corgi - because apparently corgis have a geneticly bobbed tail. after the initial litter he selected only those dogs with a bob tail and crossed them back to boxers. It only took 6 generations i think before he could register the crossed pups as pure boxers. Cant remember if the bob tail experiment was succesful, but thought it amazing that it only took 6 generations for the breed to become pure again. Any thouhts on pigeons?

 

Lee

 

I know a well known breeder of exhibition fantails 'J McCallum" who introduces hew colours into his stock, he says that as long as they fit the standards laid down then it is an exhibition fantail

The same can be said for any breeding, how can it be a pure bred boxer if it has corgi in it's genetics, or is it that there is not such a thing as a pure bred just a breed standard set by us humans

[Steve0]

You dont want your rollers flyin any longer than 50 mins max 40 mins better.

Steve0...

[Leroy]

 

I know a well known breeder of exhibition fantails 'J McCallum" who introduces hew colours into his stock, he says that as long as they fit the standards laid down then it is an exhibition fantail

The same can be said for any breeding, how can it be a pure bred boxer if it has corgi in it's genetics, or is it that there is not such a thing as a pure bred just a breed standard set by us humans

 

dont know mate, presumably it isnt a pure bred boxer, but after 6 gens of breeding to pure boxer, the pups were so genetically similar that they could be registered as such.

[lofty]

When it produces young that resemble itself

IE when they are able to replicate themselves with only minor differences

can you say something is pure bred

untill that point a bird (or anything else) can look very much like the real thing

at face value but can be carrying all manner of genetic mixes.

Lofty

[DOVEScot]

 

dont know mate, presumably it isnt a pure bred boxer, but after 6 gens of breeding to pure boxer, the pups were so genetically similar that they could be registered as such.

 

I thing they are cosmetically simillar nothing to do with genetics or pure bredding, as long as they fit the breed standard they are accepted, hence all countries have different standards, the funny one for me is the AMERICAN STAFFORD BULL TERRIER, what is it American or English but needless to say it is a lot bigger, just like everything American :)

We have the same in pigeons Show Racers and American Show Racers :-/ :-/ :-/